2019-20 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating | Page 673 | Golden Skate

2019-20 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating

I don't know who is the best we had "the best ever thread" and still there were a lot of opinions who is the best. By scores yes maybe they are good, it doesn't matter much. I will check what will happen to the next GPs and then I will make my conclusions. For me, Kaori, Young You, Rika, Bradie are very good skaters, on par with the Russians on their "objective" or objective quality of skating. But you have to deliver as well.

Of the current crop I'd say the Russian ladies are the best and likely to be the dominant force moving forward into at least 2022. My favourite skater right now is Alena but I was actually very impressed with how Zagitova has grown as performer. I do think it is healthy for the sport to have good competition from all over so I hope the Japanese, Korean and American ladies can also rise to the occasion. May the best lady win.
 
They dont get paid for all the verbal abuse they get and volunteer to do it? Good lord they're crazier than any fan lol xD
 
Judges are independent from ISU, aren’t they? They aren’t paid, they’re not ‚hired‘ they’re volunteers.

I have run two separate volunteer groups. You can get fired from them (we had to fire 2 leaders and remove a parent volunteer). We also provided evaluations and critiques on a regular basis to help improve performance and answer any questions they might have on how to improve. Also we encouraged and paid for training. Just because you are not paid does not mean you do not have rules you do not work under and that you are not answerable to anyone.
 
Indeed

I have worked for charities as an unpaid volunteer, I had to work to the same standard as a paid employee would. Or I'd be replaced
 
Volvo Cup in the seniors just concluded:
1st Viktoriya Safonova, BLR, 181.88 2 1
2nd Yekaterina Ryabova, AZE, 178.23 3 2
3rd Alina Urushadze, GEO, 163.83 4 3
4th Emmi Peltonen, FIN, 158.40 1 9
5th Lara Gutmann, ITA, 152.86 5 5
 
I have run two separate volunteer groups. You can get fired from them (we had to fire 2 leaders and remove a parent volunteer). We also provided evaluations and critiques on a regular basis to help improve performance and answer any questions they might have on how to improve. Also we encouraged and paid for training. Just because you are not paid does not mean you do not have rules you do not work under and that you are not answerable to anyone.

True, however, then those things are discussed on their annual ISU meetings, or would you say it’s solved by sending a simple e-Mail?
 
Volvo Cup in the seniors just concluded:
1st Viktoriya Safonova, BLR, 181.88 2 1
2nd Yekaterina Ryabova, AZE, 178.23 3 2
3rd Alina Urushadze, GEO, 163.83 4 3
4th Emmi Peltonen, FIN, 158.40 1 9
5th Lara Gutmann, ITA, 152.86 5 5

Oh... were any Russian seniors there?

Sinitsyna won Juniors didn't she?
 
Yes. But pretending there was nothing to deduct and that theres a massive conspiracy is going too far
true. No massive conspiracy. The key word is massive. ;)

There’s always some sort of excuse why panel does a very weird selective calling. It just shouldn’t be there in the first place. And Satoko had more URs than those that were called, imo. And her edges too.
Somehow, it now looks like we have different standards for execution for different skaters. Some can still get away with things, while others are hammered for things they don’t even have (I.e. Zagitova’s ‘e’ call). That’s an absurd situation to be in.
that's what I hate about it different standards for different skaters.
Absolutely. Go Anna! :rock:

Still ... I for one am not all that disappointed. She got 226 at Cup of China and 227 at Skate America. That's not bad. Only Trusova, Kostonaia and Kihira have higher scores this season. Anna will be be fine at the Grand Prix Finals. :yes:
it just seems like the way Sasha has been scored this year and Alena too and especially the way Sasha and Alina were scored in Japan that Annas scores should have been higher thsn they were in her to Grand Prix events. is it nitpicking on my part and some people's parts to complain about Anna scores? Probably. But I'm pretty sure everyone here is a nitpicker. ;)
And herein lies the problem that suddenly popped up after Trusova's world record skating runs: all of a sudden ISU tech callers and judges got strict ...

If they'd been strict right from the start of season, also in those Challenger Series, none of these conspiracy discussions would have happened. For now, lets wait for Rostelekom GP and see how calling and judging goes in Moscow, in the lion's mouth.
Agreed. The judges inconsistency has caused some issues this season. The Japan open scores were unbelievably high and I think people got used to that and when they see great skates like Anna's they naturally think it should be higher than 226.
 
You all have been asked multiple times to knock it off with the conspiracy posts.

Even if you hadn't please note: It is boring to the vast majority of users here.

Also it clogs up this very busy thread.

Inconsistencies in edge and UR calls happen to all skaters. We have had threads about it (many of them). One could use the search feature and find one of them and add to that thread rather than pontificate in this one.

Maybe they happen, but I doubt it was in such amount ever two weeks continuosly and in the middle of the season.

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I don't think that it is a conspiracy theory just to wonder about such sudden change, also I don't think that calling about conspiracy theories whenever somebody disagrees with the calls is not the best (group) reaction how to deal with the opposite opinion. Esp. when there is paralell thread full of claims about Alina Zagitova's PCS score "so high only because she is OGM". If I had to choose, than I would call conspiracy theory rather this. We can discuss about edges, exchange videos and gifs, there is something to discuss. About PCS there is nothing like "here is my argument for this claim", it's just the claim. Anybody can say it if he thinks so, but the reactions to those different claims are completely different. Also, when tech panel does according to the opinion of the those who see flat edges behind every straw, it is "composed of the professionals". While weren't the tech panels who were allegedly overlooking bad edges in the past composed of professionals as well? Either they were wrong previously or now.

Whe people claim "but Satoko got numerous UR calls, so no bias", I say it's wrong comparison. Satoko's UR calls didn't come out of the blue in CoC, she's received them throughout her whole career. And her jumps are objectively very small though she is rotating fast so often she rotates properly (just over the 3/4 border). But not the same twist as 5 lutzes clean once and 5 lutzes "!" three weeks later. Again, the argument is "but you can't compare two different competitions" (while still comparing someone's SB with the other from different event :) ). But if calls shgould serve as a note to skater what should be done better, on what he/she should work, that giving two completely opposite signals is not good not just for the skater but for figure skating as a sport. There is a rule that when one judge gives too different goe to an element from the others, he has to explain this. I think similar rule should be applied to when some tech panel/panel of the judges differs so much from the others in such short time.

As for my opinion on Anna's FS in CoC, I am willing to mark her first 4Lz as !, while when landed, the blade crossed 3/4 border of the last turn to me. So this shouldn't be called as UR IMO. Second quad, well, if Satoko's Lz is "very slightly outside" :), than this one is slightly outside (note: slightly outside is more than very slightly outside :) ). The rest, combo 3Lz can't be seen properly to me from any angle, the last one to me is "slightly outside as well.
 
True, however, then those things are discussed on their annual ISU meetings, or would you say it’s solved by sending a simple e-Mail?

Judges have Round table discussions after each competition, which you can see on the time tables for each competition. They are usually right before the gala and they have a discussion for each discipline. They discuss the results of the competitions and in case their scores are questioned by others they have the opportunity to give reasons for the scores e.g. GOEs they gave.
https://www.isu.org/figure-skating/...FjACegQIARAB&usg=AOvVaw3vqxiYi1jMTXzOxOdyunl7
 
It's not like Russia is lacking in ladies to send to a close by competition like this one was.

I wondered about this too. Perhaps the skaters have to pay their own way, and when there isn't a lot of prize money to be won, don't really bother?
 
As best as I could see from the available camera angles, her edges were flat at best.
Her full blade assisted prerotation on 4Lz in particular doesn't really bother me much, she's hardly the only one using such techniques. I just worry she won't be able to sustain her jumps that way in the future. Much like Zhenya struggled with her technique and is now trying her best to revamp it.
 
There is a difference between "wuzrobbing" and "conspiracies".

We all do "wuzrobbing". My fav skater didn't the right call, her direct opponent got an easy call. She didn't finish where she should have. Unfair, I tell you, unfair:ddevil:

Conspiracy is trying to explain that through personal bias or vendetta, bias against a country, bias against a skater, without direct proof. And proof is *not* aha, the judge did X, Y, Z in the past, or the judge is from such and such a country or is such and such a skater's coach's uncle's mail person. Please:biggrin:

Trying to couch a conspiracy theory under oh, I'm just trying to figure it out, doesn't stop it from being a conspiracy theory. No, it's still a conspiracy theory, because there's nothing to figure out:laugh: You think the judge made a bad call, and maybe they did. See point A: "wuzzrobbing".

And so it goes.....
 
your postl.

And I really wasn't saying it wasn't discussion worthy. It probably needs it's own thread. I'm all for discussing edge and UR calls in it's own thread if people can be polite about it. We have had such threads and we will have them again. Accusing the ISU of being anti a certain country is not helpful or provable and Golden Skate has rules about conspiracy theories.

I love Satoko. I acknowledge she has major jump issues. If Satoko could jump like Alexandra I would be a very happy camper indeed. But alas.

When I saw Anna skate I didn't see the edge problem but then I never see edge problems. I admire those of you that do see them in real time. I do not. I also didn't see the UR in real time. I didn't watch the slow mo replay because I was doing other things at the time. I knew she had done what she needed to do to win and was impressed with her keeping it together and skating well. Anna should be happy and proud of herself.
 
Judges have Round table discussions after each competition, which you can see on the time tables for each competition. They are usually right before the gala and they have a discussion for each discipline. They discuss the results of the competitions and in case their scores are questioned by others they have the opportunity to give reasons for the scores e.g. GOEs they gave.
https://www.isu.org/figure-skating/...FjACegQIARAB&usg=AOvVaw3vqxiYi1jMTXzOxOdyunl7

This round table is only relevant for the judges present at the specific event, but doesn’t seem to have any effect on judges on subsequent events. If the results of round tables, specifically decisions of tech team, are forwarded to the team judging the subsequent event, then please provide the isu document proving that :)
 
That's what confused me, you would think it would be good experience for some of them

Sinitsyna just competed at her best in JGP and made the finals. AFAIK, no new program content was shown in Riga, so no need to calibrate her program content.
But some behavioural issues suddenly became visible. Still don't know what to make of those.

As for Shabotova, no new content IIRC, but perhaps Anastasiya was indeed looking for some competitive experience and confirmation since switching to UKR fed.
 
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