- Joined
- Mar 20, 2019
Rubbish. You should look at her Lutz in GPF free-skate. It was clear outside edge.
2019-20 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating
- Thread starter Spirals for Miles
- Start date
Rubbish. You should look at her Lutz in GPF free-skate. It was clear outside edge.
Knowing how Anna and Sasha scored, I was expecting Alyona to score in the high 88's. Therefore, I will agree that they went a bit overboard with a high 89, but it's hardly bonkers for a nationals score. She won't get this score internationally, but I'm not sure Sasha would receive nearly 35 in PCS internationally yet either. And a 36 for Anna before she has won any major international competitions is also generous and not likely to happen yet. SO rather than pinpoint Alyona's score and call it crazy, just chalk it up to inflated nationals scores where all three got boosts. Sure, Alyona got more of a boost, but that's to be expected given her status right now.
Anna and Sasha both received PCS boosts, so Alyona was definitely going to get the same - and I knew to expect even more of a boost for her because a) she has momentum going, b) winners get reputation boosts, and c) with Alina gone, they no longer had a PCS ceiling for Alyona. That's how this game works.
She already scored 85.45 at the GPF. Her PCS would rise ~2 pts now that she is Russia's de facto top lady. Her 3A has never been better too, so the GOE was going to be insane on that as well. From these two factors alone, she gets roughly 3 pts. Sprinkle in a better performance and a nationals panel - GOE goes up as well.
Maybe Anna should've received more generous GOE, but she's nearly maxed out already. They weren't going to launch her from 33-34 international PCS to a 38 all of a sudden. Her GPF performance was nearly scored perfectly, so GOE boosting would only do so much here. An 83 SP score is not going to happen for her until she gets the reputation of Alina or wins everything. 81-82 is just about her ceiling til then.
Anna and Sasha both received PCS boosts, so Alyona was definitely going to get the same - and I knew to expect even more of a boost for her because a) she has momentum going, b) winners get reputation boosts, and c) with Alina gone, they no longer had a PCS ceiling for Alyona. That's how this game works.
She already scored 85.45 at the GPF. Her PCS would rise ~2 pts now that she is Russia's de facto top lady. Her 3A has never been better too, so the GOE was going to be insane on that as well. From these two factors alone, she gets roughly 3 pts. Sprinkle in a better performance and a nationals panel - GOE goes up as well.
Maybe Anna should've received more generous GOE, but she's nearly maxed out already. They weren't going to launch her from 33-34 international PCS to a 38 all of a sudden. Her GPF performance was nearly scored perfectly, so GOE boosting would only do so much here. An 83 SP score is not going to happen for her until she gets the reputation of Alina or wins everything. 81-82 is just about her ceiling til then.
- Joined
- Jul 28, 2018
Alina's Olympic SP was one of the most perfect sp's, in my opinion better than Alena's Angel SP, and it only received a 82.
To change the topic......
I have a question: a triple flip or a triple lutz is worth about 6 or 7 points, right? (I might be wrong) If you get an edge call on a 3lutz or 3f, how many points do you end up getting? 3 points?
I’m curious because a skater would get more points for a clean 3loop, right?
You're absolutely right. An edge call gets you only 80% of the BV plus lesser GOE. You can easily compare Guliakova and Frolova here.
Guliakova got 3.91 for her Lutz with an edge call = 80% BV and -20% GOE.
Frolova got 5.95 for her Loop with positive GOE around +20%.
Had Guliakova not had that e call for the Lutz, her score with +20% GOE would have been around 7.10 points. So she lost a little over 3 points.
Yes, I think it's difficult to compare scores when 1 of the 3 was doing her most difficult element and the others were unable to do that; if you take away the triple axel points in the SP for Kostornaia then Anna is much closer. I do think that Kostornaia got additional inflation but that was due to her doing the ultra-c elements; let's wait for the FS when Anna and Trusova do their ultra-c elements and we see what their scores are before we start screaming conspiracy.
Nationals inflation is a thing, it happens everywhere and the only reason that Russia gets more pronounced is because the skaters at the top are doing extremely high point value moves/layouts. Overall of the skates I was able to see (that whole gotta work situation prevented me from watching the whole thing) of the top ladies I don't have a complaint about the placements. I agree with what some others say that it seems like everyone but Anna got generous nationals inflation and she's the reigning national champion.
My issue with Kostornaia's skating is that with the exception of the 30ish seconds of Muse music in her FS, you can put any lyrical piano music to her performances and it would fit just fine, given that I think her interpretation mark is too high.
- Joined
- Feb 12, 2014
Anna was amazing, consistently as good as GPF...and she got her highest score in SP ever.
But Alyona was superior not just to Anna but to her own previous best. In several areas, they seem small and insignificant but they all add up.
But Alyona was superior not just to Anna but to her own previous best. In several areas, they seem small and insignificant but they all add up.
- Joined
- Feb 12, 2014
Alyona gains a whopping nearly 7 points on her 3A so there is your difference I guess?
- Joined
- Feb 25, 2014
I don't know if I would call that a weakness of interpretation, but a weakness of what's seen as acceptable music for figure skating programs. I don't think this is true of just her either, and I wouldn't say that's true of her Adios Nonino program.
- Joined
- Mar 20, 2019
In your opinion is the buzzword. Aliona has a 3A or did you forget? I can easily say I thought Evgenia's Olympic SP was one of the most perfect SPs, but it is silly not to factor in Alina's higher BV.
- Joined
- Nov 20, 2018
Alena was waaay off her music at GPF. She said in an interview, that after she skated her coaches even TOLD her not to expect a huge score because of that.
GPF: https://youtu.be/hAJf7zc6S_8
Nationals: https://youtu.be/EZH2iEaFv9I
Big difference in timing.
- Joined
- Feb 12, 2014
Alyona shows a decent amount of diversity in music and program styles.
Her Twilight FS is not everyone's cup of tea in terms of theme but she sells it because it is very obvious she loves it. She shows her personality and her fun side. Whereas her SP is calm, angelic and soft.
Her Twilight FS is not everyone's cup of tea in terms of theme but she sells it because it is very obvious she loves it. She shows her personality and her fun side. Whereas her SP is calm, angelic and soft.
*Sigh*
I don't think some people understand how big of an increase 4-5 points actually is in a sp, where everyone is limited to what they can do. She already had the highest score ever recorded at 85, and now she increased it by nearly 5 points. I know this score doesn't officially count, but that isn't the point.
Had she increased her score by only 1 point, it would be a huge achievement already. 4-5 points is absurd and it takes away the seriousness of the competition and is a slap in the face to Anna and Sasha, who all deserve a fair chance to win.
I don't think some people understand how big of an increase 4-5 points actually is in a sp, where everyone is limited to what they can do. She already had the highest score ever recorded at 85, and now she increased it by nearly 5 points. I know this score doesn't officially count, but that isn't the point.
Had she increased her score by only 1 point, it would be a huge achievement already. 4-5 points is absurd and it takes away the seriousness of the competition and is a slap in the face to Anna and Sasha, who all deserve a fair chance to win.
- Joined
- Mar 20, 2019
The funny part is that it was definitely in Aliona's mind because she finished early this time.
- Joined
- Jan 19, 2005
I agree that Alina's Olympic SP was magnificent.
One of my favorite SP's of all time.
But she did not have a triple axel.
And the scoring system has changed since then.
So I'd just like to remember that SP as having the best score ever under that particular scoring system.
Besides, I think if Alina had skated like that at Russian Nationals in 2017, the score would have been even higher.
- Joined
- Nov 20, 2018
You are very clearly attacking Alena’s character. Not only did you call her a “real-life prima donna,” but you also made a big point of emphasising how “humble,” “down-to-earth,” and “classy” Anna and Sasha are. As soon as you make a personal attack the rest of your arguments lose merit. You are biased.
- Joined
- Jul 28, 2018
Actually the difference in their base values was only 2.70 points. So I still don't see how this 90 was fair scoring.
With all this winner's bashing on Alyona's score, I will find it extra funny when Anna swoops in for her back-to-back senior national championship title. Alyona's nearly maxed out with her triples (axels included). Anna's 4Lz's have been super secure, and I have no doubt she worked extra hard on that 4F after GPF. Just landing that extra jump (along with her 4Lz's) will earn her the victory. Unless she gets underscored heavily (which isn't likely given how she was scored in the SP), she can really pull this out. Obviously Sasha can still pull out a victory, but she has yet to show she's capable of landing them all. If she can in the FS, she will deserve her victory. All Alyona can do is skate perfectly and hope those quads don't all land.
- Joined
- Sep 8, 2016
Thanks.
So, why are Sakhanovich and Guliakova and others continuing to do a jump in the short program with the wrong edge? Do their coaches tell them to? Is the edge correct in practice? Does it give a bad impression to the judges if you do an easier 3loop in the sp?
- Joined
- Apr 8, 2018
Would it have been fair to hold down Aliona after the short(which is her strength by far) so that Sasha and Anya can have a "fair" shot in the free(which is by far their strength over Alionas) so that they can win? Seems a little biased to me
- Joined
- Jun 25, 2018
First of all you just admitted that Alena has bad musicality at times. Anna has never been off of her music. And second, you're saying better timing translates to 4 higher points?!? In a short program...where she was already sitting at an 85 as she had the exact same performance at GPF with maybe a slightly tighter 3A?! Still absurd.
