2020-21 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating

[Amei]

Aliona's PCS Scoring in SP

COMPETITION	PCS	SS	TR	PE	CO	IN
Rus Nat 2020	38.31	9.54	9.46	9.68	9.64	9.57
EU 2020	36.02	9.18	8.68	9.14	8.96	9.07
Today	36.04	9.05	8.90	9.10	9.05	8.95

Looks like there was an international panel today.
All that while some other girls are scoring in this competition better that they ever had even with a domestic panel (meaning it's not true that judges are strict)

Now: i want you to leave skaters comparisons aside and concentrate on Aliona SS.
Skating skill is a very specific PCS category (you can see a definition Here )
It's execution of basic skills close to perfection but you either have flow or not, you either know how to accelerate effortlessy with you crossover or no, you either go deep with your age and turn with perfect flawless footwork or not.

9.54 vs 9.05 is over 5% difference or 2 steps in the voting scale that goes in .25 increments.
The same panel who judged her the best in the world in basic skills 10 months agois now looking at an awkard skater.
This does not make sense to me.

Well you are are also comparing her first competition with this program vs. Russian Nationals last year which was her 4th time that season doing that SP. I felt her skating was a little sluggish and like there was more 2 foot crossover skating compared to her SP last year.

While she took a hit in SS, her bigger hits were in Composition, Interpretation and Performance. Kostornaia may love the pop music, but that music may not be the best fit towards her style of skating. But this is her first time performing it in a competition setting so I don't think this time to hit the panic button.

 

[Amei]

Thought Sasha's spins looked great today. Never really noticed them one way or another in the past, but they stood out to me today and I was impressed. Good for her for the level 4 on her steps too, hopefully she can consistently hit that because those are easy points she needs.

Was a little surprised by Alyona's PCS, was expecting all 9s for her. And along with others, I'm not happy with the GOE on the combo, if it was a different skater they would've gotten many minuses across the board. Sasha lost a decent amount of GOE on her 3A stepout, as expected, so I'm not sure why Alyona's wasn't comparable.

Anyways, its nice to see the top skaters so tight, unlike in some of the other events. Makes for an entertaining fight tomorrow, though I think its Sasha's to lose and I have a strong feeling she is going to skate clean.

Regarding the step-out, while I dislike positive GOE for an obvious mistake and don't think Kostornaia should have been given the GOE she got; playing a bit of devil's advocate: Kostornaia covered up her step-out and it didn't seem as disruptive to her program vs. Trusova's.

 

[Fluture]

Well you are are also comparing her first competition with this program vs. Russian Nationals last year which was her 4th time that season doing that SP.

Well, the same is true for someone like Anna and yet her PCS rose by more than a full point even though her SP at RusNats was (understandably!) way more refined and just a better program overall in terms of structure and choreography. I think Aliona‘s PCS were fair today if national inflation is taken into consideration. But your argument simply makes no sense when we look at the way others were scored this season already.

 

[JazzUp]

but she really owed her SP today

Maya was the only one to get an ovation from the audience in Kazan'.

 

[McBibus]

Well you are are also comparing her first competition with this program vs. Russian Nationals last year which was her 4th time that season doing that SP. I felt her skating was a little sluggish and like there was more 2 foot crossover skating compared to her SP last year.

While she took a hit in SS, her bigger hits were in Composition, Interpretation and Performance. Kostornaia may love the pop music, but that music may not be the best fit towards her style of skating. But this is her first time performing it in a competition setting so I don't think this time to hit the panic button.

that's why I did concentrate on SS.
Also coreo is different and new and judging ice coverage in TV is almost impossibile cose the camera is always close on the skater.
Anyway the -0.5 is constant in every category and I will add this to my personal opinion that judges did not really assign votes per categories but, instead, they assign a global PCS score and play around it.
For example I never saw a skater scored with so-so SS and superlative CO or viceversa.

 

[lopsilceci]

My thoughts about today's ladies event top 3:

I would have had Sasha in first...
I'm I crazy or did she actually step out of the 3A because she over rotated it?
Her 3Lz3T combo was beautiful, it deserved even higher GOE in my opinion.
I'm glad that she got all level 4s and everything looked nice.
She also seems to be growing into this program performance-wise. I think she really sold it here.

I have mixed feelings about Aliona's SP. I have the same complaint that some people have about Anna's programs. I think that this year's SP is too similar to the Twilight program and for me the repetitiveness ruins it and makes it a bit boring.
I wonder why she didn't go for the 3A when the double seems so solid and she plans to do it tomorrow. It makes me think it's more of a confidence thing.
I don't think she should have gotten positive GOE for the 3F3T. Both jumps weren't so good and there was the step out. The layback also not great.
In general it was not bad for her first comp of the season but I don't feel like with this skate she deserved to be ahead of both Sasha and Maiia, who were both better and have grown more into their programs at this point.
The Cup bonus and her PCS rep definitely helped her.

Maiia was great! I'm so happy for her.
She was lowballed in my opinion. Everything was clean, high quality and she even jumped everything with rippons. She should have gotten at least the same or higher GOE than Aliona across all her elements, considering they had almost identical layouts. The TES difference between them should be more than 0.78 points.
Maiia's PCS should have been higher too. It does seem surprising that the judges weren't as generous with her as they have been with Daria and Kamila. I don't get it, is it because she's tall?

 

[McBibus]

I wonder why she didn't go for the 3A when the double seems so solid and she plans to do it tomorrow. It makes me think it's more of a confidence thing.

I think this round is all about the new FS and they planned to take it easy today.
Not going all in for a result may maybe help her being more relaxed tomorrow.
We will see.

The Cup bonus and her PCS rep definitely helped her.

I disagree on a favorable PCS

Maiia's PCS should have been higher too. It does seem surprising that the judges weren't as generous with her as they have been with Daria and Kamila. I don't get it, is it because she's tall?

She's not considered a winning horse atm so no "domestic" bonus for her, but I did really liked her today. Womanof the day.

NB: my "woman of the day" is not necessarily a winner, but someone who surprise me in a positive way.
For example last year EU WotD were Tornaghi and Kibus on SP and Paganini on the FS

 

[Vandevska]

My thoughts about today's ladies event top 3:

I would have had Sasha in first...
I'm I crazy or did she actually step out of the 3A because she over rotated it?
Her 3Lz3T combo was beautiful, it deserved even higher GOE in my opinion.
I'm glad that she got all level 4s and everything looked nice.
She also seems to be growing into this program performance-wise. I think she really sold it here.

I have mixed feelings about Aliona's SP. I have the same complaint that some people have about Anna's programs. I think that this year's SP is too similar to the Twilight program and for me the repetitiveness ruins it and makes it a bit boring.
I wonder why she didn't go for the 3A when the double seems so solid and she plans to do it tomorrow. It makes me think it's more of a confidence thing.
I don't think she should have gotten positive GOE for the 3F3T. Both jumps weren't so good and there was the step out. The layback also not great.
In general it was not bad for her first comp of the season but I don't feel like with this skate she deserved to be ahead of both Sasha and Maiia, who were both better and have grown more into their programs at this point.
The Cup bonus and her PCS rep definitely helped her.

Maiia was great! I'm so happy for her.
She was lowballed in my opinion. Everything was clean, high quality and she even jumped everything with rippons. She should have gotten at least the same or higher GOE than Aliona across all her elements, considering they had almost identical layouts. The TES difference between them should be more than 0.78 points.
Maiia's PCS should have been higher too. It does seem surprising that the judges weren't as generous with her as they have been with Daria and Kamila. I don't get it, is it because she's tall?

Essentially what I think about today.

Anyway, Aliona's jumps when done well like the 3Lz and the 2A are so good that I'm like 'Give her the GOE, give her ALL the GOE'.
No one makes me feel like she does with her jumps, I can't explain it, it's the minimal prerotation, the height, the distance, she hits everything. The only jumps more impressive for me are well executed quads, but even with those it can be on par of how excited I get haahah. Nevertheless, I don't think she should've gotten + GOE for the combo today, and I'm still puzzled how is the layback lvl 4, and should've at least had minimal negative GOE.

I'm glad Sasha cleaned up the rest of the program, hitting all level 4s. As for the axel, I really think she needs to keep trying it because she really needs it for next year and this is the only way to go about her losing the anxiety about the jump in competition. For once I agree with Daniil here, though in a more general sense, that everyone needs a 3A to secure a win in the future. I'm really enjoying how the program is turning out and I think she's really trying to improve on the performance aspect.

Maiia deserves more! One of my favourite SPs this year, she really owned it, and I think she perhaps deserved a bit more compared to the other skaters.

Speaking of other jumps that are super exciting, Tarakanova's jumps are stellar too when executed well. She has such a big talent, it's really a pity that she couldn't really sort out a good enough situation for her in which she would've thrived. She would've been amazeballs if brought to her highest potential.

 

[lopsilceci]

I think this round is all about the new FS and they planned to take it easy today.
Not going all in for a result may maybe help her being more relaxed tomorrow.
We will see.

Maybe, but she does need a bigger SP advantage if she wants to get closer to Sasha in the FP. And if she can actually jump a 3A, why not just go for it in the SP too, since it's supposed to be easier for stamina than doing it in the FP?

I disagree on a favorable PCS

You think she deserved higher PCS even with the mistakes?

She's not considered a winning horse atm so no "domestic" bonus for her, but I did really liked her today. Womanof the day.

NB: my "woman of the day" is not necessarily a winner, but someone who surprise me in a positive way.
For example last year EU WotD were Tornaghi and Kibus on SP and Paganini on the FS

So, I guess the so called "Eteri bonus" is just a myth.

 

[[email protected]]

Forgetting about names and titles and just judging by what I saw I would place Maia on top today, then Sasha, then Alyona. I have never seen Maia as precise and attentive to details. Clearly, a very big amount of work has been done. I like Sasha's SP this season, and her 3A was closer this time. But titles and brands aside I don't see her today's pcs at the level of Maia but she got the lead in pcs department over her. As for Alena, frankly speaking, I was not impressed at all. She has a lot of work ahead of her to return to her last year level. Sure, she is good but not THAT good.

Maia's task tomorrow is to be as clean and precise in her skating as she was today. No matter what she does she cannot beat either Sasha or Alyona if they deliver. But if she is clean including 4S with positive GOE she can expect something like 85+70=155. And then with the total score above 230 she will join Anna, Kamilla, and Darya as "Eteri's striking force" this season. This essentially means that speaking about podiums the rest of the season will be the competition between 2 former Eteri's skaters, Anna, and "new Eteri's crops". Tier 2 lead by Liza T is also interesting (speaking about the depth in Russian figure skating). But I hardly see any of them surpassing 220 even locally unless Liza starts to jump her 4S in addition to axels. Then, of course, we don't know if Zhenya gets back into shape.

Anyway, Rusnats and the final stage of Russian Cup will be 2 outstanding events with very big importance. I think that they will give the first hints who will go to the Olympics.... should they take place.

If Maia bombs tomorrow, it's not a tragedy. But with 5 other Tier 1 skaters and usual "3 spot business" it is very important to develop the momentum and not to lose it as long as you are "just another Eteri skater fresh from juniors". The field at the top is very tightly packed.

 

[NadezhdaNadya]

Things are going wild and crazy and out of control in the Russian sites and the Russian forums. Many Russians say that Alyona was overscored because of the step-out on her combination and the mistake on her spin. So for them 78 is too much. What about Anna's SP at the previous Russian cup competition then? She scored 77 with 3-2 combination which was two footed.

 

[nussnacker]

I completely agree the step-out shouldn't get positive GOE, but I love how when these types of mistakes happen to other skaters there's so much defense to do with how the GOE is saved by the quality of their jump, and how they're hitting all the other GOE bullets.

Don't know if anyone noticed but Aliona and Daria made the exact same mistake with the 3F-3T. Similarities keep coming.

3Lz is a revelation for Aliona, even less prerotation and a better edge. Almost close to 90 degrees take-off I think.

Which Daria are you taking about? Usacheva? She fell from 3F-3T in her free at St3, but I don’t remember her doing a step out in SP or FS.

 

[ali0125]

I think Aliona shouldn't have positive GOE for that step out, but her PCS especially SS is underscored per the "Russian Cup Standard"

 

[brakes]

Friendly reminder that Tamara Moskvina is going to be 80yo this June.

https://www.instagram.com/p/CHHqmbOpqrD/

 

[Baron Vladimir]

Now: i want you to leave skaters comparisons aside and concentrate on Aliona SS.
Skating skill is a very specific PCS category (you can see a definition Here )
It's execution of basic skills close to perfection but you either have flow or not, you either know how to accelerate effortlessy with you crossover or no, you either go deep with your age and turn with perfect flawless footwork or not.

9.54 vs 9.05 is over 5% difference or 2 steps in the voting scale that goes in .25 increments.
The same panel who judged her the best in the world in basic skills 10 months agois now looking at an awkard skater.
This does not make sense to me.

Skating skills are judged, like every other judged element, in a moment of the skating performance. Judges are not judging your inherent skating ability, only what you are able to show in one skating programme. The last ISU seminar about Skating Skills is starting with the quote 'all skaters have some worse and some better days', which means that Skating Skills as a score, like everything else skaters are judged on, can fluctuate from the competition to the competition. Otherwise, there is no point of competitions to exist.

 

[Magill]

I think Aliona shouldn't have positive GOE for that step out, but her PCS especially SS is underscored per the "Russian Cup Standard"

Well, as per Russian Cup Standard both Sasha and Alyona have been seriously underscored in the PCS department ...

 

[eterialskating]

Sasha should have been first. Hit all of her levels and her spins were good. She is not actually a bad spinner by any means. Her lay back is quite lovely. Kostornaia has been keep under wraps far longer than any of the contenders. Frankly I am not impressed by this debut performance. Unless she pulls out her 3A somewhere or brings her consistensy back then she falls back to pretender status. She is lucky Valieva is not senior this year. Otherwise her VIP seat would have already been snatched away from her. I would have put her third.

 

[moonkat]

Was hoping Trusova would get the 3A landed here. Is she really going for the 4S?

 

[colormyworld240]

I also think Sasha should've been ahead, but not because of the bonuses but because of Alena's combo GOE. I don't see anything wrong with giving spin bonuses, spins have a much lower scoring potential compared to jumps and weren't many posters saying last season that jumps shouldn't be everything? Alena's spins, apart from the layback today, are better than Sasha's.

With Sasha's spins were can see the clear disadvantage in her natural ability. It's clear that she works on her spins: everything is done so well, good speed, and all her sit positions are nice (just as good as Alena or Anna's) and they're always centred (sometimes even better than Anna and Alena). But she loses so much speed in the positions that require more flexibility and that's the only time when they are a struggle. She just doesn't have the flexibility and I don't think she can be more flexible than what she is now. I wonder if she can do other variations without the need for these flexible positions that can still get her +4/+5.

In the SP, Sasha has never gotten as much of a boost as Alena and Anna nationally. It was the same last season under the same coach, and this season under different coaches. The judges just don't seem to like her style, and there are no quads here to up the wow-factor. She will get higher PCS in the free, though, as she already had at the previous stage.

Maiia's SP is probably the most well choreographed of all the top Russians this season. And I still think the only beautiful dress is Daria's FS.

 

[Amei]

Was hoping Trusova would get the 3A landed here. Is she really going for the 4S?

I believe someone said a few days ago that they are planning 4 quads for the FS tomorrow.