2020-21 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating

[florin]

I don't understand is this such sophisticated trolling or is it sincere?

 

[Rus Skating World]

- monotonous programs and lack of expression
- flutz and wrong jumps technique
- lack of skating skills, poor crossovers and edges (6.5 as a fair skating score)
- finally, lack of charisma and outstanding personality

Just a quick summary of all Anna's sins mentioned above I really wonder how the judges must be scared of RusFeb in order to overscore such a 'poor' skater

C'mon guys, don't be ridiculous! Nobody is saying Anna is perfect and has nothing to improve, but it's impossible to deny that she had an outstanding performance today. Rika and Liza were also amazing (and that is why they are sooo close and FS will decide the winner). Also we can't even say now that only Russian judges value Anna because of her coaching team as ISU judges don't care about who the coach is.

 

[dhjh811]

Wild theory, but I've always kinda feel like Shayuki and Nadya are the same person. It just depends on which side shows up on any given day.

lmao what

 

[starlight97]

I think after 2 full senior seasons to look back on and analyze, Sasha's team should come to the realization that they should spend less time pushing her physical capabilities to bigger and bigger heights (which are not even necessary) and instead spend some time on her psychological capabilities as a competitor. Aka sports psychologist, if the coaches and parents alone don't succeed.
There is 0 shame in that, it is not insulting to suggest it and it's actually a normal part of many top athletes' life.
Cause that is how she is actually losing. Not cause of a lack of even more and harder jumps, and not even cause of inferior PCS! But because she cannot deliver in competition.
We have seen her stunning practices and we know what she can do in training.
There is a a very important difference between a great athlete and a great competitor. She is the greatest athlete out there, physically, no question. If she wants to be Olympic Champion, she needs to be a better competitor.

 

[Rus Skating World]

I think after 2 full senior seasons to look back on and analyze, Sasha's team should come to the realization that they should spend less time pushing her physical capabilities to bigger and bigger heights (which are not even necessary) and instead spend some time on her psychological capabilities as a competitor. Aka sports psychologist, if the coaches and parents alone don't succeed.
There is 0 shame in that, it is not insulting to suggest it and it's actually a normal part of many top athletes' life.
Cause that is how she is actually losing. Not cause of a lack of even more and harder jumps, and not even cause of inferior PCS! But because she cannot deliver in competition.
We have seen her stunning practices and we know what she can do in training.
There is a a very important difference between a great athlete and a great competitor. She is the greatest athlete out there, physically, no question. If she wants to be Olympic Champion, she needs to a better competitor.

I can't agree more!

 

[Rus Skating World]

I guess the reason why so many people always "forget" about Anna- she doesn't have charisma. She could win olympics and 3 world titles but there's still nothing to remember about her. She doesn't have any trademarks, something only she would be known for. She is "elegant", "fragile" looking, is pretty, just like many other Russian skaters. But she is wery "pale" compared to others.

This one is a particular nonsense! Is being less scandalous, not changing coaches and not delivering shocking comments in the interviews considered now as being pale and having no charisma? I don't know why you always "forget" about Anna but gladly I see here a lot of people who don't

 

[chasingneverland]

Please explain who this mysterious Nadya is?

You don't want to know.

They're just known for their single-minded dislike of Anna - often going so far as to insult her character - saying things like she shouldn't be proud of herself after a clean skate, etc - even when the conversation has nothing to do with Anna. They also are known for criticizing Anna's 3Lz edge (almost exclusively) and watching and analyzing her jumps (particularly her Lz) at incredibly slowed down speeds. Then on top of that they're also known for thinking Sergei Rozanov is the most beautiful man in Russia (and probably the World) and perpetuating the rumours that he's in a relationship with Aliona (a minor).

Does that pretty much cover it? haha

 

[nussnacker]

I think after 2 full senior seasons to look back on and analyze, Sasha's team should come to the realization that they should spend less time pushing her physical capabilities to bigger and bigger heights (which are not even necessary) and instead spend some time on her psychological capabilities as a competitor. Aka sports psychologist, if the coaches and parents alone don't succeed.
There is 0 shame in that, it is not insulting to suggest it and it's actually a normal part of many top athletes' life.
Cause that is how she is actually losing. Not cause of a lack of even more and harder jumps, and not even cause of inferior PCS! But because she cannot deliver in competition.
We have seen her stunning practices and we know what she can do in training.
There is a a very important difference between a great athlete and a great competitor. She is the greatest athlete out there, physically, no question. If she wants to be Olympic Champion, she needs to be a better competitor.

There was a podcast with Maxim Kovtun a day before SP. The podcast host and Maxim were both amazed by Sasha and her practices on that podcast. After the podcast ended, in private, podcast host was still energized about Sasha’s practices and Maxim told that guy only one thing about Sasha: “she’ll burn out”...
Anyways, hoping for a clean Sasha in the free. I’m confident she can bounce back and go home with a medal.

 

[starlight97]

This one is a particular nonsense! Is being less scandalous, not changing coaches and not delivering shocking comments in the interviews considered now as being pale and having no charisma? I don't know why you always "forget" about Anna but gladly I see here a lot of people who don't

I second that.

Speaking as one of those who were absolutely indifferent towards Anna myself, I can tell you exactly what makes her stand out: her personality.

She doesn't have the most natural jumping ability (Sasha). She doesn't have the most jaw-dropping spins (Kamila). She doesn't have the most sizzling PCS (Alena). She doesn't have a big diva presence (Evgenya). She doesn't have particularly interesting programs either.

But while she isn't "the best" in any singular component, aka doesn't stick out sore thumb style, she is very good in ALL of them. And she actually is the best at sth very important: delivering.
Call her fragile, skinny, frail, pale as much as you want, her mind is made of steel.

 

[Tonight's the Night]

It's crazy to think that Sasha's mistake on her 3Lz was that she over rotated it, while most skaters have UR problems with it.
Maybe she jumped the 4Lz so much in practice that her body forgot how to adjust to one less rotation.

Even crazier: Veronika Zhilina's mistake on the triple axel being overrotation:

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[Tonight's the Night]

Sasha doesn't need to be clean to get a 160+. She got a 161 at GPF with a 4F, 2S (popped the 4S), 4Lz, 2A+3T, and backloaded 4T+1Eu+3S, under-rotated and fell on a backloaded 4T, and backloaded 3Lz+3T. She'll be 160+ with 3 clean quads (depending on what everything else is like.) Her PCS will be higher too.

Exactly, thanks for your response. Three clean quads will do it. I think it really makes much more sense for her to go for the bronze at this point. But I'm happy to be wrong if she lands five quads and stuns the world.

Would that be like Anna skating sick at Nationals? We need a professional risk-assessment consultant to determine how astounded to be at various athletic feats.

 

[chasingneverland]

Exactly, thanks for your response. Three clean quads will do it. I think it really makes much more sense for her to go for the bronze at this point. But I'm happy to be wrong if she lands five quads and stuns the world.

Would that be like Anna skating sick at Nationals? We need a professional risk-assessment consultant to determine how astounded to be at various athletic feats.

I think Sasha will go for 5 quads and I think she'll land at least 3 cleanly - I would love it if she lands 4 or 5 cleanly but I think she lands at least 3. (Also the thing is as long as she rotates them even if she falls - she can afford a fall or two on them. She'll still score 160+ - she just needs to rotate them.) That will be more than enough to get her into the medals.

Hmm, Sasha has gone for 5 quads before. She has also landed 4 quads in international competition before. It wouldn't be unheard of for her.

 

[Tonight's the Night]

I think Sasha will go for 5 quads and I think she'll land at least 3 cleanly - I would love it if she lands 4 or 5 cleanly but I think she lands at least 3. That will be more than enough to get her into the medals.

Hmm, Sasha has gone for 5 quads before. She has also landed 4 quads in international competition before. It wouldn't be unheard of for her.

Right, good point, I was being ambiguous. It seems like there are two options for her, but really one option works: go for five quads. Even if she falls on two of them, she has still landed three cleanly. (Popping the quads is much worse than fully rotating and then falling; the latter is close to a triple in points.)

So she can pursue the one option, going for five, and if she lands five she is a legend, and if she lands three she gets a bronze. Something like that.

 

[chasingneverland]

Right, good point, I was being ambiguous. It seems like there are two options for her, but really one option works: go for five quads. Even if she falls on two of them, she has still landed three cleanly. (Popping the quads is much worse than fully rotating and then falling; the latter is close to a triple in points.)

So she can pursue the one option, going for five, and if she lands five she is a legend, and if she lands three she gets a bronze. Something like that.

The other thing too is if she goes for 5 and rotates all 5 - even if she falls once or twice she puts a lot of pressure on Anna and Rika - that'll force them to go for max BV. Also her PCS will rise and her PCS will help her. Although I would like to see a clean skate here - mostly for her own confidence.

 

[Tonight's the Night]

The other thing too is if she goes for 5 and rotates all 5 - even if she falls once or twice she puts a lot of pressure on Anna and Rika - that'll force them to go for max BV. Also her PCS will rise and her PCS will help her. Although I would like to see a clean skate here - mostly for her own confidence.

And then the anticipated objection is: if she goes for five quads she is risking another Rostelecom-style meltdown. But I don't think her difficulty in jumping five quads is about fitness; it's not as if she is any less fit than she was at that Grand Prix final fifteen months ago. The difficulty is mental. And if she knows that she can miss a quad and still come back and land others then she should be OK.

Well, what do I know. I at least wanted to have more confidence in a kind of "conceptual frame" for my viewing of the long program on Friday. Time to step back and read some more commentary.

May the entire field give it their all...

 

[Amei]

So people still believe Sasha can win this? With Plushenko behind her back? Hmmm, I think it's more probable she will run away from him after the Worlds but who knows...

I don't think its entirely impossible for her but it would likely be under the scenario that Trusova is clean on a 3-4 quad program and Rika and Shcherbakova both make errors on their quads or triple axels, or Trusova does a 5 quad clean program and Shcherbakova doesn't max out (3 clean quads) her FS.

But of the 3 skaters I've mentioned Trusova is the 1 more likely to have big errors and the only flawless FS she's had this season was a 2 quad program, which might be able to get her on the podium if someone else has mistakes

 

[readernick]

I don't think its entirely impossible for her but it would likely be under the scenario that Trusova is clean on a 3-4 quad program and Rika and Shcherbakova both make errors on their quads or triple axels, or Trusova does a 5 quad clean program and Shcherbakova doesn't max out (3 clean quads) her FS.

But of the 3 skaters I've mentioned Trusova is the 1 more likely to have big errors and the only flawless FS she's had this season was a 2 quad program, which might be able to get her on the podium if someone else has mistakes

I am not sure Trusova just wants to win a medal. I think she likes setting records. I think she should do as she wants as long as it isn't endangering her health.

 

[Amei]

I am not sure Trusova just wants to win a medal. I think she likes setting records. I think she should do as she wants as long as it isn't endangering her health.

I think she likes setting records as well, I made the statement last year that I sometimes wondered if she cared more about getting records than winning. The more quads she does, the more errors she's prone to have and as others have said she bombs the FS she could be crippling her chances of getting named to the Olympic team next year

 

[Dawn825]

Ugh. I just scrolled though 20 pages of this thread. Gonna my opinions down below.

They called her flip, though, which was half surprising. Has she ever gotten a call internationally before?

RusFed's fault. They are known for freaking out when their favorite skaters get edge calls. By calling Sasha at home, they were loudly communicating that everyone else was free to do so.

Anna might - she hasn't landed any of her quads on her FS runthroughs. That's 3 falls.

Until 2 minutes before Anna skated today, she was under enormous pressure. Her and Sasha were scheduled for an intense battle of the quads on Friday. The way I see it, as soon as Sasha messed up so badly, almost all pressure was lifted off Anna. She knew all she had to do was skate a clean quadless short and the title was practically hers. She has a big BV advantage on Rika in the free - she can make a few mistakes and still win. I'd bet she skates pretty carefree on Friday.

I'm hoping skating early will be good for Sasha. At least she won't be under pressure to match what others do and she can set an incredibly high bar

This is a very positive outlook, I hope you're right!!

I don't think that's a good thing. It's keeping your emotions in and not releasing. The clear response to this type of performance is being upset.

Sasha said in an interview that she makes sure to always smile after a bad skate cuz she knows her fans don't want to see her cry. I actually think this is an incredibly mature attitude. I personally can't stand watching skaters cry after bad performances, though I understand it's a normal reaction. But Pogorilaya laying on the ice at 2017 Worlds might be my all-time least favorite moment in all the years I've watched this sport.

So the Olympic team will most probably be Sasha T., Liza T., and whichever third girl manages to be in top form next season.

In your dreams. RusFed picks the team. They have proven without a doubt that they don't care one bit about technique. Cheated quads from TT skaters trump literally everything else.

I have seen many interviews of the Russians in their language and translated on the spot or in writing, but hearing Anna speak for more than 2 sentences in a language I actually understand, I felt like for the first time I'm actually hearing her voice. As in seeing her personality in what she says and how she says it, even if it's contradictory, as she can express herself way less in English, than she could if I was reading another translation from Russian.

Same. It's always so weird to me when I listen to a skater give an interview in English for the first time. I heard Carolina's voice at 2018 Worlds for the first time and I was like "that's her voice??". I've had the same strong feeling about Anna and Aliona this year. We spend so much time looking at them, and next to none listening to them. It does make them seem more like real people in a way lol.

it's not even clear if the edge is unclear (lol)

Lol indeed. It's is clear that if some thing is unclearly unclear, it is clearly unclear.

It's crazy to think that Sasha's mistake on her 3Lz was that she over rotated it, while most skaters have UR problems with it.
Maybe she jumped the 4Lz so much in practice that her body forgot how to adjust to one less rotation.

Seems to be the general consensus. Her muscle memory was geared up to jump the quad and she got caught in the middle.

 

[colormyworld240]

There was a podcast with Maxim Kovtun a day before SP. The podcast host and Maxim were both amazed by Sasha and her practices on that podcast. After the podcast ended, in private, podcast host was still energized about Sasha’s practices and Maxim told that guy only one thing about Sasha: “she’ll burn out”...
Anyways, hoping for a clean Sasha in the free. I’m confident she can bounce back and go home with a medal.

I don't think she's burning out from the quads, though. It looks like the pressure and nerves are getting to her. Her mistake wasn't on a quad today, it was a 3Lz that she could do in her sleep. She looks very strong in practice and not even all that tired from doing a 5 quad run through.

I also don't think the 3Lz mistake was from practicing 4Lz; how long has she been training the quad and I think this is only the second time she's had an issue with a triple (that wasn't -3Lo) in her whole international career, it was just a fluke probably because she was nervous.

She's made it clear that she loves jumping. Didn't she say that she disliked reducing her layout to avoid mistakes because she wants to try? It might just be the better strategy to do all her jumps and keep her layout consistent with the mentality that "I can do it, I've already done it many times, and one mistake in practice doesn't mean anything." The constant changes (like taking the 3A out today) isn't great for stability. I get that she didn't land it in the morning run through, but she has many times in the last few days. Maybe it's better to look at bad practices like it was a fluke and not "I need to change the layout because I might not be able to do it because of this one time I fell." It creates more doubt, imo.