I believe that was '71 in Lyon. One of my favorite memories because of her footwork...............
she didn’t make the podium in one WC in France (I forget the year, too lazy to look) and the crowd clapped so loudly that they brought her out for a bow during the medal ceremony. That’s how popular she was...............
No, we won't? I grew pretty tired of that common misconnection between perceived modern skating lack of artistry and age of athletes. First of all, relatively young top athletes is only one country phenomenon - Russia. And, as every other country, it's limited by only 3 quotes per every major int. competition. All other skaters from other countries usually are more older - and there are lot of them. And there is no indication that situation begin to change in future in other countries as well - there is just too little competition to make them change their leaders faster. If you are not satisfied with level of artistry that was shown at Worlds by majority of skaters - which were adult too (Sakamoto, Hendrics, Chen, Tuktamysheva etc.) - do not blame two 17 y.o. quadsters for that, pls -_- It's definitely not their fault - as age of skaters has nothing to do with what majority of skaters (which mostly are adult, I repeat) in int. senior competitions are showing us nowadays.
After whole olympic cycle of quads revolution started by Trusova we have yet to witness any women or girl quadsters serious injury or career's ending. Which can't be said about only a triple jumpers, by the way. Just a reminder.
Yet you want this career - i.e. this torture for the body and health - last longer.
Yet you want to dismiss and disparage quads and quadsters, lower their value and increase value of 'artistic' foolery on ice - all in the name of a freedom, of course. The iconic Yagudin's step sequence from Winter can be hundred times beautiful. But it's extremely easy comparing to quads - both in terms of pure difficulty and time, effort and impact on one's body to master it. Moreover, it's extremely easy comparing to any modern lv4 step sequence as well. And that can be said about many artistic elements from 6.0 era too.
That's why we have skating boards, to argue about events like that, and like the GPs, and like the GPF, and like the World Championships. All judged.
Haha, I definitely would have had Tomoki on the podium. Except...I enjoyed the three young women too. So I just couldnt say which woman he should knock off.I am afraid that making this type of generalization is just as frustrating as a "pure" artistic competition is to some spectators.
Which people want cruel competition with rules and elements that can only be quantified with simplistic measurements such as rotations in the air?
Not me, and I have been watching figure skating, for gulp, 50 years. (Oh no......)
I love competitions. Competitions that include skating skills, edges, spins, performance and artistry, and yes, jumps. If all I want to see is jumps, I'll throw on a coat, head out to a lake, and watch jumps. That's not figure skating.
As for PFT, I could have told you who won, who came in second, and who came in third (well, I might have had Tomoki on the podium) in PFT, and I don't drink
None of us know why *other* people watch. Sometimes it seems like all we can do is play the "well, me and all my friends" card. Then it's a competition of who has the most friends
Agreed, they needed a pewter medal.
You understand me wrongly. I am not against artistry and I am not telling anyone what they should love or watch. I know there are people who loves PFT. There is nothing wrong with that! What I am against is local generalization that everyone or majority loves artistry first and foremost or needed it. Or that current figure skating is inbalanced toward jumps. It's exact impression one will get if he tries to read this topic - it's really one-sided.
You understand me wrongly. I am not against artistry and I am not telling anyone what they should love or watch. I know there are people who loves PFT. There is nothing wrong with that! What I am against is local generalization that everyone or majority loves artistry first and foremost or needed it. Or that current figure skating is inbalanced toward jumps. It's exact impression one will get if he tries to read this topic - it's really one-sided.
It would be other matter if real data supported that claim. But it's not the case at all. If PFT or ice dance that good - why it's not that popular? If you can't explain that - pls do not make claims that we/figure skating needs artistry or that will return popularity to figure skating. Make claim that I need artistry - it will be more fair and will not make wrong impression to a stranger/figure skating novice who tries to read this topic.
Believe me - there are lot of people fully content with current rules and balance
Without real surveys, conducted with real controls and real data (which I don't think will ever happen in figure skating, sadly), we just don't know.
You do realize that Ice dance is the second most watched discipline in figure skating behind womens (Ladies) right?I understand what you are saying now and I understand that there are many people who love jumps. I agree, I am not saying that fans should not love what they love. I think fans should enjoy swift, high revolutions and long beautiful jumps and all that is associated with that, if that's what excites them.
But I could use your language just as truthfully for my own point of view. "If real data supported the view" that rotations in the air were what most viewers wanted; because there is no such data. And believe me, there are a lot of people not fully content with the short shrift given to everything that isn't a jump, including performance and artistry. I did not see the conversation as "biased" to artistry, but that could be because of my own bias.
And what annoys me the most is not the difference in opinion, but the assumption that I should watch shows or some other art form. Thanks to all for their concern, but I don't want to watch shows. I want to watch all the exciting athletic elements of figure skating that aren't confined to revolutions in the air. And that do constitute sport.
No one knows what will return popularity to figure skating, we are all just offering opinions.
Which is why can agree to disagree.
I don't doubt that she enjoyed the athletic/competitive aspect, but objective comparison is a necessary component of most widely-recognised sports. I meant it in response to the statement that she didn't like required elements - measures to standardise programmes are double-edged since they reduce opportunities for self-expression, but they're needed in some shape or form to avoid comparing apple to oranges.When she was competing, Janet loved the fact that it was a sport. She is the reason I started watching the sport of figure skating.
she didn’t make the podium in one WC in France (I forget the year, too lazy to look
Tomoki was the winner for me
(There goes my objectivity...)
I would take Karen Chen’s skating over my of the 3 women above her any day. I haven’t felt the need to watch any of them again. I did watch some Gracie Gold videos last night though.
There are no points in this article that I agree with and there are multiple points that I strongly disagree with. Reading it was a waste of time for me but I understand that there are alternative opinions. That's why I shall not interfere any more in the discussion among those who think that there is something here to discuss.
I would just add that esp. South Korea is experiencing the very similar trend. In other aspects I fully agree.
It also seems to me that way since certain people started to complain about it. But yes, the lack of popularity in the USA doesn't mean the lack of popularity elsewhere. Also the reasons for the decrease of popularity can be hardly found in the "artistry" vs. "jumps" clash. For instance here in my country the figure skating's popularity decreased before the IJS was introduced simply because the lack of personalities appeared since the 90s. For comparison, nobody here was interested about speed skating before Martina Sáblíková appeared. And that is a "typical sport", with "objective scoring" and all. Just the star appearance of one superb speed skater changed that. I'm pretty sure if we had a person like Sáblíková in figure skating the popularity of the sport would grow up quickly.
Absolutely. This is real objectivity for me. One thing is expressing personal tastes, another is claiming that the sport is unfair/unpopular because it doesn't match my tastes. Anyone can be disappointed because of the loss of one's favourites, but it is just another side of the "unfairness coin" to wish the evaluation system be changed so as to make my favourites win. Moreover, the measurable criteria are more objective than the immeasurable ones. Sometimes it just seems to me that there is nothing but an "everybody knows" proof when people say that skater X is more expressive/interprets better/should get higher PCS than skater Y.
Me too. And welcome for my fellow countryman
Wasn't Gracie more of a 'jumping bean' herself? Pretty sure it was her jumping abilities that put her on the map, I don't think she was known for her skating skills or noteworthy performance skills (from what I can tell she had good packaging and "the right look", but that's not the same as actual charisma and prowess as a performer).
