Kamila Valieva: Anti-doping Case and Follow-ups | Page 198 | Golden Skate

Kamila Valieva: Anti-doping Case and Follow-ups

But even if she was knowingly doping, it is not her fault at all. I know we're all sick and tired of seeing and hearing the phrase "only 15" by now, but she is too young to understand just how detrimental it is to the sport and to her health. We should focus on finding the adults responsible and not question Kamila's innocence in this issue. For me, it is a non-issue whether Kamila knew or not. We cannot blame her even if she did know.
Trust me, I'm in absolutely no way trying to shift any blame from any adults involved in doping her, regardless of whether they were directly responsible or "merely" overlooked, failed to report, or otherwise enabled it. I entirely agree we should identify every one of them, and we should ban them for as long as we can.

But my personal stance on who should be punished in no way means that by WADA's own rules she can't be punished in addition to them.
 
What you are forgetting is that TMZ was found in her system plus a cocktail of body enhancing medications. This means that she doped herself, grandpa doped her or her cronies doped her. There is Zero tolerance of doping at the Olympics. That’s why Johnny, Tara and every Tom, Dick and Harry in the figure skaing world are upset over, she shouldn’t have been allowed to skate. The clean hardworking athletes didn’t want her in the ice. Shame, Shame, Shame…put the blame on the BYT because they told the truth. Sometimes the truth hurts..
I'm forgetting what? The actual doping violation this is all about, don't be absurd. The 3 drug cocktail is in the papers today so I decided to comment about it. But this CAS hearing was about the provisional suspension, Valieva isn't in the clear yet.

And NYT changed their article but you don't have any comments on that of course. No doubt all the kids drinking Monster or other energy drinks are on heart medication too. I'm not refusing the doping violation but clearly this cocktail of drugs is a narrative being cooked up that I reject. Even more that they're posting a 15 year old's medical details and the case details all over the media. No comments about infringement of those WADA rules too?

I don't know why I keep repeating it but there actually is a process to lift provisional suspensions in the WADA code so what you say is absolutely false. No it's definitely not allowed to keep any accolade when the prohibited drug is in your body no matter if it's not your fault e.g. Raducan, although that is not the case here.
 
It's an awful situation for the clean skaters who, on top of it all, are judged with a magnifying glass and underscored (because: corruption--allegedly), but it's also sad for Kamila. All joy of being in the individual event is gone for her. Even if she wins, there will be no happiness. I don't think. It's been spoiled for her. I mean, she would have probably won without the over-scoring and alleged doping they tried to hide as well as they could with the anesthesiologist doctor that is not at his first issue. She could have won by a margin with her beautiful spins and talent and with even only triples. Russia could have had their podium sweep anyway.
 
On the efficacy of the drug on figure skating and Valieva in particular, heart expert Dr. Benjamin J. Levine, a professor of exercise science at the University of Texas Southwestern Medical School, said “The chance that trimetazidine would improve her performance, in my opinion, is zero. The heart has plenty of blood. And the heart is so good at using different fuels.”[20]

There have been cases in which the substance has been unknowingly and innocently taken by an athlete in a vitamin pill they were taking, as happened with a swimmer in 2018, I believe.
TMZ is a substance only available by prescription. Even in Russia.
 
I remember Kamila's interview after she won the Euros ( I was going to link it but could not find it anymore on the youtube) and her innocent sweet face and the sweet way she said - I am only fifteen... so sweet so innocent...(I can't even remember the question she was answering)
Nobody knew then how this particular phrase will haunt as right now I feel that I shall scream if I hear ''she is only 15'' one more time! :devil:
I must say I can not remember a time when a figure skater was everywhere, I was eating breakfast this morning and a guy on the morning show on Lyric FM talked about Kamila... in Ireland, guys, in Ireland!!! The rugby land where if you ask anyone on the street if they know anything about FS, they would look at you like you an alien from another planet... I guess the bad publicity is still good publicity?
Now about sweetness of Kamila (and other Eteri's girls) that has been projected on us quite a lot- I am sceptical about that tbh. In Russia sweetness would not get you to the top, such fierce competition in ladies FS is there. You might think Kamila is unique and so on but there are probably a dozen of other Kamilas who are equally talented but simply didn't make it for variety of reasons - parents had no money, injuries and so on. Kamila also was lucky to be born when she was born that is a big plus for Eteri (Alina & Yulia before her) These girls could look very sweet where in reality they are probably hard as nails and can swear like a sailor. They have to be.
So frankly, I am not buying that she did not know what she was doing etc, being 15 yo in the elite sport is different from ordinary 15y that the main responsibility is still with the adults around her. She might or might have not known but due to her age she is not able to grasp all the consequences and significance of what's happening. That's a real problem.
Just my opinion....You know, I pretty much agree with this. I have been watching this "so sweet 15 year old" switch on and off the "I'm only 15" vulnerability" into a steely resolve once she takes to the ice. Then when she is done skating, she either falls to her knees crying like she's just gone through the most painful experience of her life, or she starts crying. Don't get me wrong. There could be both sides to the athlete but you can only milk the "poor little me" cow for so long until you get called out. I find the grandpa story as credible as the scene in the Sound of Music movie where the kids are lying to their dad about visiting Maria at the convent. Their cover story was they were picking blueberries and when their dad pointed out it was strawberry season, one kid answered there were picking strawberries that had turned blue because it was so cold.

I recently returned to watching figure skating after a long hiatus due to other priorities in my life and from what I can seen, there have been good changes and somethings still haven't changed, but rather they have morphed into different manifestations.

Many of the programs are still lyrical and beautiful.

The judging system has changed, but just like with the 6.0 system, it seems as if some skaters are awarded a base line of superiority in the component scores that sometimes doesn't match the skating on a particular day. I also don't remember the details, but I do recall there was a lot of discussion around a possible 'steroid' that Irina Slutskaya was using for treating a breathing problem she had. Some of the discussion here reminds me of those.

Regardless, thanks to all of the athletes who work so hard for years to make it to the Olympics who don't cheat or cut corners to win at all costs, regardles of who is pushing them: coaches, parents, peers, their government. And if KV honestly did nothing wrong then she is included here. At this point, I am no longer hoping for specific outcomes, but rather to experience some the individual performances and efforts that make it worth it to continue watching.
 
as Kamila's fan, i feel the same as how Tara and Johnny have expressed- betrayal and disappointment. That this girl, or even possibly these girls, are not honest competitors. How they are shown to the world is not a true image, past results and who we thought they were as athletes is now tainted. Their coaching team and the Crystal school are tainted. It's not what we all thought it was.

Johnny himself went to profile these girls in Russia before the Olympics, and he basically feels deceived. he can't be the same fan or even support her as he used to. i feel the same way, and there is a feeling of grief that comes with it.
I wonder if fans are not more naïve than the 15yo-only KV...
 
But even if she was knowingly doping, it is not her fault at all. I know we're all sick and tired of seeing and hearing the phrase "only 15" by now, but she is too young to understand just how detrimental it is to the sport and to her health. We should focus on finding the adults responsible and not question Kamila's innocence in this issue. For me, it is a non-issue whether Kamila knew or not. We cannot blame her even if she did know.
It's one thing if the laws and rules in place do not assign blame to the protected person, its a whole other thing to look at all the evidence available to us and say, "at some level, she had to have known, or was incredibly negligent in what she was putting into her body." I'm glad there are rules in place that SHOULD legally assign blame to the adults around her, but that doesn't mean I (a member of the general public) am precluded from reaching logical conclusions based on the evidence available - that this professional athlete wasn't completely blind to what she was ingesting. We can't ignore the performance enhancing effect the supplements had, and now she seems pressured to be protecting her team - and both of these things have been reasons to disqualify skaters in the past (Calalang and Kostner, respectively and without regard to the skaters' justifications). This is bolstered by the fact that so many skaters have come out recently (Tara, Adam Rippon, Mariah Bell, Johnny Weir, etc) who have all said that from the around TEN YEARS OLD, that they were trained and told that they were responsible for whatever they put in their body.

While we should tread lightly around placing blame on Kamila, I don't believe she is completely blameless in this situation - both before and after the sample's results were disclosed.
 
Exactly my feeling.
Doping? Someone was sacrificed to the evil gods? Whatever, it does not matter...
Her skate matters.
Doping? Doping matters!
Doping with these drugs makes her cheat!
Cheating in the body, the body that she skates in! The body, that doesn’t have these drugs and supplements, probably wouldn’t be so powerful and the body with. That’s what we mean by a clean skater. She is the best and most beautiful skater but at what cost and the way she got there takes the icing if the cake. Doping matters
 
Of course I don't know, but as a sports journalist wrote in a French newspaper: "She is only 15. She looks much older on the ice and much younger off the ice." That's not very nice, but that's what a lot of people feel about her, I suppose.
In fairness, that could be said of many skaters. When Michelle Kwan first started skating on the senior level, I remember thinking how much older she looked in makeup and costume. The effects of makeup can be astonishing.
 
But at least one other skater would be on the podium as well. I know that it would not be ideal, but this situation needs a solution asap. We've seen two Gold medals after a scandal in figure skating before.
And even if Valieva bombs the FS ... one of TT is going to win this.
I just don't want the other skaters to be the victims of this mess.
then make a podium for 30 skaters... i mean they are all victims of this mess.. the event has become a circus.

and please, let's not compare 2002 to this... the issue is very different here.... both pairs were held hostage of judges cheating in 2002... and it could have gone either way, and the athletes did not try to gain an unfair advantage themselves.
Here, it's not a question of it going either way because of equivalent performances. It's a question of "well it could go either way depending on how it ends up being judged later on after a more thorough investigation of the doping case"

I honestly think that the IOC had no choice to delay the medal ceremonies.. It was their only way to show their disagreement and to advocate for "clean sport".

The reality is that the IOC has failed ALL the athletes by allowing the ROC to compete at these games after the systemic doping scandal.
 
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As if powerful federations have not ruined the sport already with their many behind the scene shenanigans. The continuous abuse of precocious youths for the 'greater' nationalist agendas goes against the spirit and principle of the Olympic sports movement, where fairness, integrity, process, and good sportsmanship should be valued above 'win at all costs' pursuits has been irreparably harmed many times over... and it is not even the athlete's fault. So much for zero tolerance for doping!

However you look at it, federation interests hiding behind the advantages of youth is reckless and irresponsible, swapping them like some pokemon cards with a seasonal expiry date (certainly before they reach physical puberty) with factory manufactured cookie-cutter formulas and more importantly - federation choice of extra doping in PCS to manipulate and boost federation racehorse du jour, while completely neglecting the importance to develop and reward organic skills to adapt, refine, and mature, to realize a well-rounded balanced program as the skaters reaching physical, emotional, and intellectual maturity. All are largely and deliberately overlooked despite exposing many problems of the COP, including judging inconsistencies and sometimes abuse. They might as well get rid of PCS altogether, the differences between each skater are negligible compared to what really goes on the ice ON THE DAY anyway. AND especially compared with compensating with one more gimmick gesture in the choreography for GOEs, or relative to an easily digestible warhorse program with built-in emotions that judges can preferentially 'get'.

In the long run, how can one not see COP encourages this sick cycle of abuse that has never been managed properly in this subjective political sport. Arguably and deliberated overlooked by ISU through negligence, convenience, and complacency. ISU has been needing to be reformed for a long time, wonder when IOC will eventually do anything about it. Honestly, how long can the lie continue? How many more examples and case studies do you need? How many broken dreams must suffer in pursuit of nothingness?
 
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If you've been groomed to trust someone in authority why would you express views against it at all?
You assume this "grooming" (brainwashing?) process has occurred. There is no evidence of that. Most 15 year olds are well able to express their opposing views to their parents. (A lot of parents probably wish that weren't the case!)
 
i work with children age 6 to 18. Let me tell you that at 15, they are far from being naive, already at 12-13 they have ideas of their own and some are super strong-willed. They know justice and fairness. They know how to get what they want... especially the most competitive ones. We are talking about someone here who has traveled all over the place, worked super hard to get where she is... she may carry her plushies around but she is not a clueless toddler.
 
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