Kamila Valieva: Anti-doping Case and Follow-ups

[4everchan]

To me, it is primarily an offense against the foreign athlete who is subjected to harmful chemical substanses, very likely causing medical problem down the road and shortening the athlete's lfe. The harm done to an American citizen by possibly missing out on a medal is trivial in comparison.

Who suffered injury in this particular case? Mariah Bell?

actually, ask vincent and chock and bates if they'd like a gold medal from the team event... ask the sponsors... ask the US Fig Skating association who needs gvt money and donors to support the athletes via their carding... etc... it's all about money not so much the health of the athletes. a lost medal can mean even much more in some instances... Beckie Scott would have been the first ever north american woman to win a gold medal in cross country skiing (she received her gold in the mail) and that could have generated a lot of funding to the organisation and athletes via Own the Podium in Canada... ... so in the end, it's about money and it's about that money going into sports development.. doping is not medal theft it's funding theft... which creates damages to the sport. It's deeper than a piece of hardware

 

[dante]

That is another mistake by Valieva's defence just like their grandfather story. If I was her personal lawyer, I would have advised her against that. If sample B confirms the results of sample A they are digging even bigger hole for themselves and for this poor girl. This whole situation appears to me if as their strategy is now to shift blame on her individually and away from her coaching team.

All these hearings were only about the provisional suspension, so it wasn't necessary (neither possible in such a short time) to prove an error in the analysis or unintentional consuming of a contaminated product; it was enough to state "a possibility that is more real than fantastic" (page 7).

I hope now, even after such an Olympics Kamila will go all the way and prove her innocence, and that it will serve as an occasion to reform WADA into something more reasonable.

"Now they won't cancel the ceremony," Valieva said and cried during the announcement of the scores for the free program.

So, WADA and the IOC did what they wanted.

ISU also wanted to kick Kamila out, just saying (page 16).

 

[4everchan]

I am still mad at CAS for overstepping here... they could have avoided so much drama by not allowing Kamila to skate and accepting the appeals of WADA IOC and ISU... when there is such drama boiling up, there is no point leaving it on the fire... just take it away... so to the people who keep complaining about WADA or the IOC, well... this time, it's really CAS that screwed up... because, you know, there is still a strong possibility that sanctions may have occurred anyway

 

[el henry]

I agree with you that does not excuse the main crime she accused of, YET. But the CAS ruling also does talk about WADA not applying the same strict rules it argues in their argument to themselves. Russians can argue that the fact there were so many delays happened in processing of the sample is suspicious and may be an indication of attempted tempering.

CAS implies that it could be a good argument.

But we will indeed see.

You are right, in the new document they make certain implications. I had not read it all the way through. I was talking about reading the initial document, not the new one.

But here is what I think (which cannot be proven in any way shape or form, so just an impression).

CAS had not yet written this document when they made their decision. With each passing minute (for me at least) it is clear that the decision itself to fail to reinstate the provisional suspension caused Kamila irreparable harm. So they issued a document that tried to justify their decision in the strongest language possible.

I do not know how the panels are selected for the full blown hearing. But I am presuming it is not the same panel. We will see what they think.

 

[Mathman]

I guess my problem is that I have only a laypersons understanding of what a "law" is and what is a "crime." The attorney genberal of Texas declared that an election in Pednnsylvania was invalid and the officials who conducted it were criminals. The claim was laughed out of court. If you violate the rulles agreed upon by IOC members have ypu broken the law? Have you committed a crime? Can you be put in jail?

"International Law" seems almost a contradiction in terms. Why should I care if Lithuania passes a law that says I can't eat spaghetti? (They can of course p[ass a law that says no speghetti-eaters will be allowed to enter Lithuania. -- that is their right as a sovereign nation.)

 

[Sloopy]

The feed is controlled by the IOC with the Chinese Olympic Committee organizing the camera operators. The global feed was shown across much of the world. Eurosport certainly had it, as they were supposed to go right into the flower ceremony.

That is excellent that China was behind the cameras and controlling the feed. Now we won't have to hear the propaganda on how the evil Western media was portraying this ridiculous but sad drama. I love how Kaori tried her best to distance herself from the fallout in case a brawl broke out.

 

[Amei]

I am still mad at CAS for overstepping here... they could have avoided so much drama by not allowing Kamila to skate and accepting the appeals of WADA IOC and ISU... when there is such drama boiling up, there is no point leaving it on the fire... just take it away... so to the people who keep complaining about WADA or the IOC, well... this time, it's really CAS that screwed up... because, you know, there is still a strong possibility that sanctions may have occurred anyway

I don't think anyone was in a 'winning' position here. Its possible that the least damaging position would have been for them to reinstate the suspension and send her home and avoid the media circus and the cloud her presence put over the individual event. BUT CAS merely said she wasn't suspended, there was a WD option that could have been taken. Had CAS reinstated the suspension there would still be talk that they irreparably damaged Valieva by taking away her Olympic opportunity, that would have been Russia's position and it would have been a much louder opinion if later down the road she wins her appeal that positive test was in error.

 

[yelyoh]

IOC should have seen latest Russian doping scandal coming — and actually done something

In his Thursday column, Tim Rowland looks at accusations Russian ice skater Kamila Valieva used banned substances, and the IOC's response.

www.yahoo.com

For a laugh, depending.

 

[4everchan]

yes .. kamila could have won etc... kamila could also be forgiven... two what ifs against the what if this all ends up a big circus which was most likely to happen

also, my point is more about that CAS could have said : we believe that WADA IOC and ISU's appeal is legitimate we do not have have enough information to indeed justify the lift of the provisional suspension by RUSADA and will reinstate it for the sake of the integrity of the event.

I don't think anyone was in a 'winning' position here. Its possible that the least damaging position would have been for them to reinstate the suspension and send her home and avoid the media circus and the cloud her presence put over the individual event. BUT CAS merely said she wasn't suspended, there was a WD option that could have been taken. Had CAS reinstated the suspension there would still be talk that they irreparably damaged Valieva by taking away her Olympic opportunity, that would have been Russia's position and it would have been a much louder opinion if later down the road she wins her appeal that positive test was in error.

 

[Sloopy]

Sorry, I did not read the entire conversation but your last post only.
Sorry again, no offense was intended.

And no offense taken. It just threw me off for a moment. It has been a little while since I was this active on the board and I guess I need to brush up again on how to quote the whole conversation.

 

[skatedreamer]

Kaori said it best: "All the nerves turned into tears."

Kamila needs a big

 

[NaVi]

It's really baffling to understand the logic of not pulling Kamila out. The CAS decision was 100% correct IMO but someone needed to evaluate whether it was a good idea or not to compete. There was no good outcome for Kamila competing here and she had nothing to prove. Kamila's chance to win, while still good, was greatly reduced by her error in the SP. I think Kamila genuinely wanted to compete BUT I don't think she would ever have a real say in the matter. The decision would ultimately be Eteri's and I don't think anyone has an ability to intervene over Eteri. And Eteri is extremely stubborn and has an interest in seeing the medals be swept.

Eteri frankly deserves all the scorn that's coming her way. The tide has been slowly turning against Eteri as we've witnessed the Usacheva's injury that obviously caused by repetitive stress, spatting with Kostornaia to get a 3A who ends up hurting herself, and over politicking for her daughter in ice dance. And then we have the current situation with Valieva. And then you have the open emotional manipulation of any skater who dares to leave(some of this may be kayfabe but it's still bad) and then the callous comments about diet and weight.

TBH, I don't think Eteri should be anyone's main coach for a while. There should be some kind of a buffer coach in between her and any student.

 

[flakyy]

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Don't hold your breath that anything will happen about TT. Some Russian coaches want to be seen exactly that way - o.k., Viner has even more influence than Eteri, she literally is RG in Russia.

 

[anonymoose_au]

- YouTube

Enjoy the videos and music you love, upload original content, and share it all with friends, family, and the world on YouTube.

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Don't hold your breath that anything will happen about TT. Some Russian coaches want to be seen exactly that way - o.k., Viner has even more influence than Eteri, she literally is RG in Russia.

This is depressingly true...like you'd think someone that messed up wouldn't be allowed within 500 metres of kids...or perhaps people in general.

Sigh.

 

[[email protected]]

This is depressingly true...like you'd think someone that messed up wouldn't be allowed within 500 metres of kids...or perhaps people in general.

Sigh.

well, Mamun is right now on national Russian TV with Zagitova and she looks absolutely happy. She also says that she is grateful to Viner and is angry when people say that they feel pity for her. I believe her more than those "concerned people".

 

[Novalis]

well, Mamun is right now on national Russian TV with Zagitova and she looks absolutely happy. She also says that she is grateful to Viner and is angry when people say that they feel pity for her. I believe her more than those "concerned people".

The problem is that it isn't the winner, the most successful, who suffers the most

 

[whatif]

I guess what @[email protected] is trying to say is that we need to also consider certain cultural context here. It is clearly not a big deal in Russia to treat underage athletes the way we saw they have been treated during the women's competition. All the mistreatment is later supposedly rewarded with money, fame, state recognition etc... And that is worth it.

We may have opposing views over here but that's a norm over there. It doesn't matter what we think.

 

[[email protected]]

The problem is that it isn't the winner, the most successful, who suffers the most

The problem is when you give it all you don't win. There was nothing about "bad Eteri and her practices" in yesterday's Sasha's tears. It was about her not achieving the dream of her life. This is what matters to those girls most of all. Russia is no less free country than ... you name it.... Many people that I know took their kids out of figure skating. But some stay and those are who want to win - they would not care less about what "concerned people" care.

 

[norwegianfairytale]

Marco

 

[Magill]

well, Mamun is right now on national Russian TV with Zagitova and she looks absolutely happy. She also says that she is grateful to Viner and is angry when people say that they feel pity for her. I believe her more than those "concerned people".

And would she be "right now on national Russian TV" if she claimed otherwise? Highly doubtful.