Kamila Valieva: Anti-doping Case and Follow-ups

[Anna K.]

Eteri frankly deserves all the scorn that's coming her way. The tide has been slowly turning against Eteri as we've witnessed the Usacheva's injury that obviously caused by repetitive stress, spatting with Kostornaia to get a 3A who ends up hurting herself, and over politicking for her daughter in ice dance. And then we have the current situation with Valieva. And then you have the open emotional manipulation of any skater who dares to leave(some of this may be kayfabe but it's still bad) and then the callous comments about diet and weight.

TBH, I don't think Eteri should be anyone's main coach for a while. There should be some kind of a buffer coach in between her and any student.

To be brutally realistic, my prognosis is: Eteri will stay.
It's hard to predict how the entire doping case will evolve. This is not just about figure skating, this is yet another chapter in the whole ROC case so we can expect that yet another compromise will be reached... or not. In either case Eteri will stay in charge and keep her methods at least in the nearest future. Why? Because the medals are still here and few are the coaches who deliver gold medals for Russia that consistently.
If rising the age limit will change inner competition in Russia and girls of same level coached by other teams will be in the game, then RusFed might consider life without Eteri. But definitely not earlier than that.

 

[Wafflecakes]

I guess what @[email protected] is trying to say is that we need to also consider certain cultural context here. It is clearly not a big deal in Russia to treat underage athletes the way we saw they have been treated during the women's competition. All the mistreatment is later supposedly rewarded with money, fame, state recognition etc... And that is worth it.

We may have opposing views over here but that's a norm over there. It doesn't matter what we think.

Don't care one iota about cultural norms.

If your culture is to mentally, physically, and pharmaceutically abuse children then your culture is wrong.

 

[Magill]

Don't care one iota about cultural norms.

If your culture is to mentally, physically, and pharmaceutically abuse children then your culture is wrong.

I do care about cultures a lot but I do not think a "culture of abuse" is among those we would want to protect under the notion of respect for the world's cultures, You can find people who will accept child abuse as a way to success, money and fame in any society. Being Russian does not make their claim any more justified or respectable. I do not believe this is specifically a part of Russian culture. Claiming that is just an excuse.

 

[matin calin]

The problem is when you give it all you don't win. There was nothing about "bad Eteri and her practices" in yesterday's Sasha's tears. It was about her not achieving the dream of her life. This is what matters to those girls most of all. Russia is no less free country than ... you name it.... Many people that I know took their kids out of figure skating. But some stay and those are who want to win - they would not care less about what "concerned people" care.

I started to question Eteri after seeing how Alena was treated but in this particular situation I don't see anything morbidly wrong. Though previously I reacted to Eteri and Daniel sitting there in K&C silently with sour faces when some of the girls skated below their level, essentially ignoring them which i think it's the worst.

But now I actually think they handled the situation in an ok way. Again maybe it's a cultural thing. You can show your support in many ways, does not have to be a maternal response everyone seems to see as the only appropriate. And we don't know what happens when there are no cameras around.

When she said "Why did you stop fighting?" she sounded sympathetic rather than judgemental imo. I did not detect any spite or irritation in her voice at least. Then KV was hugged the whole time and i've read that Eteri said something along the lines "There will be gold medals, right? On the Worlds, right?". Can someone confirm if she indeed said it?

 

[iceskater10]

I started to question Eteri after seeing how Alena was treated but in this particular situation I don't see anything morbidly wrong. Though previously I reacted to Eteri and Daniel sitting there in K&C silently with sour faces when some of the girls skated below their level, essentially ignoring them which i think it's the worst.

But now I actually think they handled the situation in an ok way. Again maybe it's a cultural thing. You can show your support in many ways, does not have to be a maternal response everyone seems to see as the only appropriate. And we don't know what happens when there are no cameras around.

When she said "Why did you stop fighting?" she sounded sympathetic rather than judgemental imo. I did not detect any spite or irritation in her voice at least. Then KV was hugged the whole time and i've read that Eteri said something along the lines "There will be gold medals, right? On the Worlds, right?". Can someone confirm if she indeed said it?

REALLY? I thought the whole thing was shameful!!

 

[matin calin]

REALLY? I thought the whole thing was shameful!!

You mean Eteri's first words when KV stepped off the ice? What would be the right way to respond in your opinion?

 

[iceskater10]

You mean Eteri's first words when KV stepped off the ice? What would be the right way to respond in your opinion?

As a Figure Skating coach for 40 years, this is not what the skater needs when coming off the ice after a subpar performance.
The skater already feels bad enough without being verbally assaulted by the coaching team. The time for that discussion at a later date.

 

[whatif]

You mean Eteri's first words when KV stepped off the ice? What would be the right way to respond in your opinion?

Actually, her exact words were "Why did you give up after the axel?" I mean does she REALLY not know the answer? What did she expect her to say? Was the coach living under rock this past week?

Well, Kamila did answer later in K&C after the scores. Her response was "They won't cancel the ceremony now..."

I mean there is being a tough coach and Russian culture and then there is just common sense and human empathy???

 

[Draculus]

Don't care one iota about cultural norms.
If your culture is to mentally, physically, and pharmaceutically abuse children then your culture is wrong.

Term 'abuse' has so much subjectivity that basically you said 'I do not like it'

 

[Wafflecakes]

Term 'abuse' has so much subjectivity that basically you said 'I do not like it'

Nothing about the situation is subjective at all.

Anyone who drugs a child is abusing them... period.

 

[Draculus]

I mean there is being a tough coach and Russian culture and then there is just common sense and human empathy???

Actually I do not see that Eteri value this in FS world. In other cases, non-FS related maybe but in FS her motto is 'fight-fight-fight', does not matter what happened, the only thing that is worth to reflex is 'what errors did I make, how to make them less probable, how to improve'.
She applies it to herself and to everybody around her. Age does not matter.

And somebody does not like it - 'you are not in a prison and free to go'.

 

[Wafflecakes]

And somebody does not like it - 'you are not in a prison and free to go'.

BS BS BS

This is a FIFTEEN YEAR OLD. If you pretend they have a real choice then you are lying to yourself.

 

[macy]

Nothing about the situation is subjective at all.

Anyone who drugs a child is abusing them... period.

not just this, but i have seen nothing from Eteri, nor the other two, that validates, humanizes or sympathizes with any of their students at these olympics. that in itself is emotional abuse and manipulation.

 

[Draculus]

Nothing about the situation is subjective at all.

I would say everything is subjective. Even test result if you did not perform it on your own.

Anyone who drugs a child is abusing them... period.

Well, since 'abuse' is a very subjective term you do not add clarity with such sentence.

 

[Wafflecakes]

I would say everything is subjective. Even test result if you did not perform it on your own.

Well, since 'abuse' is a very subjective term you do not add clarity with such sentence.

Anyone who thinks there is something subjective about the sentence...

"Drugging children with illegal substances for sports performance is abuse"

... is a psychopath.

 

[Draculus]

This is a FIFTEEN YEAR OLD. If you pretend they have a real choice then you are lying to yourself.

You do realize that you objectify Kamilla, do you? Basically you are saying that Kamilla opinion does matter, she is not an actor here. She is an object.

Nobody has a free choice in our world, everybody has their limits.
And do not forget that Eteri is not even a Kamilla legal guardian, she has parents.

 

[CrazyKittenLady]

sorry, wrong thread...

 

[Wafflecakes]

You do realize that you objectify Kamilla, do you? Basically you are saying that Kamilla opinion does matter, she is not an actor here. She is an object.

Nobody has a free choice in our world, everybody has their limits.
And do not forget that Eteri is not even a Kamilla legal guardian, she has parents.

... and her parents are just as guilty as Eteri for allowing it to happen.

Also, there is NOTHING objectifying about pointing out that a minor is a minor.

You are just gaslighting, and it is gross.

 

[matin calin]

verbally assaulted by the coaching team

Kamila was not verbally assaulted though? We only got to hear "Why did you stop fighting" and my impression was that it was not said in a accusing or spiteful way.

I think Eteri and possibly Daniel said a lot of comforting things in K&C later on, unfortunately it's hard to make out what was said since they were wearing masks.

 

[iceskater10]

Kamila was not verbally assaulted though? We only got to hear "Why did you stop fighting" and my impression was that it was not said in a accusing or spiteful way.

I think Eteri and possibly Daniel said a lot of comforting things in K&C later on, unfortunately it's hard to make out what was said since they were wearing masks.

The IOC president made a statement about Eteri's behavior..... Wasn't the doping issue enough now we have an abusive coaching team to top it off.