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I did not talk about conspiracy theories, you brought it up. I just said that in ly opinion, Belbin/Agosto were robbed this year, I prefered their OD and their FD over the Russians, especially the FD.

I do not think that conspiracies are theories when the whole judging system has been revamped because of conspiracies. When something has been proven, it is no longer a theory.

I just said I did not understand how Winkler / Lohse and Chait / Sakhnovski ever got on the podium. I mean I really did not see anything special or enjoyable enough about their skating to see them on a World podium.

As far as Lobacheva / Averbukh and Fusar-Poli / Margaglio... Well L/A deserved to be on the podium, but WC, I don't think so.

FP/M? Really, you are defending these guys? Margaglio is the poorest male dancer ever as far as skills are concerned. FP/M should never even have been on the podium at all.

The year they were WC is the lowest point in the history of Ice Dancing.

Can we agree to disagree on this one?

I have a question. When are conspiracies in Ice Dancing be proven?

Belbin/Agosto are my favourites for years and I like them surely more than Kokhlova/Novitski (and I liked them more than Navka/Kostomarov). But were B/A robbed? I don´t think so. They won FD over K/N and they became for her OD a higher PCS too. But remember their CD and her fall.

I don´t want to discuss about Lobacheva/Averbukh, Fusar-Poli/Margaglio, Winkler/Lohse, Chait/Sakhnovski and the history of Ice Dancing. The personal preferences are so different. My favourites at that time were Bourne/Kraatz.
 
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I have a question. When are conspiracies in Ice Dancing be proven?


If your favorite team is B-K, then you'll remember that BEFORE the Nagano Olympics, the "French" team bragged about getting the bronze over them. And they did.

Then there has been the Salt Lake Olympics scandal that blew it all in the open. Remember that?

Between the two, there has been many stories in the media when you could see judges communicating with their feet or other means during competitions to agree about where to place such and such.

And of course, that lead to the new scoring system.

As far as B-A this year, their CD was a big mistake, but I believe that they have been marked way down on their OD for no apparent reason.
 
It's funny, I liked K/N more on TV then I did LIVE. Everything is so much bigger and closer than life on TV and Live is just how it fits into the huge auditorium.

I think all these senior dancers have all the technical required to win and only mistakes on that night will reduce the scores. So when I do not see any technical mistakes in the dancers, I go for the team that pleases my psyche.

Some nice surprises: Weaver/Pujol who did a Russian folk dance better than any 20 others. Also Pechalait/Borzat who did a very believeable Framenco.

Unfortunately, Charlie and Meryl do not make an interesting team for my psyche.
Navarro/Bommentre were good and somewhat undermarked, imo.

Joe
 
Does anyone think K/N really slow down during steps and that their edging could be a lot deeper?


I do. Im a fan of them but thats definetly their main weakness. It cuts the flow specially on the FD.They seriously need to work much harder on that next seasons. They are awesome in the other areas. Still, they had an overall really solid competition and their medal is more than well deserved.;)

And I dunno about B/A being undermarked in the OD. I thought they were great but their placement was right, the top 3 were much better plus the score for their CD was very very generous, a mistake like that could have been much worse.
 
... Still, they had an overall really solid competition and their medal is more than well deserved.;)

And I dunno about B/A being undermarked in the OD. I thought they were great but their placement was right, the top 3 were much better plus the score for their CD was very very generous, a mistake like that could have been much worse.

About K-N, I just find it really fishy that out of nowhere, this team just peaks in time to medal at the WC. It just looks like there HAD to be one russian couple top 3.

And about B-A, well then, I don't agree at all. That's it, gloves are off!
I'll fight you to the grave about this one!!

Just kidding, of course.

I'll just hire some goons to make you see why you are wrong.
Just leave me your coordinates so they know where to find you.
 
About K-N, I just find it really fishy that out of nowhere, this team just peaks in time to medal at the WC. It just looks like there HAD to be one russian couple top 3.

And about B-A, well then, I don't agree at all. That's it, gloves are off!
I'll fight you to the grave about this one!!

Just kidding, of course.

I'll just hire some goons to make you see why you are wrong.
Just leave me your coordinates so they know where to find you.


LOL your selective memory is amazing, but at least now you are being funny so its all good :thumbsup:;)
 
This judging panel helps me see how Khoklova & Novitski shot up the rankings so quickly.


Ms. Alla SHEKHOVTSEVA Russia
Ms. Raia BISSEROVA-BAKALOVA Bulgaria
Ms. Laimute KRAUZIENE Lithuania
Ms. Anne SARASKIN Estonia

Ms. Heide MARITCZAK Austria
Mr. Laurent CARRIERE France
Ms. Katalin ALPERN Italy
Ms. Mieko FUJIMORI Japan
Mr. Hongguo REN China
Mr. Charles Z. CYR United States
Ms. Jodi ABBOTT Canada
Ms. Hilary SELBY Great Britain



I googled the Russian judge and her name came up in an article entitled, "The dirt on ice dancing".


This is all I need to know! You can use any judging system you want, but unfortunately, the judging panel seems to be just as important as the actual skating. It makes me sad.
well lets look
Ms. Anne SARASKIN Estonia[/B] more likelly to be in IGOR camp
both Canadian and American judges would work for IGOR
Ms. Raia BISSEROVA-BAKALOVA Bulgaria has been a rival of russian for the last 8 years why join now???:biggrin:
also tell me who was the teck specialist? CANADIAN
 
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its a known fact when you are the countries number 1 couple your scores improve look at V/M from last year and compare with D/W which stayed no 2
 
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^ By kidnapping Igor Shpilband from Russia, the U.S. Axis now has a double agent in the enemy camp. Other nations don't have a chance against the unholy U.S.-Russia alliance. We let the French and Canadian teams win this year just to lull them into a false sense of security, hehe. ;)
 
This judging panel helps me see how Khoklova & Novitski shot up the rankings so quickly.


Ms. Alla SHEKHOVTSEVA Russia
Ms. Raia BISSEROVA-BAKALOVA Bulgaria
Ms. Laimute KRAUZIENE Lithuania
Ms. Anne SARASKIN Estonia

Ms. Heide MARITCZAK Austria
Mr. Laurent CARRIERE France
Ms. Katalin ALPERN Italy
Ms. Mieko FUJIMORI Japan
Mr. Hongguo REN China
Mr. Charles Z. CYR United States
Ms. Jodi ABBOTT Canada
Ms. Hilary SELBY Great Britain

Why the heck should an Estonian and a Lithuanian judge work with the Russians anyway? That's not logical, at least not from a political and historical standpoint. They don't want to have anything to do with Russia, they fought for their independance, they fought for their culture and their language, hundreds of thousands Lithuanians were killed during Soviet occupation, the Soviet-Union tried to assimilate the Baltic countries by encouraging Russians to move there! They joined the NATO and the EU, defying the former occupying force.

There are lots of Russians living in these countries, but e.g. the name of the Lithuanian judge is ending on "-iene" which is typical for lots of Lithuanian last names and her first name is also a common Lithuanian name. So I don't think that she belongs to the 5% Russians who are still living in the country.


That conspiracy seems rather unlikely. If there were judges from Belarus, Ukraine or other countries who are known for their pro-Russian leanings - I might consider a conspiracy.
 
^ By kidnapping Igor Shpilband from Russia, the U.S. Axis now has a double agent in the enemy camp. Other nations don't have a chance against the unholy U.S.-Russia alliance. We let the French and Canadian teams win this year just to lull them into a false sense of security, hehe. ;)
well Americans didn't kidnapped IGOR but yes he is a double edge sword
 
well Americans didn't kidnapped IGOR but yes he is a double edge sword


Igor's english is quite excellent btw...I can tell he's quite good at what he does, and loves what he does, but I just hope he doesn't turn into another Morozov. But I do think he and Marina work the best for Scott and Tessa, if not so much for the other 2 teams....
 
Between the two, there has been many stories in the media when you could see judges communicating with their feet or other means during competitions to agree about where to place such and such.

With all do respects, sir, this was in the pairs competition, not the ice dance.
 
This judging panel helps me see how Khoklova & Novitski shot up the rankings so quickly.


Ms. Alla SHEKHOVTSEVA Russia
Ms. Raia BISSEROVA-BAKALOVA Bulgaria
Ms. Laimute KRAUZIENE Lithuania
Ms. Anne SARASKIN Estonia

Ms. Heide MARITCZAK Austria
Mr. Laurent CARRIERE France
Ms. Katalin ALPERN Italy
Ms. Mieko FUJIMORI Japan
Mr. Hongguo REN China
Mr. Charles Z. CYR United States
Ms. Jodi ABBOTT Canada
Ms. Hilary SELBY Great Britain



I googled the Russian judge and her name came up in an article entitled, "The dirt on ice dancing".


This is all I need to know! You can use any judging system you want, but unfortunately, the judging panel seems to be just as important as the actual skating. It makes me sad.
also maybe a bit unlucky for Khoklova & Novitski that the teck/specialist wasn't Russian...:rofl:
 
Unless she country hopped again, Katalin Alpern is from Israel (previously Hungary).

She has been country-hopping, hasn't she? I remember she's had the honor of judging the Olympics for two different countries. Now she is well on her way for judging for a third.
 
With all do respects, sir, this was in the pairs competition, not the ice dance.


What gives you the impression I'm a dude? :scratch:

Anyway, I hardly see that as proof that ice dance is, and always was, squeaky clean . Just my opinion.
 
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