Kamila Valieva: Anti-doping Case and Follow-ups

[Minz]

The "heart condition" ( athlete's heart) she had is considered benign, is very common in young athletes, and does not require treatment. She just had a low heart rate and other slightly strange test results. This happens to many young athletes who are training hard. It doesn't require treatment so she couldn't get a TUE for it. I suspect WADA mentioned this to show that she was training hard and a medication like Trimetazidine would provide additional benefit to her because it would allow her to train harder and recover quicker. Anyway, her team couldn't use this as an excuse because that would require them to acknowledge that the drug was given purposefully. So, ridiculous explanations were tried instead.

Ah, okay. That makes sense. I was just confused for a sec.

 

[TontoK]

You know, I understand why Eteri Tutberidze does not like to communicate with journalists. Any statement can be interpreted by people like you in a way that makes everybody hair stand on end.

Well, if you don’t understand, then I’ll explain what Tarasova’s statement means: she says that in Eteri’s position, she would take the blame on herself only in order to spare the athlete from punishment, because the athlete is her student, almost her child , and the mother must use every opportunity to save her child from danger. Moreover, this is not even a call for some kind of self-incrimination - Tarasova simply says that the coach is fully responsible for the athlete. To make some kind of “insight” out of this, to say “the culprit has been named” is just very stupid, sorry for the directness.

On top of that, I’m not at all sure of Tarasova’s sincerity. They had conflicts many times, and Eteri, for example, believes that it was Tarasova who was to blame for the fact that Zhenya Medvedeva gained excess weight, was injured because of this, and “ran away to Orser.”

In general, you took the soap opera typical of our figure skating seriously and are trying to turn it into a Greek tragedy. Sports.ru journalists call Tarasova literally every other day, ask her different questions on different topics and immediately receive what they needed - emotional, ill-considered and often frankly ridiculous answers. And this is just one example of such answers.

What you say about Tarasova is true. She talks nonsense frequently. But has she ever expressed an opinion that is not the one held, at least for the moment, by the "higher ups?" Anything that conflicts with the Russian Federation's point of view?

More to the point: Do you honestly think that if the ruling class believes it to be advantageous to throw Eteri to the wolves they would hesitate for an instant?

 

[Mathman]

What you say about Tarasova is true. She talks nonsense frequently.

My all-time favorite Tatiana Tarasova quote is what she allegedly said after Tara Lipinski beat Michelle Kwan at the 1998 Olympics. "Why didn't Framk Carroll just slip us (the Russian contingent) a bottle of Vodka? What did we care which American girl won."

(She probably didn't actually say it, but it was reported at the time and makes a good story. )

 

[Skating91]

Genuine question here. I see people say this all the time but is this actually true? Kamila had a number of other medications in her system which were, clearly, allowed due to a TUE.

No, she had Hypoxen which seems like snake oil like a lot of supplements but is perfectly legal, and L-carnitine which is very common all around the world and perfectly legal. She doesn't need a TUE for legal supplements.

That hasn't stopped anyone for two years into twisting that into Kamila having two other heart drugs in her system therefore she must have been doping and is guilty....

 

[Skating91]

TMZ can be purchased without a prescription in Russia. Some do crush medication because they can't swallow pills for whatever reason.

It seems far fetched, but Kamila genuinely doesn't know how it got into system, and having tested all supplements, food, cosmetics, reviewed CCTV, there was no proof, then maybe the only person she has contact with that takes TMZ is the grandfather so they use that theory. Of course, testing supplements,, food, reviewing CCTV would have been difficult or impossible because by the time Kamila was notified of the positive test and arrived back in Russia (the hit took place in St Petersburg as well), the evidence she needed to clear her name might have disappeared anyway.

If WADA had of returned the result in the required 20 days for a non-priority sample (would have been mid-January at the latest), then Kamila could have commenced the investigation much earlier. This should have been taken into account by CAS.

The 15 year old swimmer caught twice for doping and given a reprimand didn't even offer a theory, she merely told them that it must have been contamination or sabotage with no proof to back it up. However, they still give her a reprimand while WADA were demanding 4 years for Kamila early onwhile the investigation by RUSADA was still ongoing. It's disgraceful.

Cox initially was only given a 2 year suspension and this was acceptable to WADA despite her excuse at the time being contamination tap water. Absurd, but WADA were happy to accept 2 years instead of 4 despite her being an adult.

It's very unfair to target one child like this with 4 years, when her excuses is no worse than tap water and better than offering multiple theories with no proof like the 15 year old swimmer.

So that's three cases with a lot of similarities, but punishment ranges from reprimand with almost no punishment for two separate positive tests and no proof of sabotage or contamination offered, 2 years for the adult swimmer who used a tap water defense (obviously with no proof because she later on was able to prove it were supplements), then 4 years for the child who used the defense of contaminated food. There is no consistency at all.

 

[humbaba]

No, Russian appeal is about GOLD medal, nothing is sorted

My understanding is the CAS ruling can only be appealed on narrow procedural grounds. I think it's very unlikely the ISU will reconsider disallowing Valieva's scores no matter how much Russia squawks. So the gold and silver likely are sorted.

I'm not sure about Canada's appeal of how the ISU recalculated the scores. That seems to be a whole different issue.

 

[Caliban]

My understanding is the CAS ruling can only be appealed on narrow procedural grounds. I think it's very unlikely the ISU will reconsider disallowing Valieva's scores no matter how much Russia squawks. So the gold and silver likely are sorted.

I'm not sure about Canada's appeal of how the ISU recalculated the scores. That seems to be a whole different issue.

CAS decision has nothing to do with medals, and team member DQ doesn't mean that team should lose gold medal (as LOTS OF EXAMPLES show in this thread)

So nothing is sorted about gold. On other hand, Canada can freely have their bronze, Russia don't care about it. From Russian point of view it is between Canada and Japan.

 

[icewhite]

One thing I have not yet understood: I have often read that the other skaters had their test results by then and knew they were negative. Was it really only Valieva's which was not there yet? Just the one that turned out to be negative? Is that because it takes longer when it's positive, or is that supposed to be a complete coincidence that they did not mark this as priority? Is it even true the others all had their results by then?

 

[DancingCactus]

I fear at this point we will never know what really happened. All I know at this point is, Valieva tested positive. She couldn't prove to CAS that it was not intentional. She retroactively got banned for 4 years and will be stripped of all medals.

Everything else is speculation.

The team event point reallocation shenaningans are a different matter. The ISU really makes it hard to believe that they don't have a pro-Russian bias. When the CAS verdict was made public, EVERYONE expected Canada to get Bronze. That weird curveball of not moving up the women from the other countries really came out of nowhere.

 

[moonvine]

Pretty much that. Some dopers refuse to give them back, but there’s not much the IOC can really do to pursue that.

But they were never given out.

 

[skatingguy]

One thing I have not yet understood: I have often read that the other skaters had their test results by then and knew they were negative. Was it really only Valieva's which was not there yet? Just the one that turned out to be negative? Is that because it takes longer when it's positive, or is that supposed to be a complete coincidence that they did not mark this as priority? Is it even true the others all had their results by then?

IIRC the other samples were marked appropriately, but Valieva's was not.

 

[Szayel008]

One thing I have not yet understood: I have often read that the other skaters had their test results by then and knew they were negative. Was it really only Valieva's which was not there yet? Just the one that turned out to be negative? Is that because it takes longer when it's positive, or is that supposed to be a complete coincidence that they did not mark this as priority? Is it even true the others all had their results by then?

They say that she wasn’t the only one who had problems with the samples. Allegedly, one athlete asked WADA officials in Tallinn to speed up the verification of the sample because his sample had not been tested until now. And it seems that the result came to him a month after the laboratory received the sample (this is around January 29-30).

 

[Caliban]

Lol, waiting for conspiracy theorists here to comment on that "narrative shift":

Honored Coach of the USSR Tatyana Tarasova reacted to Yana Rudkovskaya's post about Eteri Tutberidze.

Recall that Rudkovskaya, the wife of two-time Olympic champion Yevgeny Plushenko, previously condemned Tutberidze's comment about the conviction of Kamila Valieva, in particular, noting that Eteri's entire post "oozes arrogance."

"Who is Yana Rudkovskaya to discuss Eteri Tutberidze? She just Zhenya Plushenko's wife."

Тарасова: «А кто такая Яна Рудковская, чтобы обсуждать Этери Тутберидзе?» - Sport24

Заслуженный тренер СССР Татьяна Тарасова отреагировала на пост Яны Рудковской об Этери Тутберидзе .

sport24.ru

 

[icewhite]

Lol, waiting for conspiracy theorists here to comment on that "narrative shift":

Тарасова: «А кто такая Яна Рудковская, чтобы обсуждать Этери Тутберидзе?» - Sport24

Заслуженный тренер СССР Татьяна Тарасова отреагировала на пост Яны Рудковской об Этери Тутберидзе .

sport24.ru

I don't get why you think it's a conspiracy theory that the narrative is changing - maybe because of the word narrative - but let's call it perception or public image or discussion - don't you see a change there?

(I think everyone knows that Plushenko and Rudkovskaya have their own reasons to say this and nobody except their fans can take Rudkovskaya's words about Eteri and Kamila seriously - doesn't change anything for me.)

 

[Caliban]

But has she ever expressed an opinion that is not the one held, at least for the moment, by the "higher ups?" Anything that conflicts with the Russian Federation's point of view?

You mean like last season when she was kicked from commenting FS events by Channel One after saying that Plushenko skaters were underscored? Something like this?

 

[indujaa]

From the articles of sports.ru it seems they have decided to sacrifice kamila. Not many of the active coaches or figure skaters were bluntly against the CAS decision , even officials seem to be only against 4year punishment not the punishment it self. I guess they figured it's a lost cause to defend what could not be defended on CAS. Only the public comments seem to want kamila to be in a protected environment , encouraging her to study and do what interests her and live a good life.
The decision to give russia bronze was the biggest surprise of all. But wise decision from ISU they decided not to burn the bridge.

 

[macy]

Apparently Anna Scherbakova unfollowed Eteri on IG (most likely today?), the same day as Eteri says Kamila is the most gifted skater +++ and then suddenly there is a source about the team members knew about the doping test before the team event.

The timing is....


Edit: Anna S not following Eteri on Instagram is not a conspiracy though, you can see it for yourself. If it happen today though I can´t say for sure but most likely fans would have noticed before.

 

[beachmouse]

Someone else waded through the ISU rulebook, which presumably was what the Olympics were using, and it sounds like Canada has a legitimate complaint under rule 353, which states, thanks to this site-

TSX BULLETIN: ISU re-scoring of the Beijing 2022 Team Event appears to contradict its own rules! - The Sports Examiner

★ The Sports Examiner: Chronicling the key competitive, economic and political forces shaping elite sport and the Olympic Movement.★ ★ To get The Sports Examiner by e-mail: sign up here! ★ ★ Friends: The bill is in for technical support costs. Donors have already picked up 30% of the total, but...

www.thesportsexaminer.com

In section 4, titled “Publication of Results,” the text is clear about scoring for disqualified competitors:

“Disqualified Competitors will lose their placements and be officially noted in the intermediate and final results as disqualified (DSQ). Competitors having finished the competition and who initially placed lower than the disqualified Competitor(s) will move up accordingly in their placement(s).”

 

[Caliban]

Someone else waded through the ISU rulebook, which presumably was what the Olympics were using, and it sounds like Canada has a legitimate complaint under rule 353, which states, thanks to this site-

Funny thing is that Canadian Fed seems for some unknown reason cant find the rule which say that Rule 353 must be used in such circumstances for TEAM EVENT. Any one know why they cant find such rule?

And ISU is treating this exactly as ONE EVENT, so they simply substract Kami score from ROC score and this is all. For ISU there are no separate results in pairs, dance, singles, for them there is only total result for event.

So Canadian Fed must find the rule about which i said, or they must convince ISU that rule 353 is indeed applicable here. And for some reason i think that such attempt will take a lot of work and time from their and ISU lawyers.

 

[DancingCactus]

Do they have to? Because he rule also doesn't say "I only apply to single comeptitions NOT team events". Not a lawyer so I don't know.
It's just a bad look to give bronze to Russia if everyone expected it to go to Canada.