Kamila Valieva: Anti-doping Case and Follow-ups

[el henry]

Sha'Carri Richardson was found with a drug a year ago, and she is a 100m world champion now... So, what? (And Im not ironic now, i see no problem in it, its not the end of the world if you failed one doping test, especially from the organizations who cant do that doping test properly)... So, i dont see any point in your period, to be fair...

Here's a list of the people/athletes who have jack squat to do with Kamila Valieva and her current situation:

Some Jamaican swimmer, Sha'Carri Richardson, any athlete on a valid approved TUE, ...

in short, anyone not named or associated with Kamila Valieva, anyone not associated with Team Tut, RusFed or RUSADA. The three entities responsible for this young woman's situation. All else is background noise and may be safely disregarded.

My point stands quite well, in my own humble opinion.

 

[Baron Vladimir]

I´m not sure what athletes you are talking about, but Bjørndalen did not have asthma or take medications for it.

I clearly remember i read leaked transcript of TUE athletes, and some of top athletes were on it, including him, but OK... Maybe its his brother or another athlete, but im sure you cant find those illegal scripts on the net anymore...

 

[TallyT]

I clearly remember i read leaked transcript of TUE athletes, and some of top athletes were on it, including him, but OK... Oh wait, maybe its his brother...

Link, please.

 

[beachmouse]

If you are a 15 year old Jamaican swimmer you don't need to provide evidence for multiple positive samples and escape with a reprimand, if you are a adult swimmer you can claim you were contaminated from tap water and WADA won't take this to CAS (which would be a slam dunk 4 years), if you are Jon Jones USADA which talks a big game for two year will give a repeat offender, maybe the worst doper in the world 1 year and 3 months. No-one has cheated the system like Jon Jones but USADA slap him with a 1 year 3 month suspension in a combat sport where they only perform once a year anyway.

I would have no problem with the punishment if WADA were as vindictive with every other person who tests positive as they are with a 15 year old girl with a sample that took 10 tests and 6 weeks to confirm if it was positive.

If you’re a 14 year old Indian swimmer with a positive drug test, you are suspended immediately and removed from the start list of the Asian Games, a major international event.

c) Despite the fact that he had a weak heart and had suffered four heart
attacks, Mr Solovyov drove two hours every day to drive the Athlete to
the Ice Palace which was 200m away from the Athlete’s apartment.

In fairness it sounds quite reasonable:

f. Because she works, Ms Alsu Valieva asked Mr Solovyov to escort the Athlete
to the Ice Palace and to attend the training sessions. Mr Solovyov drove from
his house in Lukashenko village to the Athlete’s house and then drove the
Athlete to the Ice Palace for the morning session. He did so in order to ensure
her safety (“so that no one knows her home address”) and to be there in case of
an emergency (such as an injury). Mr Solovyov then escorted the Athlete home
where they had lunch, often prepared by him; they then returned to the Ice Palace
for the afternoon session. Ms Alsu Valieva went to the Ice Palace at 16:30 in
order to take the Athlete home after training.

To me, this sounds like a grandfather who wants to have a chance to talk to his grandchild every day, have sing-along on the car radio and such, and I genuinely hope that the doping mess hasn’t damaged their relationship beyond repair.

I´m wondering, how does athletes fabricate diagnosis to get a certain medication? Doctors could loose their medical license for giving described medicine fabricating diagnosis, surely they could perhaps even go to jail for fabricating. To get asthma medicine you need a diagnosis, and for diagnosis you have to actual tests to get it. All predictions medications is recorded in medical system as well as the diagnosis. It´s hard to believe that someone would risk their medical career for giving out medication by fabricating diagnosis.

Banned running coach Alberto Salazar reportedly had doctors who would write a script for specific medial conditions that would get an athlete a TUE. There are doctors who like the money from such office visits.

 

[Baron Vladimir]

Link, please.

I can go in jail, if i send you No really, it was just a list of medication those athletes can use, nothing spectacular, but it was supposed to be confidential, as any medical file... And i was in Thailand when i got access to it, so...

 

[Magill]

I can go in jail, if i send you No really, it was just a list of medication those athletes can use, nothing spectacular, but it was supposed to be confidential, as any medical file...

So if it was an illegal leak how do you know it was authentic?

 

[Baron Vladimir]

So if it was an illegal leak how do you know it was authentic?

Because many of famous athletes as Simone Biles for example, said they take the medicine for the condition they have after it was leaked... But I mean, I cant be sure of course...

 

[ramurphy2005]

To me, this sounds like a grandfather who wants to have a chance to talk to his grandchild every day, have sing-along on the car radio and such, and I genuinely hope that the doping mess hasn’t damaged their relationship beyond repair.

He's not related to her at all. He was the father of someone Kamila's mother was dating.

 

[TallyT]

I can go in jail, if i send you No really, it was just a list of medication those athletes can use, nothing spectacular, but it was supposed to be confidential, as any medical file... And i was in Thailand when i got access to it, so...

Then, as I have been told by other folk (and yes I know how annoying it is) "proof or it didn't happen."

 

[Baron Vladimir]

Then, as I have been told by other folk (and yes I know how annoying it is) "proof or it didn't happen."

Well, for me personally it did happen in Thailand, so... If you want details, we can go private

 

[Alex Fedorov]

I´m wondering, how does athletes fabricate diagnosis to get a certain medication? Doctors could loose their medical license for giving described medicine fabricating diagnosis, surely they could perhaps even go to jail for fabricating. To get asthma medicine you need a diagnosis, and for diagnosis you have to actual tests to get it. All predictions medications is recorded in medical system as well as the diagnosis. It´s hard to believe that someone would risk their medical career for giving out medication by fabricating diagnosis.

Btw, the example about Ole Einar Bjørndalen is not even true. Bjørndalen did not have problem with his breath and did not use asthma medication. The allegations were fabricated in Russia media with the voice of Dratschev claiming the whole biathlon team was using asthma medicine, but were untrue allegations. Asthma medication in biathlon is not common because the medicine like Ventoline can give side affects as tremors in hands which are very unlucky during shooting.

Bjørndalen is not agree with you:



from 27:26

" I'm lucky because after a 25-30 year career my lungs are still clean. I've never trained while sick. My lungs did not require any medication. I have never used any asthma medications. Every year I have my lungs examined - they are always healthy.

All athletes should know that if they have asthma, they can take asthma medications. But these medications must be specifically for asthma and must be prescribed by a doctor. This prescription is now easy to obtain in Norway. Too many athletes use TUE in both Germany and Sweden. They are very easy to get everywhere. It is not right. Norway should not issue TUEs to Norwegian athletes, Russia - to Russian ones. A neutral organization should be created to deal with TUE issues.

I know many athletes who don't have asthma but do have TUE. This is not good. 50-60 percent of skiers in the world use anti-asthmatic drugs - this is harmful to their health in the end."

In other words, there are doctors who ready to fabricate false diagnoses for “asthmatics”, and athletes are not afraid of the deterioration in the quality of shooting, and TUE are drawn up much easier than you imagine.

 

[Baron Vladimir]

In other words, there are doctors who ready to fabricate false diagnoses for “asthmatics”, and athletes are not afraid of the deterioration in the quality of shooting, and TUE are drawn up much easier than you imagine.

I dont think those diseases are fabricated tho, majority of the athletes really needs those medications... My point was why theirs sport federations in Russia, USA or Norway are allowing them to train to be a world top athletes with any kind of condition they have... Which was supposed to be connected with Kamila, and the topic of this tread, but as always, i went too over the topic instead

 

[TallyT]

Well, for me personally it did happen in Thailand, so... If you want details, we can go private

Nah, if it was illegal I am happy to stay out of it.

On the subject of medication generally, I know Yuzuru took asthma medication which was approved as everyone could see he had the condition (he won medals with blue lips!). Anyone with a genuine need can I guess apply for an exemption..?

 

[TallyT]

He's not related to her at all. He was the father of someone Kamila's mother was dating.

If he exists.

(Sorry, but as someone who does write fiction, I still can't get past that...)

 

[ramurphy2005]

If he exists.

(Sorry, but as someone who does write fiction, I still can't get past that...)

Yeah.....I'm still shaking my head at that part, too.

 

[Alex Fedorov]

not very long ago in equestrian sport there was a case when doping was found in a horse’s blood, and in order to justify this, during the trial of the case in the CAS, a story was told that the horse ate hay, on which a person who had taken this drug had previously urinated. This story was accepted as true. I don't know, but I don't see how the strawberry dessert story is worse.

It's pretty stupid that the trial turns out to be not a search for the truth, but a tall tale-telling competition. The way the defense behaved in the Valieva case is largely explained by the Krushelnitsky precedent. This athlete honestly stated that he had no idea how meldonium got into his sample. And he immediately received a 4-year disqualification. WADA ignored the fact that meldonium is useless in curling, and also that the test results looked as if Krushelnitsky had taken a huge dose of doping immediately before taking the test, and not before the competition. No softening! Get your 4 years, you cheater!

 

[Alex Fedorov]

I dont think those diseases are fabricated tho, majority of the athletes really needs those medications... My point was why theirs sport federations in Russia, USA or Norway are allowing them to train to be a world top athletes with any kind of condition they have... Which was supposed to be connected with Kamila, and the topic of this tread, but as always, i went too over the topic instead

Yuzuru Hanyu really has asthma. This was noticeable many times, and the disease hindered him and don't helped him. But find at least one person among the skiers who would be like Yuzuru. At least one person whose asthma would prevent him from winning, as happened with Yuzuru. No, these are hefty guys with excellent muscles and any of them breathes much better than, for example, me, and I have never had asthma.

 

[Minz]

They have to actually establish he and his medicine and his glass of water and his strawberry dessert exist first.

You would think that if he did exist, he would probably be able to provide some sort of (even very short) testimony at the hearing.

Like, really, they couldn't think of anything, anything better than this crazy theory?

 

[Amei]

So, to summarize, i see a reason why ROC is stripped of the gold medal. However, I see no reason why Kamila got 4 years ban (instead one)

She got a 4 year ban because her defense was boiled down to "I didn't take it and you should trust me even though I have no evidence that supports this statement", there's an actual statement in the document released today that there's no proof from Valieva that this "grandfather" actually exists. A defense that boils down to 'trust me' should never equal a reduced suspension.

 

[TallyT]

not very long ago in equestrian sport there was a case when doping was found in a horse’s blood, and in order to justify this, during the trial of the case in the CAS, a story was told that the horse ate hay, on which a person who had taken this drug had previously urinated. This story was accepted as true. I don't know, but I don't see how the strawberry dessert story is worse.

I dunno, and as I have said I am sorry for Valieva, but given everything I've seen since joining this fandom I would personally find hay with urine dressing way more believable than a homemade strawberry dessert that was sturdy enough to travel several days with her and enough taste but not too many enough calories (aka less than that glass of water at the least) for a Team Tut skater to feel safe eating before a competition. I just... really, does anyone believe it?