2025 Grand Prix de France Men's Short Program

[museksk8r]

Good thing Chris was here. Why some don't like him, I'm not quite sure.

He very rarely says anything meaningful or knowledgeable and often remarks clean as a whistle when a jump is egregiously under-rotated. He’s the king of frivolous platitudes and catchphrases and his commentary is heavily biased as well.

 

[Arigato]

He very rarely says anything meaningful or knowledgeable and often remarks clean as a whistle when a jump is egregiously under-rotated. He’s the king of frivolous platitudes and catchphrases and his commentary is heavily biased as well.

Considering the "I'm for sale" commentary bought and paid for in my country, calling Chris biased would be rather myopic on my part. But then some tend to ignore elephants in a room.

 

[Skater Boy]

Exactly my thoughts. He wins with his tech nad this is ok, he hes highest tech content, don't make him an artist he just isn't. It's doing him disservice and is unfair to skaters who actually are artists.

Ilia has improved artitically and skating skills or more masking and careful presentation but I find the judges over mark him pc. He gets Patrick Chan/Jason Brown scores. And those two - andm aybe Jeffrey Buttle and Lambiel are rare exceptions. Even better skating skills than Hanyu. Ilia is more in the vein of Nathan Chen - good skaters but let's not overly pump up their artistry and skaitng skills. In fact look at a lower level skater like Keegan Messing - he may not usually do the "artistic" skates - high brow, classical music but he is a rarity in that he has good skating skills when he skates to rock and roll or whatever. But these are excceptions. Ilia's ps are ridiculous. He is the exception technically and rightfully so gets the huge marks but pc wise this is ridiculous. And as much as we complain and whine about the Eteri day s really Ilia is like the Eteri girls. REally pressed the tech. But pc wise Ilia is kind of like the Eteri girls many who were developed/considered artistic like Evgenia, Anna S. No doubt Ilia should be first despite not his best skate here but let's not gift him like it is Christmas, Hannaku and Festivus all wrapped up in one. Incredible pcs should go to the rare skaters like Jason or a Patrick. Come olympics which tends to get inflated scores is Ilia going to get 47/48 pts for pcs in the sp???

 

[reader3]

Good job from Ilia Will have to watch the other top guys later. Egadze is really coming along this year.

 

[TontoK]

Shallow thoughts:

I like the fact that it is a costume, a real costume, of course I expected Gladiator, but with Ilia, that's not going to happen.

I like the hair. I think it suits him. Then again, my father had beautiful curly blond hair,, so I may be prejudiced,

What I think about the program is irrelevant. A force of nature. Congratulations.

This is very close to my position.

I'm a great admirer of Ilia's skating over the past few years, but neither of his programs are what I'd hope for in an Olympic season. And that's fine. Because he's attempting to bring HIS vision to the ice. It's not my point of view, but it is HIS. I'd love to see a reborn Toller Cranston skating with those draw-dropping quads, but that's not who he is and he's not pretending to be. There are some parallels, though. Toller's skating was authentic to himself, and so is Ilia's. Like them or not, his programs don't feel "fake."

Side note: I love the set up for the 3A, with those rolling back crossovers into a rocker entry. It was musical, interesting, and unique.

 

[Blades of Passion]

he's attempting to bring HIS vision to the ice. he's not pretending to be. Like them or not, his programs don't feel "fake."

There is no real vision in Ilia's skating. He IS pretending to be something - his programs all shoehorn in "edgy, hip" rap music because he thinks that's what he needs to mimic to look "cool". He is absolutely not a rapper, nor does he give off the vibe in his performances of having lived a hard life or needing to battle against oppression, against which he uses rap music to express himself and personify his emotions. Even just in terms of the superficial mimicry he is attempting, his demeanor is hardly threatening. He's trying to pass himself off as "hard and gangster-like", when in reality he's privileged, sheltered, scrawny straight white guy who happens to be able to rotate quickly on ice skates.

 

[TontoK]

There is no real vision in Ilia's skating. He IS pretending to be something - his programs all shoehorn in "edgy, hip" rap music because he thinks that's what he needs to mimic to look "cool". He is absolutely not a rapper, nor does he give off the vibe in his performances of having lived a hard life or needing to battle against oppression, against which he uses rap music to express himself and personify his emotions. Even just in terms of the superficial mimicry he is attempting, his demeanor is hardly threatening. He's trying to pass himself off as "hard and gangster-like", when in reality he's privileged, sheltered, scrawny straight white guy who happens to be able to rotate quickly on ice skates.

Assuming your characterization of Ilia is correct, do you know what privileged straight white guys listen to?

It ain't Puccini, and they don't aspire to cosplay Di Vinci art.

Edit: And I disagree with you that there's no real vision. He's consistently strong and daring, youthfully athletic, fast, more acrobatic and more traditionally masculine. A little smashmouth and brash. Do I hope he evolves as he gets older? Sure, but that's MY hope, and he may or may not. Aside from his Malaguena short program a couple of seasons ago, his music selections have been pretty original, and even with that SP, he didn't go with the expected cuts. And if you've watched some of his competitors, I'd say he's moving skating in his direction.

 

[Bookseller]

no.. but his last showing doesn't scream "qualified automatically for the games". to me.

Despite the fact that he won the silver medal. Jason is not known to be an early season skater. He will continue to get better. But he doesn't have an automatic in. He has a track record that will be strongly considered. It's up to the other guys to beat him. So far, they haven't.

 

[4everchan]

Despite the fact that he won the silver medal. Jason is not known to be an early season skater. He will continue to get better. But he doesn't have an automatic in. He has a track record that will be strongly considered. It's up to the other guys to beat him. So far, they haven't.

I am rooting for him. And you are right, he is a later season skater, as a matter of fact, some years he didn't even bother with GP.
My point was mostly that he is not an automatic qualifier like some fans think he is.

 

[Mathman]

He [Ilia] is absolutely not a rapper, nor does he give off the vibe in his performances of having lived a hard life or needing to battle against oppression...

In this he is in company with many real rappers from a solid middle class background who try to craft a "thug from the hood" image.

 

[Bookseller]

He very rarely says anything meaningful or knowledgeable and often remarks clean as a whistle when a jump is egregiously under-rotated. He’s the king of frivolous platitudes and catchphrases and his commentary is heavily biased as well.

My favorite comments from Chris during Women's skates include, "she's wearing a nice brown dress" and "her dress is a very pretty color." And the clean jumps are legend. Someone in my presence commented after a bit of listening to Chris "That commentator is really terrible!" He appears to know nothing about skating. Why he gets these gigs, I do not know.

 

[Mathman]

My favorite comments from Chris during Women's skates include, "she's wearing a nice brown dress" and "her dress is a very pretty color." And the clean jumps are legend. Someone in my presence commented after a bit of listening to Chris "That commentator is really terrible!" He appears to know nothing about skating. Why he gets these gigs, I do not know.

I have to confess that if I were a skating commentator I would be the same way. Someone falls? Oh, what a pretty dress.

I guess that's why I am not a skating commentator.

 

[TontoK]

My favorite comments from Chris during Women's skates include, "she's wearing a nice brown dress" and "her dress is a very pretty color." And the clean jumps are legend. Someone in my presence commented after a bit of listening to Chris "That commentator is really terrible!" He appears to know nothing about skating. Why he gets these gigs, I do not know.

I wish they'd pair him more often with Kristen Moore Towers. I think she did an amazing job at Worlds. She gave meaningful critiques without being nasty. I have to clarify that I want the Worlds version of herself, and not her Canadian National Championships version.

Chris is the current day Scott Hamilton type of commentator. Relentlessly positive, but when every move merits "She NAILS it!" it can be difficult to differentiate between standard quality and excellent.

 

[Magill]

In this he is in company with many real rappers from a solid middle class background who try to craft a "thug from the hood" image.

This reminds me of the Rolling Stones, upper middle class kids, posh schools, posh speakers, desperately trying to master and sound working class English, preferably from the North, as was the trend set by their main and ever even more successful rivals (who actually really were working class and from the North)....
And then the Stones were famously called out as the "plastic soul" by the real soul masters....

 

[museksk8r]

Skating needs a commentator like the diving commentators, Cynthia Potter and Laura Wilkinson. I recall enjoying Susie Wynne’s commentary back when skating was aired on ESPN as well.

 

[Blades of Passion]

In this he is in company with many real rappers from a solid middle class background who try to craft a "thug from the hood" image.

Those people succeed in crafting the image though. They actually rap and are able to pull off a demeanor that says "you wouldn't want to mess with me". Ilia is a puppy trying to be a lion. His body language and facial expressions are not convincing of the style he is trying to project and there is no greater story being told in his programs. Artists are people who are trying to convey something in their work, who have emotions and ideas they are desperate explore and let out.

Back flips and raspberry twists and hand slides (which he simply throws into every program) are not an artistic exploration of a concept, in and of themself. Nor are his constantly hunched forward, dipped down shoulders and dab-esque arm positions that he uses every single time he tries to act "cool and edgy" in his performances. It's also not right say his style is simply being "acrobatic/gymnastic". If Ilia actually did those moves in artistic gymnastics he would get a ton of deductions on his form.

 

[Isk]

This is very close to my position.

I'm a great admirer of Ilia's skating over the past few years, but neither of his programs are what I'd hope for in an Olympic season. And that's fine. Because he's attempting to bring HIS vision to the ice. It's not my point of view, but it is HIS. I'd love to see a reborn Toller Cranston skating with those draw-dropping quads, but that's not who he is and he's not pretending to be. There are some parallels, though. Toller's skating was authentic to himself, and so is Ilia's. Like them or not, his programs don't feel "fake."

Side note: I love the set up for the 3A, with those rolling back crossovers into a rocker entry. It was musical, interesting, and unique.

Unfortunately this site does not allow to upload screenshots, or I would, because I don't like people to take my word for things, and from screens it would be quite obvious that not skating like Toller is not Ilia's choice. He can't. He has bad posture, shallow edges, no extension, his arms are hanging purposelessly, he doesn't extend the free leg, doesn't turn out free foot and has no sense of pose, and because of this his exits out of the jumps are also mediocre. Toller had great posture and extension, he was very flexible and could do a >180 degrees Russian split jump, his arms are strong and always doing something choreographically purposeful, his hops have a feeling of flight, and his positions are aesthetic even in little things. With Ilia it's all the opposite, he simply can't skate like Toller, because he doesn't have skating and choreographic skill, but he is marked as if he has it. They are trying to sell lack of skill as some different vision, but if one can't add, subtract, multiply or divide, it's not a different vision of math, it's lack of math skill.
Here is a randomly hit program of Toller: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zs1pctlpfi0&t=98
Here is Ilia's SP from Lombardia: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=po2YUBjLmrw&t=142s
They are time-coded to showcase Toller's good posture and use of arms and Ilia's lack of thereof. I could do such time codes for everything I mentioned above.
Somebody compared Ilia to Nathan, here is Nathan's 2021 FS to Philip Glass: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YSRq0iHWFDs&t=128
It's time coded in the middle of a combo-spin, you can see that his camel spin position is taut, free leg is extended and straight, arms are extended, the free foot is turned out and pointed, and the same thing happens on the following sit spin, and then he does a nice exit position. If you watch on, you will see that his back is straight, arms are extended and strong doing something choreographically meaningful all the time. Nathan took ballet lessons, maybe he is not the best edge skater but he has basic choreo training, he moves more aesthetically and has a sense of pose. Ilia doesn't and can't do even this stuff, plain and simple, it's not a choice or different vision, it's lack of skill.

 

[Arigato]

I don't see anyone who can really touch him at this point.

It's probably better for the sport if they don't. Some prefer to actually see some great skating, rather than merely BV scalping.

 

[Kiki5375]

He's trying to pass himself off as "hard and gangster-like", when in reality he's privileged, sheltered, scrawny straight white guy who happens to be able to rotate quickly on ice skates.

Please keep racism out of it. Thank you.

If you ask a 20 year old to choose music that allows him to show emotions on the ice what do you expect? That's the music a young adult like him likes he doesn't get emotional with old dusty opera songs. And he is not the singer/songwriter who expresses his personal problems in life. He just likes the music and that's it.
I am not a fan of rap music either but I think the music Ilia used for his programs this season and last season are ok for him. He brings a fresh breeze into the sport. I like that he is focussed on the sport part with all the jumps and "rotating quickly on ice skates". It is an olympic sport and not opera on ice

 

[cathlen]

I have just watched Mihail Selevko's program and was so proud of him after that 3A, and then of course, a freak fall on Step Sequence... Cacti being Cacti I guess.