Skate Canada won’t host Alberta events due to sports gender law

[Ziotic]

Looks a like SC did not want to be associated with Danielle Smith.

Skate Canada won’t host Alberta events due to sports gender law

Skate Canada says it won’t host national and international-level events in Alberta, citing provincial law that restricts transgender athletes from participating in female-only sport divisions.

www.ctvnews.ca

 

[lariko]

Just saw that SC blacklisted Alberta for national and international events. (Sigh)

 

[4everchan]

Good move.

 

[Ziotic]

Just saw that SC blacklisted Alberta for national and international events. (Sigh)

You were the first person I thought of when I saw the news.

 

[4everchan]

You were the first person I thought of when I saw the news.

Same here. Sucks for the fans who live in Alberta

 

[discodisco]

As a gay man, and the father of three daughters along with a son, I am happy for my daughters to be able to compete in an XX category.

Regardless of one's perspective on gender ideology, sport is one area, I believe, where biology is a pretty notable distinguishing feature...

 

[Cutting the ice]

I think it’s important to understand that the Alberta government has chosen to not allow debate on its ban on transgender participation in sports by enacting the notwithstanding clause and shutting down legal challenge to its legislation. This shows a disregard for the democratic process.

Skate Canada has a policy that it feels Alberta’s legislation won’t allow to be enacted within that province. From a CP article.
“The organization's transgender inclusion policy states it's “fully committed to providing a safe, welcoming, and respectful environment for all, regardless of any actual or perceived differences based on race, national or ethnic origin, colour, religion, age, language, gender, sex, sexual orientation, gender identity and expression, or disability.”” It’s a very good policy.

I believe they are right to withhold national / international SC competitions from being held there. Daniel Smith and her United Conservative Party government shouldn’t hide behind the notwithstanding clause and instead defend their 3 pieces of legislation that affect trans women and men. Again from the CP article “The Fairness and Safety in Sport Act is one of three Alberta laws affecting transgender people passed last year by Smith’s government. The other laws prohibit doctors from prescribing puberty blockers and hormone therapy to those under 16 and require parental permission for students under 16 to change their names or pronouns at school.”

 

[TT_Fin]

So I suppose that area does not host any synchro either? Pair elemets are compulsory and most synchro skaters ate female. I wonder how people who think THIS SPORT from sexual aspect feel about brtoher-sister pairs or pairs who are dating or married to somebody else than his/her partner?
Points to skate Canada wishes an old woman married to a man.

Same gender skaters pairs can date opposite gender. It does not need or should not to have any sexual thoughts. People should update they minds to 2000's and see the sport as sport, nothing else. People who think same gender pairs is discusting, are in fact dirty-minded themselves if not able to think sport as a sport.

 

[discodisco]

So I suppose that area does not host any synchro either? Pair elemets are compulsory and most synchro skaters ate female. I wonder how people who think THIS SPORT from sexual aspect feel about brtoher-sister pairs or pairs who are dating or married to somebody else than his/her partner?
Points to skate Canada wishes an old woman married to a man.

Same gender skaters pairs can date opposite gender. It does not need or should not to have any sexual thoughts. People should update they minds to 2000's and see the sport as sport, nothing else. People who think same gender pairs is discusting, are in fact dirty-minded themselves if not able to think sport as a sport.

The effect of testosterone on the male body including musculature, lung capacity, bone structure, Etc, provides a very rational and scientific side to the argument. While it's true that suppressing testosterone to more typical female levels will reduce some of the advantages gained by going through male puberty, the fact is that you cannot negate these benefits in total. Again, there are two separate angles here: gender ideology on the one hand, which can be argued from psychological, social, and religious perspectives, among others - and physiology and biology and biology. This latter angle is much more clear, and much less subjective.

 

[discodisco]

I think it’s important to understand that the Alberta government has chosen to not allow debate on its ban on transgender participation in sports by enacting the notwithstanding clause and shutting down legal challenge to its legislation. This shows a disregard for the democratic process.

Skate Canada has a policy that it feels Alberta’s legislation won’t allow to be enacted within that province. From a CP article.
“The organization's transgender inclusion policy states it's “fully committed to providing a safe, welcoming, and respectful environment for all, regardless of any actual or perceived differences based on race, national or ethnic origin, colour, religion, age, language, gender, sex, sexual orientation, gender identity and expression, or disability.”” It’s a very good policy.

I believe they are right to withhold national / international SC competitions from being held there. Daniel Smith and her United Conservative Party government shouldn’t hide behind the notwithstanding clause and instead defend their 3 pieces of legislation that affect trans women and men. Again from the CP article “The Fairness and Safety in Sport Act is one of three Alberta laws affecting transgender people passed last year by Smith’s government. The other laws prohibit doctors from prescribing puberty blockers and hormone therapy to those under 16 and require parental permission for students under 16 to change their names or pronouns at school.”

Children should be protected from puberty blockers and hormone treatments that interfere with the natural progression of puberty. Human development is guided by biological processes: female bodies are designed to produce and respond to female levels of estrogen and other hormones, while male bodies are designed for male levels of testosterone. Altering these hormonal pathways in adolescents can have irreversible effects on growth, bone density, fertility, and overall development.

Adults may choose to assume the medical risks of such treatments, but children are not capable of fully understanding or consenting to them. Parents are legally responsible for their children’s well-being, and it is inappropriate for schools or other institutions to override parental authority in these deeply personal medical decisions. Once a person reaches adulthood, they can make their own choices.

I grew up gay in the 1990s, so I understand the isolation of not having a safe space to address struggles with sexuality. These are difficult conversations, but parents need to be included. It is not the responsibility of educators—or non-parents—to override parental roles, particularly when many are in their early twenties, straight out of college, with limited life experience, parenting knowledge, or understanding of complex family dynamics. This issue is far more complicated than simply labeling it discrimination against trans individuals.

 

[SubRosa]

Adults may choose to assume the medical risks of such treatments, but children are not capable of fully understanding or consenting to them. Parents are legally responsible for their children’s well-being, and it is inappropriate for schools or other institutions to override parental authority in these deeply personal medical decisions. Once a person reaches adulthood, they can make their own choices.

Nothing medical, or irreversible, about what name/pronouns you choose to go by in high school. Yet some governments feel obliged to interfere in this matter as well.

 

[el henry]

I agree that no one should interfere with a parents' choice to pursue gender affirming treatment for their child, in whatever form that takes. It is indeed their choice.

Not that my identity should make a hill of beans worth of difference, but a straight cis American woman (Madi and Evan where are you ), I applaud Skate Canada for doing the right thing to protect all athletes in their purview.

 

[DizzyFrenchie]

Nothing medical, or irreversible, about what name/pronouns you choose to go by in high school. Yet some governments feel obliged to interfere in this matter as well.

There can be school harassment and control. It's a very sensitive subject and I don't see how children can be protected with mere laws. At this stage we're very much into legislative experimentation: which works best? Some parents too are abusing their children into this, so parental consent isn't a solution by itself but I can see arguments for trying this way rather than the other. Nor is medical control.
One space where anyone including teens can choose the pronoun they want is Internet and that's something that wouldn't exist in the 1990s for instance.

 

[Skating91]

Isn't the IOC about to ban transgender athletes? I wonder if Skate Canada will stick to their guns form some kind of boycott? Not ban completely I suspect, but people born male where they generally have a physiological advantage over biological females cannot compete in female sports. Which is fair. They can still compete in the male category.

 

[4everchan]

Ok. I think some of this debate needs to be less heated. There are NO athletes right now in the elite who are trans. None. There may never be. Some were/ are non-binary but were/ are competing in their cis gender. (pair skater from USA, forgot their name was(was it Leduc?) out as non-binary)

The Skate Canada policy is about including children into sport, no matter their gender identity.
The Skate Canada ban of Alberta is denouncing the anti-democratic process on that issue taken by the government.

This has nothing to do with the IOC. This has nothing to do with banning elite athletes or not because they may have an. advantage or not at the elite level sport. There are NONE.

It's about letting children be themselves.

I know a few trans kids. None of them have chosen to take hormones. They are simply reaffirming themselves with new names, new clothes, new pronouns... and though my experience is very limited (just a few kids) all of them are much happier since they have made these changes than they were before. The bullying was more present before than now. Of course, I live in a big city of a very open-minded part of the world. So I am only speaking from a limited experience.

I support Skate Canada's decision because it makes sense with their stance on inclusivity. They are the one promoting same sex athletic partnerships. They even removed the W or M to identify step sequence with gender and are now going with Skater A and Skater B.

I think it's a beautiful thing especially considering most sports are so heteronormative that a National sporting entity says : We will be welcoming everyone without any distinction. We will go even further, we will boycott one of our linked (provincial) entities from hosting events because of their government policy. That's courage. That's will. That's hope to send a clear message to society to step away from transphobia. The trans people (adults) I have met have had very difficult lives. You have no idea. Nobody takes hormones to get an athletic advantage. Nobody suddenly decides to put their body at risk to maybe become a better athlete (male to female transition).

Also, to reassure the people who are ill-informed, children cannot just start taking hormones on a whim. When a transition is started, the children and the parents (at least where I live) are followed by half a dozen specialists (from doctors to social workers to psychologists etc) and things are done very very slowly. As I said, the few kids I know who are transitioning are already teenagers and not taking any hormones. One of them is now fluid... some days dressed more masculine, some days dressed very feminine.

I have a lot of empathy for these young people who are dealing with identity doubts. I grew up as a very closeted young athlete wearing a speedo everyday and trying to hide from the hyper toxic masculinity from my teammates. I wasn't even sure I was gay until later. Part of it was that I didn't want to be gay when I was younger because there were NO outlets to be.

Right now, the society is more open with gays ... it's like the phobia is transferring to trans kids. Why can't we all just be "humans"?

 

[Diana Delafield]

Ok. I think some of this debate needs to be less heated. There are NO athletes right now in the elite who are trans. None. There may never be. Some were/ are non-binary but were/ are competing in their cis gender. (pair skater from USA, forgot their name was(was it Leduc?) out as non-binary)

The Skate Canada policy is about including children into sport, no matter their gender identity.
The Skate Canada ban of Alberta is denouncing the anti-democratic process on that issue taken by the government.

This has nothing to do with the IOC. This has nothing to do with banning elite athletes or not because they may have an. advantage or not at the elite level sport. There are NONE.

And it only affects the separate women's and men's events, in Canada at least. Remembering Madge Syers, the first women's Olympic and world champion. The separate event for ladies was only introduced after she entered the 1902 Worlds and won the silver medal in a field of otherwise all male competitors.

At Highland Games, the dance competition, which was considered an athletic event, has always had just categories for solo dancers or groups (reels, involving four dancers, and you entered as an individual and got randomly assigned to a group who were usually strangers to you when you stepped onto the dance stage). Occasionally two dancers if they included the Jacobite Swords as an event. Nobody at any age from small children to adults noticed if the competitors next to you were female or male. There was no physical or technical advantage. In the picture, the group waiting to compete in the next age category is a mix of both boys and girls. It just worked out that those of us in a younger trio of medalists -- that's me on the right -- were all girls.

 

[RafaelAstro]

Ok. I think some of this debate needs to be less heated. There are NO athletes right now in the elite who are trans. None. There may never be. Some were/ are non-binary but were/ are competing in their cis gender. (pair skater from USA, forgot their name was(was it Leduc?) out as non-binary)

The Skate Canada policy is about including children into sport, no matter their gender identity.
The Skate Canada ban of Alberta is denouncing the anti-democratic process on that issue taken by the government.

This has nothing to do with the IOC. This has nothing to do with banning elite athletes or not because they may have an. advantage or not at the elite level sport. There are NONE.

It's about letting children be themselves.

I know a few trans kids. None of them have chosen to take hormones. They are simply reaffirming themselves with new names, new clothes, new pronouns... and though my experience is very limited (just a few kids) all of them are much happier since they have made these changes than they were before. The bullying was more present before than now. Of course, I live in a big city of a very open-minded part of the world. So I am only speaking from a limited experience.

I support Skate Canada's decision because it makes sense with their stance on inclusivity. They are the one promoting same sex athletic partnerships. They even removed the W or M to identify step sequence with gender and are now going with Skater A and Skater B.

I think it's a beautiful thing especially considering most sports are so heteronormative that a National sporting entity says : We will be welcoming everyone without any distinction. We will go even further, we will boycott one of our linked (provincial) entities from hosting events because of their government policy. That's courage. That's will. That's hope to send a clear message to society to step away from transphobia. The trans people (adults) I have met have had very difficult lives. You have no idea. Nobody takes hormones to get an athletic advantage. Nobody suddenly decides to put their body at risk to maybe become a better athlete (male to female transition).

Also, to reassure the people who are ill-informed, children cannot just start taking hormones on a whim. When a transition is started, the children and the parents (at least where I live) are followed by half a dozen specialists (from doctors to social workers to psychologists etc) and things are done very very slowly. As I said, the few kids I know who are transitioning are already teenagers and not taking any hormones. One of them is now fluid... some days dressed more masculine, some days dressed very feminine.

I have a lot of empathy for these young people who are dealing with identity doubts. I grew up as a very closeted young athlete wearing a speedo everyday and trying to hide from the hyper toxic masculinity from my teammates. I wasn't even sure I was gay until later. Part of it was that I didn't want to be gay when I was younger because there were NO outlets to be.

Right now, the society is more open with gays ... it's like the phobia is transferring to trans kids. Why can't we all just be "humans"?

Thank you for your kind words. People need to stop using arguments about biological advantages as a cover for hidden discrimination. There are sports where the division by sex should not even exist, as if there weren’t biological women with more abilities than biological men, or as if there weren’t physical advantages based on ethnicity, or even differences among cis people of the same sex.
And it’s not like there is an invasion of trans people dominating sports come on, many of them can’t even practice a sport safely. I’m not trans, I’m a bi man, but I know the struggles trans people in my community face. They deserve the same opportunities as everyone else because they are human and have the same value as anyone.
They are living very harsh lives right now just for existing, and people seem to care more about fake threats based on misinformation and hate speech than about the fact that they could die this year, this month, this week, or even today just for existing.

 

[rain]

Parents are legally responsible for their children’s well-being, and it is inappropriate for schools or other institutions to override parental authority in these deeply personal medical decisions. Once a person reaches adulthood, they can make their own choices.

I grew up gay in the 1990s, so I understand the isolation of not having a safe space to address struggles with sexuality. These are difficult conversations, but parents need to be included. It is not the responsibility of educators—or non-parents—to override parental roles

The assumption that you make here, wrongly, is that everyone has good parents who have their best interests at heart. An awful lot of children are not that fortunate. And this is why I fundamentally disagree that children are their parents' property until they reach some arbitrary age of adulthood, which changes by jurisdiction.

 

[GS Forum Staff]

Hi everyone!

While the Skate Canada decision regarding events in Alberta has been covered widely in the news, it involves broader political and social issues that aren’t appropriate for this space.

This thread will be closed so we all can keep the focus on figure skating.

Thanks for your understanding and cooperation!