Patrick claims that he doesn't need the quad because he is an all-around skater. However, wouldn't a real all-around skater be able to do land quads consistently but also strong in the other elements as well? So, I feel his argument falls short in this respect.
Patrick Chan Article "Disses" Plushenko
- Thread starter demarinis5
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The latest from the NY Times:
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/02/13/sports/olympics/13longman.html
A pretty entertaining article with funny comments from Button and Johnny - who is portraying himself yet again as a victim
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/02/13/sports/olympics/13longman.html
A pretty entertaining article with funny comments from Button and Johnny - who is portraying himself yet again as a victim
:agree: I have no problem with what Chan and Plushenko are saying so far. AND how do I know exactly what they said or meant. Not easy to meet media people who put tricky questions to get a scoop.
Media training then, necessary, but boring to read/hear the clichés.
The latest from the NY Times:
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/02/13/sports/olympics/13longman.html
A pretty entertaining article with funny comments from Button and Johnny - who is portraying himself yet again as a victim
Article conclusion:
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An all-around skater should also have a consistent, reliable 3A----which is not the case with Chan. The reality is he cannot make any mistakes (especially in the SP) if he wants to be competitive for a medal. That just adds to the pressure every time he takes off for a 3A.
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- Oct 31, 2005
When did consistency become a requirement to be a good all-around skater? Not that long ago, the archetypal all-around skater in men's? Paul Wylie. And the only thing he was consistent about as a competitor was his love of movie scores.
Please, I get people don't like Chan. I don't much care for him as a person, either. But that's no reason to change the definition of a long established term of skating terminology just to keep a skater you don't like away from it.
Please, I get people don't like Chan. I don't much care for him as a person, either. But that's no reason to change the definition of a long established term of skating terminology just to keep a skater you don't like away from it.
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- Jul 11, 2003
The big question: is the quad mandatory? If it is not mentioned in all planned programs, those skaters should be eliminated. No?
I'm with Joe Inman. Watch the transitions leading up to ALL quads - not just the circular drum roll crossovers followed by a long pause to get themselves in the position to make the jump easier. An artistic all round skater would never do that.
Johnny is Johnny and he is looking for any position that keeps his name in the public eye.The latest from the NY Times:
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/02/13/sports/olympics/13longman.html
A pretty entertaining article with funny comments from Button and Johnny - who is portraying himself yet again as a victim
I happen to agree with Inman. If the Sport is artistic as well as Tricky, the elements, the footwork, the moves in field all should have an artistic flair. Transitions leading up to elements in part of the Rules. Evgenii
I'm probably the only one who agrees with Inman. I also agree with Evgeni.The latest from the NY Times:
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/02/13/sports/olympics/13longman.html
A pretty entertaining article with funny comments from Button and Johnny - who is portraying himself yet again as a victim
A man's sport is solely to show how well he executes the figure skating elements. Music and Performance are not the criteria. All the jumps require are nothing more than excellent posture throughout. Music and choreography are not really in the man's vanity for Sport. Landing a Quad any which way is a tough mannish deal.
Inman would go to the rules and I am also with him on that. The CoP regulations insist on transitions. There are no exceptions!!!
The alternative to all this is to eliminate the music from male figure skating which I am a big proponent of. It's just not necessary for the Men
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- Aug 31, 2003
Plushenko was also 19 in 2002 SLC, but he never talked about Elvis or Todd like that. I will pray to God never forget this ugly Chan's talk towards Plushenko as well as ugly Inman's lobbying crap! AMEN!
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- Jun 3, 2009
I don't think that the words of Chan or Inman are comparable. Of course, one might wonder how Plushenko talked about Yagudin at the same time.
I agree in any discipline that has an all-around discipline the athletes always have some stronger portions and some weaker. It is rare to find an athlete that is perfect or consistent in every aspect... The fact that Chan landed 3 3A's at Nationals is ignored.
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I think that both Plushenko and Joubert have gotten some way too high PCS scores just because of reputation. No matter what other skaters or coaches etc. are saying about Plushenko this moment, it is too late to do anything now. The hue and cry about PCS scores should have started at least a couple of years ago in connection with Joubert.
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- Jun 3, 2009
In the GPF thread, and in the Skate America thread, where he got those ridiculously high PCS marks.
He landed three 3As at Nationals, but he stepped out of the solo 3A in the FS. He also stepped out of the 3F and could land only 3F+2T in the SP.
If you read my previous post, I said Chan has not landed three 3As in an international competition. 2010 Canadian Nationals was more of a coronation than a competition as far as Chan was concerned.
It's a lot easier to land problem jumps in an event (such as Canadian nationals) where there is no competition, hence no pressure.
BTW, I don't hate anyone, let alone skaters I don't know personally.
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- Jun 3, 2009
The closest Chan has come to landing three triple axels was at Worlds 09, and his final triple axel had a wonky landing.
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- May 15, 2009
Here is Sports Illustrated's take on Inman, Plushy and what it says is a "scandal revealed."
Oh yea, they think Weir acted jerky but no real surprise there
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/20...em_swift/02/13/judging.controversy/index.html
"Now judges prop up their favorite skaters by using the five "program component" marks -- except that viewers in the stands and at home never see those marks and are left to scratch their heads at the numbers that flash on the screen determining winners and losers. As one coach recently told me, "The judges used to have one mark to monkey around with. Now they have five."
Five, plus a cloak of anonymity. In other words the new scoring system is every bit as rife with potential for corruption as the old one.
The skaters know it. Plushenko said as much in his interview about his and Joubert's lack of transitions. "If the judges want someone to place high, they can arrange it....
Oh yea, they think Weir acted jerky but no real surprise there
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/20...em_swift/02/13/judging.controversy/index.html
"Now judges prop up their favorite skaters by using the five "program component" marks -- except that viewers in the stands and at home never see those marks and are left to scratch their heads at the numbers that flash on the screen determining winners and losers. As one coach recently told me, "The judges used to have one mark to monkey around with. Now they have five."
Five, plus a cloak of anonymity. In other words the new scoring system is every bit as rife with potential for corruption as the old one.
The skaters know it. Plushenko said as much in his interview about his and Joubert's lack of transitions. "If the judges want someone to place high, they can arrange it....
It's been discussed over and over again on the various skating boards that judges manipulate PCS scores to bolster their favorites while lowballing their favorites' closest competitors.
Nothing new there. It does explain to some extent how skaters like Kostner, Lepisto and Korpi get such high scores overall even when they skate poorly---as the highest ranking European skaters, they get a lot of support from European judges, and there are always a majority of European judges on judging panels.
Nothing new there. It does explain to some extent how skaters like Kostner, Lepisto and Korpi get such high scores overall even when they skate poorly---as the highest ranking European skaters, they get a lot of support from European judges, and there are always a majority of European judges on judging panels.
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Is E.M Swift working for Joe Inman? That was a very one-sided take on the situation. Just because Plushenko made a comment doesn't mean Inman has to use it as a so-called teaching tool right before the Olympics, and certainly there's no reason to drag Joubert into it. Plushenko also said recently that Evan Lysacek doesn't really have a 3A, maybe Inman would like to remind judges to mark him down?Here is Sports Illustrated's take on Inman, Plushy and what it says is a "scandal revealed."
Oh yea, they think Weir acted jerky but no real surprise there
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/20...em_swift/02/13/judging.controversy/index.html
I agree that Didier Gailhaguet isn't the most savory character in skating, but it's ridiculous to suggest that Inman's actions are just an "above-board, innocuous e-mail" and that nobody should have gotten upset. What's so above-board of lobbying behind the scenes and then blaming others when the story breaks in the media? Inman, like many others, is lobbying and trying to sway judges, and for Swift to suggest that only those corrupt Euros politik shows either ignorance or plain hypocrisy.
BTW, props to both Brian Joubert ("we all have strengths and weaknesses", "I have worked on my transitions but can still improve") and Evan Lysacek ("I think the judging has been pretty accurate the last few seasons") for refusing to get involved in this mess.
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- May 15, 2009
To compare Inman to Gailhaguet feels like a flight from reality.
My favorite quote of this Olympic season:
"If all of the blood was drained from Gailhaguet's body and replaced with truth serum I still wouldn't believe a word he said."
Dick Button
Part of the point here is that some are not waiting for cheating or a conspiracy to happen in Vancouver because it is already going on.
This is a can of worms opened by Plushenko's recent remarks and Plushenko was 100% correct. Judges are using the pcs to prop up and keep down too many skaters.
Plushy doesn't complain when he is a benefactor but apparently it was more than he could handle to see Joubert getting a higher TR mark than he did.
As Button correctly stated "Gailhaguet is an international manipulator" of the worst sort. His ban from skating should have been permanent not just to rid skating of him but to send a message that the days of manipulating results behind the scenes were over. But ISU didn't really want to clean up their act and proved it by welcoming him back.
Now we see a judge with the highest reputation for integrity - one who serves as a trainer of other judges - having his integrity questioned. His area of specialty is the artisitic marks and that is why he correctly pointed out to others that they should mark more carefully and just not by reputation.
Sorry, but what Inman did was not only right but necessary and overdue.
The fact that Gailhaguet's mission in life has been to protect and help Joubert is why you may see him as no different than Inman. I think their history and reputations are as different as night and day.
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- Mar 25, 2008
That completely misrepresents my point, and this:
is downright insulting.
Since you regularly misinterpret and often intentionally misrepresent what I write, I don't see the point of continuing this or any other discussion with you. If you want to discuss how awful everything related to European skating is, do it with someone else.
Don't bother responding to me; I'm putting you on ignore.
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- May 15, 2009
I don't believe I misrepresented your words........I only disagreed with what you wrote.
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