State of American Ladies: 2012-13 Season

[Mrs. P]

but Mirai has more than 8,000 likes on Facebook and more than 18,000 followers on Twitter.



That's true, Rachael narrowly beat out Mirai at Nationals, but that year, at least Mirai didn't come in last and second to last at her GP events. She even got a silver medal at CoC.



I think Mirai tends to be good in person too ...

My main point is that Rachael is still well-regarded in the skating community. It's easy to misconstrue that she is an unpopular skater IN GENERAL ( as opposed to just these skating boards) because I think there is a disproportionate amount of people online who seem to dislike her skating and are much more outspoken about it. This idea that people are going to choose NOT to attend Skate America because Rachael is there instead of any of any other given U.S. Ladies skater is a bit of a stretch in my opinion.

 

[Tonichelle]

Second time was a few weeks ago at Weiss's show. While she was better, I thought Wagner had more impact. Then again, it's not a fair comparison given Nagasu only did an exhibition.

if anything she should have had more energy/spunk/personality, then.

 

[brightphoton]

But why does Mirai need to schluck it out to China year after year after year? She went to Skate America -once- and that was after she become the 2008 National champ. and National champ always goes to Skate America. Even after her Olympics debut and her medal at 4CC, she never got to go to SA again. Yes, her career has been middling, but one cannot say Flatt is a superstar and yet she manages to go to Skate America consistently.

I really cannot believe the SA officials couldn't afford Mirai another spot in all these years.

This idea that people are going to choose NOT to attend Skate America because Rachael is there instead of any of any other given U.S. Ladies skater is a bit of a stretch in my opinion.

That's not the idea. My idea is that either the same amount of people or more people would attend Skate America if Mirai were competing there.

 

[R.D.]

So in your opinion, Mirai never wanted SA? And she actively lobbied for CoC?

Janetfan, I don't know. None of us do and it's virtually impossible to have any idea about the situation from the limited POV of a skatefan.

And so my opinion is this: it's pointless to speculate about it.

(Thanks for the compliment BTW. I wanted to give a comprehensive preview from my POV, and hope that eventually we can get back to that topic. )

 

[Violet Bliss]

I think if a country has a top seeded skater, s/he will definitely headline the GP event at home. With non seeded skaters, sometimes spots are given to those not invited by other GP hosts.

 

[dorispulaski]

To put a different spin, (just for the sake of discussion)

Mirai may like Cup of China for the same reason Bobrova & Soloviev seem to like it: China's 3 ladies (and 3 ice dancers) are no competition. A lady or ice dancer wanting to medal and/or make GPF, would prefer it to SA, CoR, NHK. The events with a shallow ladies field for the host fed are CoC, TEB, and Skate Canada. So there's a pattern beginning to show. The Chinese men are on the weaker side in many years, too.

Plus Mirai still has relatives in Japan. While it is a long side trip from China to Japan, it's a lot shorter than California to Japan, so she can achieve two goals with one move.

http://www.isuresults.com/bios/isufs00010220.htm

Her bio

2008 NHK & Skate America
2009 CoC & Skate Canada
2010 CoC & TEB
2011 TEB & Skate Canada
2012 CoC


This year, Rachael placed ahead of Mirai at US Nationals, so it's not surprising she got the extra SA berth, given that China invited Mirai for free (presumably, having been there twice, she has fans there). USFS would prefer to have as many seniors with the qualifying TES scores.

Interestingly, Evan Lysacek, another of Frank Carroll's former skaters, while forced to do Skate America after being US Champion, had CoC as his second event in 2007 & 2009, and I wonder whether this was a Frank Carroll "strategery".

 

[Mrs. P]

That's not the idea. My idea is that either the same amount of people or more people would attend Skate America if Mirai were competing there.

Perhaps that may be the case based on your assertions -- but I'm not sure that would be enough for USFSA to pull someone out involuntarily.

 

[emma]

Thanks for the preview, R.D. - I really enjoyed it. I can't believe the senior season is nearly upon us, wow. It will be very interesting to see how all of the ladies do, so here's a big shout out to all the senior gals!

that said, I'm particularly impressed with the reviews of Wagner's SP thus far and am really excited to see it for myself. Also, for me, Rachel and Caroline were such joys to watch at Nationals, and I believe Rachel is keeping her LP, no? I do hope so and I do hope she gets her jumping legs back. Regardless, I just would love to seem them both skate well and feel happy about where they are in that process.

Mirai is such a talent - i do hope the new coaching situation brings out the best in her. I would love to see Agnes wow us with a great short and long too. Can't wait to see what Gold brings this year (if for no other reason than I love her name - oh yeah, she skates pretty good too). And my figures are crossed for Alissa. If I missed someone key- didn't mean too...just excited to read the preview and looking forward to READING about the GPs as sadly, looks like we won't have much to watch in the US

 

[Mrs. P]

I agree RD, it's a great comprehensive look at the season! Thanks for your thoughts.

It sounds like Ashley Wagner is off to a good start -- Doug Mattis, a well-known figure in the FS community, tweeted the following:

** Just watched @AshWagner2010 skate a STUNNING SP at Paramount in LA. Major improvement. Watch out Worlds!!
** @YukiNieve Ashley was in a class by herself--functionally and metaphorically!

This would certainly jive with RD's positive assertion of her SP from the Weiss show.

 

[R.D.]

if anything she should have had more energy/spunk/personality, then.

I saw much of it all through a camera lens (was taking photos) but Wagner was in pure attack mode. I was actually feeling goosebumps through portions of the program. Nagasu gave a nice performance in the end but there was no WOW factor to it, partially because it was an exhibition.

 

[Tonichelle]

Interestingly, Evan Lysacek, another of Frank Carroll's former skaters, while forced to do Skate America after being US Champion, had CoC as his second event in 2007 & 2009, and I wonder whether this was a Frank Carroll "strategery".

I, admittedly, have not been following Evan's comeback too closely, but... he's not staying with Frank?!

 

[brightphoton]

RD, did any junior girls move to senior and are any of them worth bothering over? I tried to watch the Junior GPs but I find myself slee-zzzzzzzz

What happened to Christina Gao? Does she have a GP this season or has she completely moved on to college?

 

[dorispulaski]

Not so. In the US, the top person at US Nationals gets the top spot at Skate America, where they are feted as the US reigning champion.

Mirai got it the year she was US Champion (2008).

Now if your name was Rudy Galindo ...you have a point. In 1996, Rudy was US Champion and world bronze medallist in his first try at Worlds--and he didn't get Skate America, which he says is why he retired, in part. Of course, Todd Eldredge was world champion but not US champion in the 1996 season, but that was still the custom that the champion got the spot however he finished at worlds

The second & third slots at US Nationals are usually reserved for skaters who did not do well enough at Worlds to get one or 2 slots somewhere else. or are exciting up and comers, making their senior debut (think Gracie Gold this year) Rachael got Skate America in 2009 GP season because she was the reigning Junior World Champion, and got the "up & coming" slot.

In 2010 she got Skate America, because she was the reigning US champion.

This year she got it because she needed it & and because the rules changed so that up and comers who are of the correct age for Jr Worlds, who think they can make Jr. Worlds team but not the senior Worlds team, have to compete on the JGP, not the GP. This includes all girls too young for Senior Worlds in any case.

All the US seniors ahead of Rachael already have 2 slots. Mirai already has one slot. The girls down to 12th are all on the JGP. Consequently, the choice is, does Mirai get a 2nd slot, or does Rachael get a first one?

And because she didn't earn a world or 4CC's berth last year and needs the TES values to qualify for worlds, if in fact, she (very unlikely) made the US Worlds team this year, Rachael got the slot. If she isn't ready to go, USFS will probably give Mirai Rachael's spot, but that would be a week or two down the road when that choice would need to be made.

 

[dorispulaski]

Christina Gao has 2 GP's.
So do Caroline, Ashley & Gracie Gold. Alissa is injured.

The girls on the JGP (who have already competed) can't go to Sr. Worlds under the current rules.

There are a tiny group of girls slated for JGP who haven't yet competed.

In order to compete at Worlds, Europeans, Four Continents or the Olympics, skaters must be 15 before July 1 of the preceding year

(which would be July 1 of this year)

Polina Edmunds who I think is too young for senior Worlds?, and would presumably like to go to Jr Worlds anyway.

Mariah Bell, Barbie Long & Yasmin Siraj
Bell & Long competed, but did not medal at US Juniors last year. Siraj was 15th in seniors.

So we really don't have a Gracie Gold in the wings this year, unless you count Polina Edmunds. And I think she's still 14; not old enough for 2013 Worlds. Could be wrong tho. I can't find a bio for her.

 

[janetfan]

Not so. In the US, the top person at US Nationals gets the top spot at Skate America, where they are feted as the US reigning champion.

Mirai got it the year she was US Champion (2008).

Now if your name was Rudy Galindo ...you have a point. In 1996, Rudy was US Champion and world bronze medallist in his first try at Worlds--and he didn't get Skate America, which he says is why he retired, in part. Of course, Todd Eldredge was world champion but not US champion in the 1996 season, but that was still the custom that the champion got the spot however he finished at worlds

The second & third slots at US Nationals are usually reserved for skaters who did not do well enough at Worlds to get one or 2 slots somewhere else. or are exciting up and comers, making their senior debut (think Gracie Gold this year) Rachael got Skate America in 2009 GP season because she was the reigning Junior World Champion, and got the "up & coming" slot.

In 2010 she got Skate America, because she was the reigning US champion.

This year she got it because she needed it & and because the rules changed so that up and comers who are of the correct age for Jr Worlds, who think they can make Jr. Worlds team but not the senior Worlds team, have to compete on the JGP, not the GP. This includes all girls too young for Senior Worlds in any case.

All the US seniors ahead of Rachael already have 2 slots. Mirai already has one slot. The girls down to 12th are all on the JGP. Consequently, the choice is, does Mirai get a 2nd slot, or does Rachael get a first one?

And because she didn't earn a world or 4CC's berth last year and needs the TES values to qualify for worlds, if in fact, she (very unlikely) made the US Worlds team this year, Rachael got the slot. If she isn't ready to go, USFS will probably give Mirai Rachael's spot, but that would be several a week or two down the road when that choice would need to be made.

Thanks for the explanation.

But you did not really address why Rachael got SA four out of the last five years and Mirai only once.

How can I think it is anything other than US Skating propping up what they see as "the great white hope." :think:

 

[brightphoton]

So Gracie Gold gets a Skate America slot over Mirai?
2009 Rachael was up & coming but not Mirai?
and this is fair?


all rightie then

 

[janetfan]

Christina Gao has 2 GP's.
So do Caroline, Ashley & Gracie Gold. Alissa is injured.

I happen to like Christina Gao - but what has she ever accomplished on the ice compared to Mirai?

 

[brightphoton]

She looks a bit like Yuna Kim

 

[janetfan]

She looks a bit like Yuna Kim

Maybe that is why I always liked her Just kidding but I do think Christina is a very pretty girl with some nice jumps!

That and I read she got a perfect score on her math SAT's

She is also going to Harvard ...which I prefer any day of the week and twice on Sunday's over Stanford.

But we can be sure there will be nothing approaching the non-stop gushing we heard about Flatt going to Stanford regarding Christina and Harvard.

That's just the way it goes sometimes.....:disapp:

 

[R.D.]

Alissa is injured.

Via Twitter, Czisny is back on the ice. Not sure what level she is performing at, but she has recovered enough to begin skating again.

RD, did any junior girls move to senior and are any of them worth bothering over? I tried to watch the Junior GPs but I find myself slee-zzzzzzzz

Honestly, I don't keep up with junior ladies. That sounds like a question for Sylvia.

But...I do know that Courtney Hicks has returned (she was out last season with a broken leg) and is on the JGP. I think she will be skating senior at 2013 Nationals. She may possibly be one to keep an eye on moving forward.