2014 Olympics Ladies Free Skate
- Thread starter gsk8
- Start date
- Joined
- Feb 12, 2014
Sky_fly20 is just a crazy Yuna hater. Not to mention mean.
I watched on the BBC feed. I'm a fan of Robin Cousins, but he said something that irritated me. He mentioned Yuna got the Silver because she didn't compete all year and couldn't keep up or some other such nonsense. I agree that not competing did hurt her, not because she couldn't keep up (she's miles ahead of the others frankly as a complete skater) but because she skated so early that they really didn't give her the type of scores she would have received had she skated later. Mao should have been placed first in the long with Yuna second toss up between Adelina and Carolina for 3rd. I'm not sure how that would have panned out overall.
The fact Sotnikova got PCS that high, higher than Kostner's and almost as high as Kim's is absolutely ridiculous. She has poor posture, carriage and lines, both of her programs had very little relation to the music in terms of style or character and her timing was mostly off. Her basic skating is pretty good but it's not great and it's not at the level of some of the other top skaters either.
Her technical elements were extremely impressive in both programs and a few quibbles aside, her high TES scores were largely justified. But the PCS were not.
As compelling as the 'Russians bribed everybody' discourse is, cultural, social and psychological processes are usually more complex than that and in reality there never is a big bad villain who is responsible for whatever is wrong with the world.
What I think happened is that because Sotnikova genuinely skated well technically in both programs, bolstered by the huge support of the audience, the judges simply went with her on the PCS as well. Anchoring, plain and simple. An overall positive impression got carried over to all of the marks.
If you ever try to judge a program in real time, you will notice that when the program is over, you have spent pretty much the entire time thinking about the GOE of the technical elements. The music finished and you probably don't even remember much about what happened in between. Which is why panels should be split into GOE and PCS judges, IMO.
Secondly, not all of the judges had ballet or dance training and even if they did as skaters, they might not know much about it in terms of looking from the outside. So if a skater is totally off-time, they might not even notice that.
Finally, the looming shadow of the corridor means you are likely to mark how you expect the others to and will try to keep all of your marks 'in line' without obvious outliers.
There's probably many other factors you could come up with, those are just off the top of my head.
I feel really crushed about this result because it's just not fair to the skaters who have worked hard to develop proper basics, master better choreography and actually bother to skate to the music instead of right through it.
Her technical elements were extremely impressive in both programs and a few quibbles aside, her high TES scores were largely justified. But the PCS were not.
As compelling as the 'Russians bribed everybody' discourse is, cultural, social and psychological processes are usually more complex than that and in reality there never is a big bad villain who is responsible for whatever is wrong with the world.
What I think happened is that because Sotnikova genuinely skated well technically in both programs, bolstered by the huge support of the audience, the judges simply went with her on the PCS as well. Anchoring, plain and simple. An overall positive impression got carried over to all of the marks.
If you ever try to judge a program in real time, you will notice that when the program is over, you have spent pretty much the entire time thinking about the GOE of the technical elements. The music finished and you probably don't even remember much about what happened in between. Which is why panels should be split into GOE and PCS judges, IMO.
Secondly, not all of the judges had ballet or dance training and even if they did as skaters, they might not know much about it in terms of looking from the outside. So if a skater is totally off-time, they might not even notice that.
Finally, the looming shadow of the corridor means you are likely to mark how you expect the others to and will try to keep all of your marks 'in line' without obvious outliers.
There's probably many other factors you could come up with, those are just off the top of my head.
I feel really crushed about this result because it's just not fair to the skaters who have worked hard to develop proper basics, master better choreography and actually bother to skate to the music instead of right through it.
Dear friends,
I have been constantly watching figure skating since 1969, when Rodnina-Ulanov first won over the Protopopovs.
So, it was not yesterday.
I've done it now.
There are much more interesting, less digusting things in the world to be interested in.
Not just 1 result, but the WHOLE system.
When Sotnikova PCS score is 5 more than Mao's etc.etc.etc.
At least Mr. Lakernik awarded the flowers. He also awarded the technical scores, being Russian...
Lethargy is coming and I cannot let it owns me....
I have been constantly watching figure skating since 1969, when Rodnina-Ulanov first won over the Protopopovs.
So, it was not yesterday.
I've done it now.
There are much more interesting, less digusting things in the world to be interested in.
Not just 1 result, but the WHOLE system.
When Sotnikova PCS score is 5 more than Mao's etc.etc.etc.
At least Mr. Lakernik awarded the flowers. He also awarded the technical scores, being Russian...
Lethargy is coming and I cannot let it owns me....
- Joined
- Feb 13, 2006
Adelina having the highest TES is justified, I think. But the PCS?
So far, Adelina's personal FS best was from this year's european championships only a month ago...131.63 with PCS:
SS 8.64
TR 8.50
PE 8.75
CC 8.75
IN 8.75
= 69.60
The same program four weeks later gets:
SS 9.18
TR 8.96
PE 9.43
CC 9.50
IN 9.43
= 74.41
So far, Adelina's personal FS best was from this year's european championships only a month ago...131.63 with PCS:
SS 8.64
TR 8.50
PE 8.75
CC 8.75
IN 8.75
= 69.60
The same program four weeks later gets:
SS 9.18
TR 8.96
PE 9.43
CC 9.50
IN 9.43
= 74.41
- Joined
- Nov 9, 2009
No,
She won it receiving about 10-12 more points in PCS then she deserves and has gotten anywhere else ever (between both SP and FS)
Sotnikova wins!!!!! First headcase, er, Russian woman to win an individual Olympic gold medal.
And Gold comes 4th.
sky_fly is going to LOSE HER MIND.
Although this judging was ridiculous.
Umm... How can you call Sotnikova a headcase when they has done like 3+ competitions in a row cleanly or with only slight errors? Russian Nationals, Europeans, Olympics... She has pretty much delivered on all those occasions. Considering how much trouble she's had in the past delivered, I'm going to go ahead and say she (and Gracie Gold) are pretty much over that at this point [for the most part].
Additionally...
Her BV for TES was huge.
Kostner had mediocre spins. She had a ton of tight landings. Tons of telegraphing. Tons of stopping and posing. This is the best that she's looked in forever, though, and she deserved her medal.
I actually would have put Kostner ahead of Yuna - IF she wasn't so tight on the landings. Yuna's performance was phoned in. It's like she thought she could do crossovers around the rink and telegraph halfway across the ice, land them, and get an easy win. Additionally, she was at a significant TES disadvantage vs Sotnikova - moreso than even Kostner who could theoretically have done the DA/3T and a 3/3 and still gotten 7 triples in because she has a Triple Loop while Yuna doesn't...
Sotnikova: Huge Jumps. Her coaches were smart. Taking out the Triple Loop combination. Fixed the flip headcase'ness. That DA/3T is the best in the world. She flew across the ice nad her only hiccup was stepping out of an overpowered double at the end of a combination (the double was big enough to be a triple).
Gracie Gold had some of the best jumps/landings in the competition up until that Triple Flip.
Ashley Wagner did what everyone thought she would... She finished Top 10 but that's about it.
Asada got some help from the Technical Panel cause a few of those jumps were clearly '<', but her skate was decent. I find the program generally uninteresting and more of a show of her qualities than telling a story. The pressure was off of her a bit because she had already "lost the competition," anyways. I wonder how she would have competed if she was in the last group, especially after hearing Kostner/Sotnikova/Yuna scores...
Lipnitskaya: Crumbled under the pressure. She could barely concentrate when her coaches were talking to her. The cameras and media were clearly distracting her.
Personally I think the results were right given the quality of the performances given and the technical advantage Sotnikova had. Yuna really hurt herself by not having that 7th triple. She was one triple loop out of the lead. That's what cost her the Gold here. The post-Vancouver rule changes affected her more than most other skaters, because it put a ceiling on what she could do technically that was lower than the other skaters and 3L/3T is commodity. Also, Sotnikova is a bigger jumper than Kim so there was less disparity in jump quality the way there was between her and Asada/Rochette in Vancouver.
I particularly think Kim lost it in the SP. Her SP was boring and unlike Vancouver when you felt like you were watching a James Bond movie, this one actually made it apparent just how much telegraphing and crossovers she does in her programs. There was nothing else to pay attention to. It's like she was just here to be here. I didn't see how she was "enjoying this Olympics" at all. She seemed like she was on a business trip. She also didn't improve at all in spinning ability. Discounting the fact that she cannot do Biellmanns anymore (as if they were ever that good - but the reason is totally valid), her spinning just doesn't match up to the likes of Lipnitskaya/Sotnikova/Gold in speed, center, or quality. They all blow her away.
Lastly, since she has not done any major competitions coming into the Olympics, the judges didn't have a track record of HUGE scores to use as a base for upping her score there, either... If you break the programs down, you see tons of telegraphing and gliding halfway across the rink into jumps. Tons of crossovers around the rink. She skates in one direction around the rink ALOT. Mediocre spins with only decent speed and below-average to average positions. Kim's secret weapons have always been her jumps, and the post-Vancouver rule changes neutered her in that area.
- Joined
- Dec 15, 2003
How in the world does Adelina get higher pcs than Carolina? Hoped for Carolina to win but beautiful short and free. She really is creative and elegant. Yuna technically was amazing and so much flow and great skating skills. Mao, great come back and should have placed over Adelina in the free skate portion. Wonderful skating by Adelina and credit to her but thought she won the bronze or even silver.
I think the Yuna had such a classy performance, not sure why Lip/Weir thought she should skate like she wants it. She had a classy program and was elegant. I thought she was much more mature and clean. THought Adelina did some kind of turn out on a jump but was hard to see with streaming feed that kept pausing/freezing. I would have given it to Yuna. I will watch tonight on tv though to confirm.
Wow, what an amazing day!
I absolutely ADORED all of the three skaters.
I also would have given the gold to Adelina, with Yuna and Carolina very close second and third.
Here, in Canada the losers on CBC (Browning and that British woman) started to ***** about how Sotnikova is behind in her footsteps and artistry. Those are the same people that defend Chan and think he's a God.
Artistry my ***, she was the best!
I absolutely ADORED all of the three skaters.
I also would have given the gold to Adelina, with Yuna and Carolina very close second and third.
Here, in Canada the losers on CBC (Browning and that British woman) started to ***** about how Sotnikova is behind in her footsteps and artistry. Those are the same people that defend Chan and think he's a God.
Artistry my ***, she was the best!
- Joined
- Nov 3, 2013
Scandal
There is nothing more to say. I desperately hope that influential figure skating nations (probably without the Russian Federation) and well reputed figure skating experts unite and put pressure on the ISU which now is a total laughing stock. The whole sport is now a complete joke for me. I feel so sorry for the athletes who trained for years and were not accurately rewarded.
I never thought I would say this but I am loosing interest in this sport which I used to love so much.
PS: You should have seen Katharina Witt's outrage on German TV. I hope many others will speak up and forcing a change in the system. I think 2002 was nothing in comparison to today's and yesterday's 'competition'.
There is nothing more to say. I desperately hope that influential figure skating nations (probably without the Russian Federation) and well reputed figure skating experts unite and put pressure on the ISU which now is a total laughing stock. The whole sport is now a complete joke for me. I feel so sorry for the athletes who trained for years and were not accurately rewarded.
I never thought I would say this but I am loosing interest in this sport which I used to love so much.
PS: You should have seen Katharina Witt's outrage on German TV. I hope many others will speak up and forcing a change in the system. I think 2002 was nothing in comparison to today's and yesterday's 'competition'.
- Joined
- May 4, 2013
- Joined
- Sep 10, 2012
I'm incredibly happy for Carolina, as a fan this FS is a dream that comes true, but I'm just disgusted by the result... 
PCS should have been
1) very close between Kostner and Kim, with Yu-Na slightly higher because of better transitions
3) Asada, close to Kostner and Kim but slightly behing in SS (speed) and IN
4) Sotnikova, at least 3-4 points behind the top three
5) Gracie and Lipnitskaya, close but not better than 65
PCS should have been 1) very close between Kostner and Kim, with Yu-Na slightly higher because of better transitions
3) Asada, close to Kostner and Kim but slightly behing in SS (speed) and IN
4) Sotnikova, at least 3-4 points behind the top three
5) Gracie and Lipnitskaya, close but not better than 65
- Joined
- Jan 1, 2010
What is the meaning of the number of tripes when a double combo gets more points than a triple? Let's be rational. 
