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Thread: 2020 Four Continents: Men's Free Skate

  1. #121
    On the Ice Mathman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bonita View Post
    Starting this season, Nathan did add transitions to some of his quads, some are pretty effortlessly, and timed perfectly to the music

    You can take a look at the technical breakdown of his GPF free skate
    https://twitter.com/NathanChinese/st...202064384?s=20
    https://twitter.com/NathanChinese/st...036498432?s=20
    https://twitter.com/NathanChinese/st...724624902?s=20
    https://twitter.com/NathanChinese/st...078666240?s=20
    Very cool.

    And yet, even careful analyses like these will leave some observers impressed and others less so. Except in the footwork section, a lot of Nathan's "transitions" are "leg swing, hop, shift body weight, upper body movement." Some judges might give him bullet points in TR for difficulty and variety, while other judges might expect more.

    What Nathan definitely has is clarity and precission.

  2. #122
    On the Ice Mathman's Avatar
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    About the whole topic of subjectivity in judging art, I think there is something to be said for the opposing point of view, too.

    Some pieces of pottery are exquisite and some are just lumps of clay. Beethoven's Sixth Symphony is better than his Seventh. Musicologists and experts in pottery actually can do a pretty convincing and somewhat objective breakdown of why a work of art is considered excellentor not, explanations that go beyond, "I like it" and "I don't."

  3. #123
    Tripping on the Podium
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman View Post
    Very cool.

    And yet, even careful analyses like these will leave some observers impressed and others less so. Except in the footwork section, a lot of Nathan's "transitions" are "leg swing, hop, shift body weight, upper body movement." Some judges might give him bullet points in TR for difficulty and variety, while other judges might expect more.

    What Nathan definitely has is clarity and precission.
    Oh, I am only responding to that poster’s comments “ no transition into them, and it isn't effortless throughout.“, not trying to get into scoring discussions.

    Having said that, I do believe any valid program criticism would only makes Nathan becomes better and stronger. He already made huge improvements in adding transitions this season considering how difficult just to land those quads.

  4. #124
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    Quote Originally Posted by bonita View Post
    Oh, I am only responding to that poster’s comments “ no transition into them, and it isn't effortless throughout.“, not trying to get into scoring discussions.

    Having said that, I do believe any valid program criticism would only makes Nathan becomes better and stronger. He already made huge improvements in adding transitions this season considering how difficult just to land those quads.
    I was mostly talking about the skaters referred to in comparison to Jason in the first paragraph of the comment I was responding to actually. Also I said "almost all skaters", so maybe you're a little touchy (for good reasons if this is something normally criticised of Nathan?). Anyways it was still interesting to see the videos you posted so thanks.

  5. #125
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    [QUOTE=el henry;2574817



    But as was pointed out, Jason also brings real, objective skills. Skating like he does, spinning like he does, steps like he does, is difficult, is hard to master, and at least at this comp, is rewarded by the judges.

    "Quality, quality, quality, quality, quality". I almost fell off my chair when I heard Johnny Weir, no friend to Jason in the past, say that at the end of his FS. It's a judged sport and quality counts


    Yes - this! At Nationals I started to hear Johnny begin to acknowledge Jason's skill. Then when he said this, I gasped out loud!

  6. #126
    ~ Figure Skating Is My Passion ~ Ladskater's Avatar
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    YuBluByMe

    "Canadian drama: We in trouble, I think. Sadovsky is my favorite Canadian dude, but he just couldn’t hold it together. I really wanted him to make a statement and do well. Messing was a disaster, but he’s a top 10 skater when he’s on. Nguyen isn’t so I’m nervous about next year’s spots."

    This worries me too. I think we've hit a dry spell with our men's and ladie's skaters, but at least our pairs and ice dancers are doing us proud. It will take time to rebuild.

  7. #127
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    Since the men's long programs have been shortened by 30 seconds, Seimei was jam-packed with jumps. Sometimes Hanyu had only three seconds to set up a jump, such as the last triple jump in the first half and the last quad in the second half.

  8. #128
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    Quote Originally Posted by silveruskate View Post
    I was mostly talking about the skaters referred to in comparison to Jason in the first paragraph of the comment I was responding to actually. Also I said "almost all skaters", so maybe you're a little touchy (for good reasons if this is something normally criticised of Nathan?). Anyways it was still interesting to see the videos you posted so thanks.
    I read very carefully the post you responded very carefully before I posted my comment.

    This is what you replied to
    As far as PCS, to me scores of 9+ is something that marks a program that stands apart by a wide margin. I didn’t watch figure skating for long, but when I see Hanyu, Uno, Chen, Plushenko, Fernandez, I can see they are in a tier of their own. When I look at Brown, he is not distinctive enough from the other skaters. He is good, no question, but he doesn’t to me seem to have the godlike quality that can get through to me as a non-specialist.
    Your reply specifically mentioned Shoma, which is in this paragraph, together with Yuzu, Nathan and Javi. You could be more specific about the skaters you were talking about to avoid confusions, which is an advice from another GSer last year.

    Personally I think Jason finally got the PCS he deserves, and hopefully this will be the case in future competitions. I just couldn’t agree on your previous comments about “no transitions, not smooth throughout”. He made great efforts to add those transitions in even his nemesis jump, the triple axles in Nationals and SkAM, but some people not saying you still keep accusing him only jumped through programs.

  9. #129
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    Quote Originally Posted by bonita View Post
    I read very carefully the post you responded very carefully before I posted my comment.

    This is what you replied to


    Your reply specifically mentioned Shoma, which is in this paragraph, together with Yuzu, Nathan and Javi. You could be more specific about the skaters you were talking about to avoid confusions, which is an advice from another GSer last year.

    Personally I think Jason finally got the PCS he deserves, and hopefully this will be the case in future competitions. I just couldn’t agree on your previous comments about “no transitions, not smooth throughout”. He made great efforts to add those transitions in even his nemesis jump, the triple axles in Nationals and SkAM, but some people not saying you still keep accusing him only jumped through programs.
    No, Shoma was mentioned in the first paragraph and I commented on PCS there. Afterwards I started another paragraph and talked about landing quads. You seriously need to read it all again. Not to mention, like before, I said "almost" and that is still true. Why you instantly saw that as something against Nathan only you know, besides it's obvious Nathan has done effortless quads so I'm lost for words.

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