Michelle - The End or a New Beginning?

Joe I think you are right for several reasons. The differance with Michelle and Irena reinventing themselves is that Irena always skated technically before her illness. After she recovered all the speed and strength she had before, simply came back. She never had to learn a new style of skating. Michelle on the other hand has to basically unlearn and start from scratch. She has to more or less turn herself into a jumper, fast spinner and speed herself up. Thay's alot to do before Italy. MK learned and was rewarded for an artistic approach to skating for all these past years.. That form of skating is no longer viable under CoP with each element graded. Finally, lets not forget Speedy's threat to force the skaters to do the GP, something MK does not like and also could wear her out. Coming in 4th at Worlds could require her to do the GP. As far as the future of skating, it is in no danger because we have some of the most talented, amazing, daring young people waiting in the wings that will make the future most exciting. Mk's mid July retirement would not surprise me either Joe

I think it will be both an end and a new beginning.

Barring injury, I think Michelle will go to Turino in 2006. What I am less certain about is how she will approach it.

She may continue to use stripped down programs and not push herself. If this is the case, 2006 will amount to little more than a farewell tour. She may be able to get on the podium with such a program if it is skated well, but I don't see her winning. I don't think there's anything wrong with this if its what she wants to do.

Or she could muster all her energies and work as hard as she ever has in 2006. This will be much, much harder than the "farewell tour." She will need to dive whole-hog into code of points, not merely sticking her big toe in it like she did this season. She will need to find music that strikes a chord within her and inspires her to greatness. And she will have to work tirelessly on crafting a well choreographed program and skating it till she knows it in her sleep.

In any case, 2006 will be a crossroads year for the sport. Under CoP, anything can happen. Many sacred cows have been slaughtered and perceptions totally shaken up. What will happen next? Finally, it will be Kwan's Swan Song, she who is arguably the face of figure skating. I find myself thinking of how she blew the roof off the skating world 10 years ago with Romanza and Salome and hoping she can find the will to seek perfection one more time.

Kwanford Wife said:

It's not the system, it was the skate.

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That gets my vote for best quote of '05 Worlds and not just regarding Michelle, regarding all the system vs. skating discussions. Great entire post, BTW. But not to get off topic: Lest we forget, Michelle has her COI contract to fulfill, so it's not as if she can rest up after Worlds and then go full bore, eight hours a day, into not just learning the COP, but also getting it into her body. Unless she can get out of all or some of her COI commitments, that means she can't really start concentrating on next season until early August.

I still think she will give adjusting to the COP her best shot, including seriously working on a 3/3 and participating in the GPS. However, depending on how things go will, IMO, determine her attitude going into the Olympics. If things go poorly for her on the GP circuit, and by that I mean a couple of second or third place finishes, she might go into the Olympics with an attitude of, "I'm going to do exactly what I want to do! Forget the COP!"

OTOH, she could take the Jeff Buttle approach, which is rather than focus on 3/3 jumps she knows from experience cause her pain and injury, to go all out with someone who can deliver the goods choreographically (pick your favorite choreographer who is not working with one of her rivals) and do what she does best, interpret great choreography with all her heart.

Another option is that she use he Olympics much the way Katerina Witt did in '94, that is, to make a statement. Being the historian she is, maybe she'll revive "Salome" to sort of "book-end" her competitive career. But I find this scenario unlikely.

I think nothing gets the competitive spirit of a born competitor like Michelle going than an experience like these Worlds. Michelle has been at a much higher elite level for many more years, but compared to Nancy Kerrigan when she competed at the '94 Olympics at 24, Michelle will only be a year older. Nancy pulled off a 3t/3t at that ripe old age and did everything in her LP except double a 3flip. Sure there are the young ones who have grabbed every ladies OGM since '94, but if anyone can change that trend, it's Michelle.

My only hope is that she forget about these programs to music that's either recently been used by a competitor ("Tosca") or has an iconic status in figure skating ("Bolero"). I think Michelle has a great opportunity to establish new iconic programs, whether at the Olympics and Worlds or as a pro, but I don't think she moves forward by looking back, or rather listening back, at other skaters' music.

Having said all that, were Michelle either retire or win no medal at the '06 Olympics and then turn pro, I'll throw out just one other name: Kurt Browning. Kurt when into both the '92 and '94 Olympics as World champion and came away from both without a medal. Kurt was a four-time World champion who'd been at or near the top for almost as many years as Michelle.

His first few years as a pro were lacklustre and sometimes downright embarrassing, but IMO, he went on to do his best skating and make his most memorable skating statements as a pro.

I still think Michelle will win the '06 OGM for no reason I can explain. I just do. But I think--strike that--I know life can throw more scenarios at us than we can possibly think of. I think that no matter what happens, Michelle will refuse, as much as any of us can, to let herself have anything but a great life, whether it be performing in front of countless fans, having a great family life while doing figure skating commentary, or doing something completely different.

Rgirl

Great Post, Rgirl, and everyone else too. So many valid points made and still no closer to actually knowing (fer shure) what MK may or may not do....there's hope for the off season after all!

I do think if Michelle is to go for the Olympics next year there are certain things she must do and other things that she can ( and believe me, only MK would have the money to do some of these optionals) do.

First, I think she needs to figure out that avoiding next years GP series would be a serious mistake. I don't even think she has to do anything but bring the beginnings of a Jeff Buttle/Joannie Rochette inspired choreographed programs with limited jumping passes and medal to serve notice that she is serious about showing up prepared. No one is better off at the first of the season than Michelle, I'd say do the North American Events and then go back and train like heck for the Final (I'm sure she'll make it) and use that as a 'go for the gusto experience' right before the holidays to have to know what she has to pull out to win in Turino.

Second is decline all "fluff' competitions. Lord knows Ms Kwan need never eat Macaroni and Cheese again unless she wants it. She doesn't need to worry about them. She doesn't need the money or the exposure. If she cherry picked just one to keep her confidence up ( never hurts to hear hundreds of people screaming your name) I suppose I could understand that. Marshall's won't go under and the competitions will be just as interesting if they invest in attempting in some foreign talent to boost the popularity. No offence to our Junior lady's, it's just I'd rather see Julia Sebastyn or Susanna Pokiio rather than one of the juniors.

As for what she can do...there's a lot and, like I said, some of it is something that only a few skaters could afford to do to win next Olympics. Fly in Denise Beillmann or Lucina in to help MK with Spins and also a trainer specifically with expertise in core strength development. I don't think it would be so bad if Michelle worked with a full time motivational sports psychologist (if she doesn't already).

Though I doubt she could get Tarasova to work with her because of "conflict of interest", perhaps she could work with Moskvina or one of the other great Russian coaches on power stroking i.e getting more power for the push which would help her both skate faster and consequently give her better ice coverage.

Another thing that has been mentioned in detail in another thread is to pay Lori Nichols fee and give her explicit instructions to "challange her" choregraphically. Nichols has proved beyond a shadow of a doubt that she's a premier choregrahper with the Chinese and many of her other clients. If Kwan and Nichols can work together as equal partners (as opposed the the Frank Carroll Skating Experience) then I believe the result could be a great program. Of course, Il Kwan could also afford to keep Ms. Nichlols on retainer to help her refine and rework as needed through the season. I think one of the chief problems with Kwans Bolero program is that it was too "ever evolving". So much so that I don't think I ever saw the darn thing skated twice in the same exact manner, order, etc. Short of Nichols, I'd be asking Sandra Bezick. SB may not be my favorite skating personality, but I do have to give her props on some exsquisite programs (By the way, Ms Peggy F. If you're reading this, that's the way to use the word in a broadcast. Reserve it for one use and it's done for the night, thank you very much)

The last thing I would suggest for Ms. Kwan is another challange. I know that she has expressed the desire for some sort of normalcy in her life and I also know that she'd probably enjoy some "pedestrian" experiences. Once of the best investments I think MK can make right now is in her mind. While she is young and still able to comprehend and learn so much at a much easier rate, It think it would be good for both MK and her skating if she were persuing some more education. That doesn't mean sacrificing practice time to go to UCLA, but any means that will both challange her mind while actually taking it off the pressures of winning that darned, ever elusive, OGM. Michelle is so smart and such a naturally warm person, I don't even think it would be beyond the pale of learning something fun like tv production and "Art of the Deal" type materials so that she can be fully prepared to sieze her own destiny when figure skating will eventually be done.

...or she could quietly retire....I sure hope not, this upcoming year wouldn't be nearly so much fun without her.

Great thread. I agree as with others that this is a pivotal moment for Michelle.

As for Kwanford's quote regarding Kwan's skate, I don't think it was primarily her skate but also the judges as well.

And comparing her to Irina is like comparing apples and oranges. The difference is that yes Irina came back from her sickness; kudos to her but one cannot dismiss how Kwan has constantly been able to be at the top of her sport for so many years so that is impressive as well. Just think about the heartaches she suffered, starting with the '97 season and Nagano and how she was able to come back each time as well as from the disappointment with SLC.

This is a new era of skating for Michelle but I have the confidence that she'll be able to learn from this and take advantage of it. Although she made some unwise choices with deciding to not have her programs scored under the COP system until at this year's worlds, she'll learn from it evidently and will make the necessary changes needed to remain competitive.

I also highly doubt that she will retire. I'm sure most of us know how driven Michelle is while also paying careful attention to her health. I'm sure she will make the wise decisions to not injure herself for next season while raising the bar for herself. Why do I say this? Because she is Michelle Kwan.

Kwan is still in the hunt although not a lock for gold and maybe this is a good position for her in comparison to Nagano and SLC. Yet it depends on how determined she is to work towards Turino.

Lots of great things have been said here and I can only add one thing to what's all ready been said.

The last time MK had a not so hot overall season, she went on to be one of the few undefeated singles skaters in the very next season. In other words, 2002's disappointments begat 2003's new beginning. Just seeing her history of great recoveries from bitter disappointments, I'm not as worried about her future programs and performances as a lot of others seem to be. I think her fire still burns for competitive skating but I think its just going to be burning a little brighter this coming year. Call me an eternal optimist but look at the history too.

Everything being said about Michelle is in reference to her entire 6.0 career. None of this is relevant under Cop. If as R said, she has to go into COI and not be done with that until mid to late August, when will she have the time to have 2 CoP friendly new programs ready for the new season? The reason as I stated before that Irena could come back so sucessfully is because unlike MK, she was always a technical skater even under 6,0. MK is an artistic skater. CoP as we've seen rewards the technical dispite all the pre Worlds talk about it rewarding the total package. The reality is there is not enough time to prepare an artistic skater to change everything she's always known and done, no matter how many times she won 6.0 medals. It's not the same reward system. CoP is element based. Nobody not doing a 3/3 will win olympic gold. The only exception might be Sasha only because of her incredible spins and lay backs but even that won't get her gold without a 3/3.

From what I know and have seen of Michelle, I just can't see her bowing out at this point. If she does, she's definetly not the competitor I took her for. I think she's gonna stick it out, and might even give some people quite a surprise at the Olys.

How many stops does COI have this season. Will there be a second tour? Okay her I go. I think at this point I think it would be silly to throw out the towel this late. But it is her decision.

I find it unbelievable that everyone is saying RETIREMENT. Is that her only option. II personally hope she stays in the skating world in someway. Remember when the Eligible career was the beginning of it all. REMEMBER Pro Skating. Something that has been dead due to lack of talent.I have a feeling a new crop of skaters is just what it needs as well as some good business people. Champions On Ice would not be the same without her. With Boitano gone she is all Tom Collins has if the next OGM's go to SOI again. There are still so many things she can do? Her speech is slurred but I would rather listen to her commentate than Roz.

Also I have a feeling she would rather go out on top. We'll see what happens at the cheesefest.

As I said it is not entirely impossible for her to adapt to the new judging system but It won't be easy. It will take hard work.. and if she chooses not to I won't blame her. She has taken things easy the past few years. But she has worked her butt off since the age of five. She hasn't whined about it.

Let me add this Did we think less of Brian, Victor and Katarina after the 94 Olympics where they finished 6th,4th and 7th? I didn't




JoeSitz. Who are you?
Dick Button, Frank Carroll a USFSA official?

tannisming said:

Everything being said about Michelle is in reference to her entire 6.0 career. None of this is relevant under Cop. If as R said, she has to go into COI and not be done with that until mid to late August, when will she have the time to have 2 CoP friendly new programs ready for the new season? The reason as I stated before that Irena could come back so sucessfully is because unlike MK, she was always a technical skater even under 6,0. MK is an artistic skater. CoP as we've seen rewards the technical dispite all the pre Worlds talk about it rewarding the total package. The reality is there is not enough time to prepare an artistic skater to change everything she's always known and done, no matter how many times she won 6.0 medals. It's not the same reward system. CoP is element based. Nobody not doing a 3/3 will win olympic gold. The only exception might be Sasha only because of her incredible spins and lay backs but even that won't get her gold without a 3/3.

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You're making out the 6.0 system to be a piece of cake and I don't think it was by any means. If Michelle buckles down soon and gets ready for next season, then I have no reason to believe that she won't be ready with 2 COP ready programs. Aren't the facts in how she did at Moscow a good indication of how she can fare well under it? Even with the mistakes she made, she was not that far off scorewise from the others with her scores in the 7s. True Michelle is more renowned as an artistic skater than a technical one but she has been able to show her technical prowess at times although not often. I think for the most part she's been taking the safe approach and not wanting to injure herself ever since the '98 scare. Why do you doubt that Michelle or any artistic skater for that matter would not have enough time to ready their programs for COP next season? If they have the determination and the work ethic, I don't see why not. And I don't think a 3/3 is really imperative for you to win Olympic gold. It would be helpful but not the absolute factor in winning.

More hopes:

At a very young age Michelle set herself the goal of becoming the best figure skater in the world. She achieved that goal. Medals and awards are external pats on the back for such acheivement, but they are not the acheivement itself.

Scott Hamilton was a very fine amateur skater and he won an Olympic gold medal to prove it (although his Olympic perfomance is not one that he wants to remember). But the reason that he is an icon of the sport, the best recognized, best-loved and most influential male skater of the last thirty years, is because of all he accomplished afterward. There have been many Olympic champions, but only one Scott Hamilton, in terms of his impact on the sport.

To me, Michelle Kwan, because of her immense popularity, has a unique opportunity to have a similar influence on the sport, beyond just leaving us with a stack of video tapes of all-time great performances. I don't know exaclty what that will turn out to be. But my wish for her is that she will be seized with an inspiration to really take the bull by the horns, to break out of the box and ... (?)

Mathman

Wow! I think I set off a serious thinking spree on this topic. For that I am happy because that kind of thinking is what makes a forum interesting. No one bashed; no one gushed. All of your comments are well taken by me, and I think all our GS members have contributed something to what they consider MK's next move after losing out for the first time in how many years. That loss, btw, is not unlike, so many tennis players, gymnists, divers, etc. It's quite the "way of all flesh".

To look at it realistically, Michelle, imo, has major Technical problems. Problems which will be difficult to resolve within 12 months coupled up with skating in COI which is doing a routine by rote. Not that the routine wont be a beautiful skate, but it will not give us anything we haven't seen before. And what happens to the practice time during the tour?

She has an excellent coach who takes skating seriously. MK has improved with him in many ways. The revolutions on her spins, the height and distance of her jumps but, she should have come up with at least a 3tx3t for Moscow. How could I possibly expect a 3zx3r?. The lady who placed third has the requisite high level technical. She lacks maturity but that will improve by Torino in her home town. I'm afraid Michelle's road to an Olympic medal is is based on errors by her top competitors - and not based on 'all things equal'.

If anyone has a different take on all this than me, by all means let me know.

Joe

if you're judging Michelle's severe technical problems by the lack of a 3/3, Peggy reported that Kwan was practicing them in moscow and that in the kiss and cry, Kwan was apparently angry about missing the salchow because she was planning a 3/3 there. Some said it could be heard during the telecast.

I think the major improvements she has to make from here to Turino would be as Michelle said "spins and transitions".
A program where she actually looks like she's enjoying herself would be cool too

On the positive side, I was thrilled that kwan did 3 jump combos including a 3/2/2. First time ever

Teenagers aren't the only ones willing to work for a medal.

Here's my personal take on it:

Michelle has just reached a point in her career that many of us don't reach til we're middle aged. She's an expert at what she does, in terms of quality, notoriety, and years of experience. When faced with a new variation of what's she's already very good at, she elected to test the waters (yes, even on the glaringly big Worlds stage). She did not want to break her neck (or any other body part) or risk motivational burnout trying to win it all... this time.

I can relate. I was a critical care nurse for 25 years, having practiced, taught, lectured in that specialty, when I made a change to a new nursing field. Out of a sense of professionalism, I decided to take a certification exam in the new specialty, studying the core content for only a few weeks. I figured, 'I'm a nurse, I know enough to pass this test'. I did pass. Not with an overwhelming score, but passing nonetheless. Do I need a stronger and more refined body of knowledge in my new field? Of course, but now I know my weak areas and can go from there.

Look at all the skaters who worked hard at CoP over the past few years, did the GP, and finished below Michelle at Worlds. Michelle is in a great position to take the road to the Olympics. She knows where she stands among her competitors in the NJS. CoP may be flawed, but the microanalysis of elements may be a big favor to Michelle. How many times has she received low tech scores and wondered 'what the...?' Now she can dissect her programs as well as those of the other skaters.

I would love her not only to take on the CoP, but create 2 great programs that are more than the sum of points. Something only an expert in her prime like Michelle can do. And I think the judges are just waiting to see her do it.

Travel

Michelle doesn't like to travel... so, crazy as this may sound, she may decide to sit out the Olys. Irina slam dunks (if her health allows her) the retires. A month later, Michelle goes to Worlds - it's in Canada, right? And she garners her record breaking championship.

Tee hee. Don't depend on me to predict the future...

Linny

Please. Michelle is not going to sit out the Olympics. If she wasn't going to try for it, she would have hung up her skates after last season.

The COI tour is very short in non-Olympic years. Last season, it went only through mid June, so Michelle will have plenty of time to start working on new programs and practice the moves she needs to be successful under CoP.

She is only 24. Irina is 26 and Sokolova, 25. Maria B. was still winning medals at 28.

Michelle placed 3rd in both SP and FS in her first competition under CoP. That is amazing, under the circumstances, as her FS was a mess and did not bring out her best performance qualities.

It's up to MK to decide if she wants to continue or not. But if she does continue, she will build on what she learned in Moscow and will not finish off the podium again.

chuckm said:

Please. Michelle is not going to sit out the Olympics. If she wasn't going to try for it, she would have hung up her skates after last season.

It's up to MK to decide if she wants to continue or not. But if she does continue, she will build on what she learned in Moscow and will not finish off the podium again.

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Problem with MK as I have said so many times is that she is mysterious. We will never know if she is going to go after an Olympic Medal until the results are in. We will never know if she is working at it from end-of-COI till the Qualis rounds. We will never know anything unless she skates the GPs and as far as Nats is concerned she will be up against a silver Worlds medalist.

It's not enough to hear that Michelle is working on several 3x3s that never appear at competition. The questions are 1. Will she skate the GPs? and 2. Will we actually see the 3x3s before Worlds?

Joe

Rgirl said:

Lest we forget, Michelle has her COI contract to fulfill, so it's not as if she can rest up after Worlds and then go full bore, eight hours a day, into not just learning the COP, but also getting it into her body. Unless she can get out of all or some of her COI commitments, that means she can't really start concentrating on next season until early August ... Rgirl

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According to the schedule currently posted, COI's last scheduled stop is May 1, in Anaheim (I already have my tickets). Why do you think that Michelle can't really concentrate on her programs (assuming she continues to compete) until early August?

Rgirl said:

I still think Michelle will win the '06 OGM for no reason I can explain. I just do.

Rgirl

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Rgirl, great post all around, but I love this part the best!

By the way, for those who have brought it up, COI's last tour date is May 1. For the past couple of years it has ended relatively early, especially compared to 2002, when it went on into August, I believe.