2012 TEB Ladies Long Program Lp

[R.D.]

Great comeback by Gao in the FS to pull up to 4th.

The more I think about it, the more I say that Wagner is the American response to Korpi & Kostner. I think Team Wagner has finally figured out how to make the system work for her and I only pray that she remains healthy. If she keeps this up she's a World Medal Contender and I wouldn't even rule her out for the title.

 

[Art&Sport]

Great comeback by Gao in the FS to pull up to 4th.

The more I think about it, the more I say that Wagner is the American response to Korpi & Kostner. I think Team Wagner has finally figured out how to make the system work for her and I only pray that she remains healthy. If she keeps this up she's a World Medal Contender and I wouldn't even rule her out for the title.

That's interesting, and I get what you mean. Ironically, IMHO, I believe that in some ways both Korpi and Kostner were influenced by what Alissa Czisny brought to the ice during 2010 - 2011 season.

 

[tulosai]

I love Julia. Nothing is wrong to be that flexible, she just need to build her flex moves into choreo, not making people think she is just showing flexibility for flexibility's sake; Remember last year people were complaining Liza's excessive hand movement. This year, she just got rid of them, and probably even easier for her. As a 14 year old, she is amazing. For me, no matter you get on the podium at 14 or 28, it is the same podium. Why many people complain she (and other young girls) is good at jumps only because she is young and small.
Come on, every lady has a time when she is 14; you weren't as good as Julia, or Liza (last year) when you were 14, it's not their problem.

This is only kind of related to what you are saying but I just wanted to also step in for Julia and respond to the people in this thread that have said she can't hold her flex positions or can't do them on an edge.

Julia needs work on her edges (they can be weak) but here is a spiral in her current exhibition that she preformed just a few weeks ago at CoC. She holds an insane flex position for nearly 10 whole seconds, including a change of edge. At the end the edge wobbles some as she comes out of it, and throughout the edge could be stronger/is actually weak, but she is definitely not on a flat and she can, indeed, hold these positions. She just needs better choreo to enable her to do so (and to even enable her to find the edge- a lot of her 'flex' moves in the programs last literally one second, there is no time for her to get on or hold an edge in preforming them).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8PD4ZdTMfbI#t=2m02s

 

[draqq]

Ashley Wagner is today's Joannie Rochette: strong and high jumps (almost fiercely so), powerful music interpreted with equal parts grace and strength, and defined confidence. She also has a solid layback spin, competent charlotte spiral, and doesn't let her musical interpretation drop for more than five seconds.

The only parts of her skating I think could be improved is her turning ability and turn difficulty, which can be seen in her footwork sequence. While she doesn't waste her arm movements like other skaters, there's a lot of posing to the beat, which is fine and allows her to gain speed for the important jumps but that's not terribly difficult.

Still, I like how she changed some of the ending choreography where she stopped and posed after her footwork sequence; now she covers more ice before her final triple flip.

 

[aftertherain]

Ashley Wagner is today's Joannie Rochette: strong and high jumps (almost fiercely so), powerful music interpreted with equal parts grace and strength, and defined confidence. She also has a solid layback spin, competent charlotte spiral, and doesn't let her musical interpretation drop for more than five seconds.

Didn't Joannie also skate to "Samson & Delilah" during the Olympic year?

 

[R.D.]

Ashley Wagner is today's Joannie Rochette

Another interesting analogy. Both Wagner and Rochette were middle-of-the-pack skaters for several years before they finally had their big break and rose to the top rung of elite skaters. However, Rochette did not have to deal with intense competition at the national level like Wagner does/did, and that resulted in more international experience (mainly Worlds).

I think Wagner pays better attention to detail than Rochette did, though.

 

[jaylee]

Ashley Wagner is today's Joannie Rochette: strong and high jumps (almost fiercely so), powerful music interpreted with equal parts grace and strength, and defined confidence. She also has a solid layback spin, competent charlotte spiral, and doesn't let her musical interpretation drop for more than five seconds.

Huh, other than both skating to Samson and Delilah in the FS, the two don't share much in common in my eyes. Ashley is a better spinner than Rochette, but Rochette is definitely the better jumper--real lutz, and most all of her jumps were big--Rochette was never prone to UR calls (though she also never attempted many 3/3s). However, Ashley has dealt with UR calls for much of her career, and it's a factor that's contributed to why she hasn't had more success until 2012, where a new confidence has helped her with her jumps.

 

[Ilvskating]

Sorry to rain on Ashley's parade, but her LP appears pale comparing with Joannie rochette's program. when the music was crying for choreography, she simply glide around with a few wiggling of wrists. I'm glad Ashley finally put things together, but I think her scores are a bit too high.

Don't think Ashley and Joannie have much in common either. Ashley is by nature a drama queen, but Joannie is pretty much a introvert person. Joannie had great jumping techniques but a bit stiff. Ashely has a better built but Joannie has more genuine charm. Ashley is a better spinner and Better performer.

A any way, we need to see somebody come up with decent performance with respectable TES at this stage.

 

[christinaskater]

If Ashley continues with this confidence level, she will be rewarded and could score 200+

 

[Art&Sport]

Sorry to rain on Ashley's parade ...

To each their own opinion. IMO, Ashley is her own creation. Perhaps the one thing Ashley might have in common with Joannie is that they both have taken (as have many skaters) some inspiration from the admirable qualities and the courage that Michelle Kwan consistently brought to the ice.

You really can't "rain on the parade" of someone who owns more than one umbrella, but still isn't afraid to dance in the rain without one, and is fully prepared to shine regardless of whether the rain comes or the sun appears from behind the clouds.

Go Ashley!

 

[gmyers]

Edge calls on lutzes are just the way things are going to be for Ashley and that is fine. She lays a penalty but not a big one.

Julia tried to do more of a 2a/3T/2t but because of her switching and revamping she did 2a/1t first. Unfortunate.

Great for tuktamisheva. those jumps were so secure. They just seemed so secure! Except for one but she saved it and it all looked great! SP training must improve though!

 

[Blades of Passion]

Tuktamisheva was super impressive. Will we see anything better than that this year in terms of the jumps? I doubt it. This is quite a good program too, IMO, and she seems to really understand most of the nuances. Definitely the LP winner here for me.

Wagner was solid and everything seemed easy, which is pleasant to see. I don't think it's a well-choreographed program or that she interpreted the music particularly well.

Gao did well again but she's missing originality. There's nothing about her skating that seems her own.

Lipnitskaya is scary. It's truly as if Slutskaya, Lipinski, and Cohen were all mixed together into one skater. She has all of their faults and all of their capabilities at the same time, and she seems to "want" it as badly as all 3 of those women put together, which really says something. Just scary.

 

[FSGMT]

Is Lipnitskaya the first lady ever to receive +1.50 GOE for a CCoSp?
And, I'm so happy for Liza: I didn't think she could have made the final! :agree:
Wagner: I felt it was a stunning performance, she really deserved 64 PCS, I liked Liza and Gao but when I saw Ashley it was

 

[Mathman]

You really can't "rain on the parade" of someone who owns more than one umbrella, but still isn't afraid to dance in the rain without one, and is fully prepared to shine regardless of whether the rain comes or the sun appears from behind the clouds.

That sentence is art. Also sport.

 

[yude]

I was so impressed by Ashley's performance!!
She looked very confident and sold her program very well.

 

[3T3T]

Great performance by Tuk, it was my favourite performance of the day. I think the judges are tough on her PCS scores, unfairly so, I would have her closer to Wagner and she should more or less level with Julia. I find Wagners performance to be a bit forced, don't like her style, it's a bit false or something. The judges clearly like her, she has a great shot for a worlds podium if not the title. I enjoy Julias performances but I think the ankle injury held her back a bit plus I think she seems a bit nervous/tense, her axle does look a bit different.

I really love to Polina K's presentation but sadly her jumps were not on yesterday. It's a very mature style, which is a bit unusual in todays skating.

 

[ice coverage]

Ashley Wagner ‏@AshWagner2010

To those who were waiting outside the rink, I'm sorry if I didn't give you an autograph! It was very cold and I'm sick!
8:11 AM - 18 Nov 12​

Wagner is sick today? Hope that she feels better soon.

 

[FlattFan]

True, but Carolina didn't have the amount of jumps Ashley did nor did she have the transitions into and out of her jumps. It's also important to remember that scoring is relative to the competition.

I think Ashley's PCS are high but given the speed she skates with, ease across the ice and sureness of movement (SS), the difficult transitions into and out of her elements (TR), the gorgeous choreography that highlights the music (CH), her attention to the music and portrayal of the character (IN) and the fact that she executed all of her elements and performed with energy and excitement (PE), I'd say those marks are justified.

Sorry, but you also think that Agnes has the speed and the ease across the ice. So tt means you know nothing about speed and ease across the ice.
I've seen Wagner live. She's above average in term of speed. Not the kind of girl you'd go WOW! when seeing live. She's good. Her PCS, about 4 points more than she deserved.

Caro didn't break that kind of PCS even after getting on the World podium multiple times. And her choreography and interpretation have always been two or three levels above Wagner. Her SS should be at least 2 points above Wagner.

PCS is so crazy now, it's a turn off for me.

 

[ForeverFish]

Ashley Wagner ‏@AshWagner2010

To those who were waiting outside the rink, I'm sorry if I didn't give you an autograph! It was very cold and I'm sick!
8:11 AM - 18 Nov 12​

Wagner is sick today? Hope that she feels better soon.

She has a head cold and was battling it throughout her FS--after her spectacular skate when Nicks asked her if she was feeling good, she replied, "No."

 

[silverlake22]

I think some of Julia's struggles this season just have to due with getting older. And I don't event mean physically growing, though she has grown since last season (still is really tiny though), but a 13 year old mindset is very different from that of a 14-16 year old mindset, when along with the physical changes of puberty a lot of girls start to doubt themselves, suffer from poor self-esteem, become very sensitive and perhaps over-critical. It's a quick shift but most girls go through it, being a bubbly young tween without a care or fear in the world and you just go for everything and are cute and soak it all in then all of a sudden there are expectations and everything, your body, your thoughts, emotions, etc. change and it's hard to deal with. We saw that happen with Mirai and Caroline a few years back, and I think that is part of what has caused Adelina to struggle, she seems very eager to please, and a bit self-conscious, very hard on herself, and I think that makes a big difference.

Liza seems to have the great characteristic of mental fortitude and competitive spirit. She wants to do well and showed she has what it takes, proving all the naysayers wrong who thought she wouldn't be able to jump now that she has filled out. To me it seems like Liza is very focused on herself and not as distracted or affected by things going on outside the skating rink. Anyways her body is just going through a transitional period, she is still quite a small girl, short and very small frame, her legs, arms, and waist are just now thicker which is common for girls at that age, most likely the weight will shift as she grows into a more womanly shape. Based on the way she skated today I am not that worried about puberty monster doing her in, her good technique has served her well, this is probably the most difficult time she'll go through physically, and despite comments of others if you look at pictures of her in normal clothes, you'll see she really is very tiny. I don't think Liza is even 5 feet tall so on one that small a few pound gain seems very noticeable. As for Julia she has no speed going out of her jumps, and the technique isn't as good as Liza, I worry more about puberty hurting her jumps even if she remains slimmer than Liza.