2014 Olympics Ladies Free Skate

[cptnhastings]

yes she was, there was no downgrade only two slight under rotation calls, that many commentators and skaters openly said was undeserved, since both jumps were fully rotated. besides it's just as easy to give an unjust under rotation call as it is to turn a blind eye to other skaters who actually deserved it!

This is the second time I've typed up that comment about Mao and said it inelegantly each time. I think she had an e and the two URs are highly suspect. But the judged Mao v. the judged Julia in the free skate isn't as clearly obscene given the downgrades and edge calls. It's just my response to "Mao got gypped on her 8 triples" when the technical panel, likely wrongly, downgraded two jumps so it's not directly comparable. (I also don't think they had a great incentive to do so since Mao was 20 points behind, so I dunno.)

Yup! And Yuna would've been the only lady allowed to have 8 jumping passes in the free!

Ugh! I knew I was forgetting something. Thanks for reminding me! Serves me right for responding when I'm tired.

And that is crazy that a subbed-in triple loop and 2A-3T would've not been enough!

 

[Ven]

It would not have been enough because the results were rigged. It's pointless to look for where more points could have been gained, because the placements were fixed ahead of time. Other inaccuracies would have taken place in the judging to guarantee the fixed placements, if needed.

 

[capcomeback]

It would not have been enough because the results were rigged. It's pointless to look for where more points could have been gained, because the placements were fixed ahead of time. Other inaccuracies would have taken place in the judging to guarantee the fixed placements, if needed.

It's sad to say that the fix is likely. With Adelina's "flutz" and UR on her opening element not even being examined by most of the judges and the convenient absence of the US and South Korean judges in the LP (along with the ridiculous PCS Adelina received), it really begs the question. Until there is more transparency (and better assessing judges for their sloppiness if this was not conspiracy), figure skating will continue to be seen as a joke by the general public.

Additionally, NBC noted sports analyst, Bob Costas brought up a good point when he interviewed frick (Johnny) and frack (Tara). Why should scores in the second half of a program be given a bonus? Yes, they are harder to achieve, but so is a three point basket in basketball on tired legs and a goal in soccer (on even more tired legs, lol). This "Bonus System" was only recently introduced within the last decade and I'm not sure if it really enhances the sport. It certainly rewards jumping beans like Adelina, Kevin Reynolds and Max Aaron.

 

[zschultz1986]

It's sad to say that the fix is likely. With Adelina's "flutz" and UR on her opening element not even being examined by most of the judges and the convenient absence of the US and South Korean judges in the LP (along with the ridiculous PCS Adelina received), it really begs the question. Until there is more transparency (and better assessing judges for their sloppiness if this was not conspiracy), figure skating will continue to be seen as a joke by the general public.

This, 200%. It was completely clear in the protocols that the judges were going for Adelina when the Tech caller didn't ding her for the flutz OR ding her or the UR, both of which were painfully obvious upon review. "Skating while Russian" in Russia seems to remedy all your skating technique faults. There's a reason she doesn't do lutz in the short.

I understand that PCS is still -relatively- subjective, but tech callers do this all the time, and it's blatant, disgusing, and cheating. They artificially raise/lower scores by being lenient on UR calls, e or ! calls, on some, and not on others. The PCS bloat for Yulia, Adelina, and (to a lesser extent) Gracie are one thing, but not calling elements fairly is quite another. The tech caller was Russian, no? Without knowing the nationality of he/she, it seems pretty obvious they were either Russian or Russian-adjacent from the protocols.

 

[Kinga]

Jumping in a bit late, maybe a discussion is somewhere else now, but I wanted to reply quickly to some posts:

She won on technical score. Did Mao, Kostnar, Kim do all different triples + 2 axel?

?? Kostner had all different triples + 2 axel. Mao had 8 different triples + triple axel. Just to make facts straights for some.

Have you looked at Mao's elements? She unfortunately had two of her triples downgraded to doubles.
And what do you mean by "Putin's judges?" Do you realize that NONE of the judges on the panel, or the technical specialists, were Russian?

Her triples were not downgraded but called as underotated. That is a big difference.
Again - to make the facts straight - yes, the tech specialist was Russian, another member of tech panel was Finnish Olga Baranova.. And Russia had the jugde, Piseev wife. Another judge - UKR Yuri Balkov was already accussed once with corruption.

Haha what a joke.

Gracie and Ashley are nowhere near the artistry, jumps and pirouettes of Adelina.

They were certainly overscored, one fell on her BUTT, another cannot do a combination without landing on two feet!

Adelina landed on two feet as well on her 3 jump combo. I do not understand why some fans have to put some skaters down and look at their idols through pink glasses.

There is nothing to explain. She deserved her placement.

Kostner takes two coffee breaks (at least) in her program and IMO she was quite well gifted in TES for that performance given the overall quality of the technical elements therein.

It is better to take two coffee breaks in choreography, than have a totally random choreo that does not relate to music whatsoever.

Don’t get me wrong, I think Adelina won fair and square, but I do not like when people stretch the facts.
I think the last thing the sport needs it’s another scandal. Adelina was overscored in PCS. No doubt. Lets move on.
Instead we should be exciting about the future of ladies figure skating – look at the massive talents we will have fighting for Worlds and Olympic golds – Julia, Adelina, Gracie, Polina, Elena R., Katelyn and many others.

 

[kslr0816]

^ i think people who consider adelina's score to be legitimate have more or less quieted and have little ground to stand on with how the scores (including SP, not just LP) have been broken down.

 

[zschultz1986]

Don’t get me wrong, I think Adelina won fair and square, but I do not like when people stretch the facts.
I think the last thing the sport needs it’s another scandal. Adelina was overscored in PCS. No doubt. Lets move on.
Instead we should be exciting about the future of ladies figure skating – look at the massive talents we will have fighting for Worlds and Olympic golds – Julia, Adelina, Gracie, Polina, Elena R., Katelyn and many others.

Nater is a zealot who can not see reason.

Adelina was not just over-scored in PCS, she was given breaks by the tech caller afforded to no other skaters (except maybe Julia), which in turn let the judges give some ridiculous GoE.

She definitely did NOT win fair and square. The judging was not her fault, but saying she won fair and square is FALSE.

 

[kslr0816]

http://www.thewire.com/culture/2014...kovas-allegedly-rigged-gold-medal-win/358425/

this article shows some of the other scorecards' inconsistencies, i.e., Yulia's

 

[bestskate8]

Some posters need actually to WATCH programs

 

[capcomeback]

Jumping in a bit late, maybe a discussion is somewhere else now, but I wanted to reply quickly to some posts:



?? Kostner had all different triples + 2 axel. Mao had 8 different triples + triple axel. Just to make facts straights for some.



Her triples were not downgraded but called as underotated. That is a big difference.
Again - to make the facts straight - yes, the tech specialist was Russian, another member of tech panel was Finnish Olga Baranova.. And Russia had the jugde, Piseev wife. Another judge - UKR Yuri Balkov was already accussed once with corruption.



Adelina landed on two feet as well on her 3 jump combo. I do not understand why some fans have to put some skaters down and look at their idols through pink glasses.


It is better to take two coffee breaks in choreography, than have a totally random choreo that does not relate to music whatsoever.

Don’t get me wrong, I think Adelina won fair and square, but I do not like when people stretch the facts.
I think the last thing the sport needs it’s another scandal. Adelina was overscored in PCS. No doubt. Lets move on.
Instead we should be exciting about the future of ladies figure skating – look at the massive talents we will have fighting for Worlds and Olympic golds – Julia, Adelina, Gracie, Polina, Elena R., Katelyn and many others.

Regardless of what the sport needs. if there is a conspiracy, it needs to be exposed. There are just too many things to question (Julia and Adelina's inflated scores - both PCS AND TES -i.e.Adelina's apparent flutz and definite UR on the same element. how can you say Adelina won fair and square when she would have almost lost almost her whole lead on that alone)? Judges were incredibly generous on GOE for Julia too. With the ridiculously stated number of 3s both Russian skaters received (Adelina 33 and Julia 27 next closest was Yuna at 13), the questions concerning the composition of the technical panel - the Russian Technical caller and the Russian Assistant Tech caller (ex-skating coach), the disgraced Ukrainian judge, the wife of the Russian Ice Federation President, Adelina's hug after with that same official... the list goes on an on... every day something new is found....

Russia was going to win a Gold in the Ladies'. if not Julia, then Adelina. This was pre-ordained, not by ability, but by conspiracy.

 

[Spinerette]

Some posters need actually to WATCH programs

I feel as though some people are willing to accept anything the authorities have to say. Authorities being the figure skating judges in this case. Adelina's PCS was inflated by 18 points here. How do you not accept that there was something going on? And the flutz and the under rotated jump and the stumble on the 2loop... And if the technical side was such a problem why did Yuna, Adelina and Carolina receive similar scores in the sp. Yuna and Carolina had more difficult programs. People are forgetting or wanting to forget that Yuna had a triple lutz triple toe combo, a triple flip and a double axel. Carolina had a triple flip and a triple toe combo, a triple loop and a double axel. Adelina had a triple toe combo the easiest triple triple you can do.

 

[imisscohen]

http://www.thewire.com/culture/2014...kovas-allegedly-rigged-gold-medal-win/358425/

this article shows some of the other scorecards' inconsistencies, i.e., Yulia's

Really informative piece. :thumbsup:

 

[Spinerette]

Yup! And Yuna would've been the only lady allowed to have 8 jumping passes in the free!

Let's say Yuna swaps out her 3S-2T (6.50) for her 2A-3T (x) (9.94 given to Adelina), and replaces her solo 2A (x) (4.42) with a 3Lo (6.70). She would have garnered 5.72 more points (that's with Adelina's out-of-this-world GOEs btw). She'll get a score of 149.91, and still loses to Adelina (149.95) with a step-out. How incredulous is that.

Yuna might've won with that, but by the look of things, I'd still think Yuna would've lost by at least 1 point overall.

As CarneAsada pointed out, it looks like Yuna would've needed a 3A to win this.

No what Yuna needed was a quadruple salchow with a triple toe combo and two more quads with a triple axel and a triple toe. Then she would have received a low PCS and some would have said that Yuna had abandoned her artistry for just jumps.

If Yuna jumped like Yuzuru and Kevin and did foot work like Patrick and spun like Stephane. She would have still lost. If she changed her citizenship like Viktor Ahn to Russian then she would have won with a stumble, a flutz and an underrotated jump.

 

[Spinerette]

It's sad to say that the fix is likely. With Adelina's "flutz" and UR on her opening element not even being examined by most of the judges and the convenient absence of the US and South Korean judges in the LP (along with the ridiculous PCS Adelina received), it really begs the question. Until there is more transparency (and better assessing judges for their sloppiness if this was not conspiracy), figure skating will continue to be seen as a joke by the general public.

Additionally, NBC noted sports analyst, Bob Costas brought up a good point when he interviewed frick (Johnny) and frack (Tara). Why should scores in the second half of a program be given a bonus? Yes, they are harder to achieve, but so is a three point basket in basketball on tired legs and a goal in soccer (on even more tired legs, lol). This "Bonus System" was only recently introduced within the last decade and I'm not sure if it really enhances the sport. It certainly rewards jumping beans like Adelina, Kevin Reynolds and Max Aaron.

But Kevin and Max will never win an olympic gold medal. They're not Russian. You need daddy Putin to back you up and bully the ISU.

 

[imisscohen]

But Kevin and Max will never win an olympic gold medal. They're not Russian. You need daddy Putin to back you up and bully the ISU.

I guess that's why it cost over $50 billion to put these games on.

 

[Ilvskating]

Mao's 3-3 was clean as a whistle, but got called ur. Kurt Browning said during the broadcast that "the judges don't need to re-watch that one ! It is CLEAANNNN!" I watch the slowmotion may times and don't see ur. Mao skated so beautifully and had beautiful jumps but got miserable goe and pcs. I think Mao was robbed much more than Yuna. So happy for her, bitter sweetness , making history to skate a 8-triple masterpiece LP.

 

[Spinerette]

This is why Julia and Adelina should not be receiving high PCS scores. I wrote this for people who believe that Adelina and Julia should have been in the top position:

When compared to the top skaters like Yuna,
Carolina and Mao, Adelina has the most two-foot skating. She doesn’t generate speed using her edges
because she does not possess deep edges and the qualities of her edges are poor. She also uses circular skating to set herself
up for jumps. Adelina has poor posture
when landing jumps. Yuna Kim, Carolina
Kostner and Mao Asada have much higher skating skills and sound
transitions. Therefore the PCS being in
the 9’s and 8’s are inaccurate for Adelina Sotnikova no matter how many triples she did and no matter how exuberant she was because of the Russian crowd.

Julia received high GOE's despite having low jumps and jumps that do not travel. Julia doesn’t hold out
her moves. She also has a lack of ice
coverage because she has very shallow footwork.
She does not possess deep edges and the quality of her edges are also
poor in comparison to Carolina Kostner, Mao Asada and Yuna Kim.

If you don't know what good transition skills and skating skills are watch Patrick Chan's sp from this year that program is a perfect example.

 

[Spinerette]

I guess that's why it cost over $50 billion to put these games on.

Maxim Aaronovsky would have been deemed a true artist on ice blowing kisses in the crowd and waving as he does his spiral. He would not need any foot work nor any transitions. He would be the heir to the throne of King Plushenko!

 

[Spinerette]

Mao's 3-3 was clean as a whistle, but got called ur. Kurt Browning said during the broadcast that "the judges don't need to re-watch that one ! It is CLEAANNNN!" I watch the slowmotion may times and don't see ur. Mao skated so beautifully and had beautiful jumps but got miserable goe and pcs. I think Mao was robbed much more than Yuna. So happy for her, bitter sweetness , making history to skate a 8-triple masterpiece LP.

That was insane how they called that an under rotation. But they chose to overlook Adelina's triple toe under rotation.

 

[skateluver]

The judging was so wrong in so many levels. It became clear that the judges were playing a medal for the Russians when Julia was placed ahead of Mao. That meant that Russia would get at least a bronze medal in case Adelina bombed. Well, they got "lucky", Adelina skated the skate of her life (which I thought was still behind Mao's and Yuna's free skates) and that pretty much sealed the deal. They gave her the gold and didn't need Julia in the podium. Now, I like Adelina, but her medal should have been silver or bronze. Don't care for Julia much.