2016-17 State of Russian Ice Dance

[Marta25]

As has been said before by many others, the problem with ice dance in Russia isn't so much the lack of talent but the poor management of their talent. They need new blood that understands COP. They need to also stop viewing Tarasova as their dance czar. They are still holding to the tenets of 6.0 ice dance and not embracing COP. Zhulin is probably the only one who really gets it for better or for worse. When I looked at Stepanova in the gala all I could see is her posture or lack of it. How does an ice dancer get away with moving like that just because they have great extensions? It is so distracting and probably partially responsible for their results.

In terms of just ease and efficiency of movement Ilinykh and Zhiganshin have them all beat, they have very soft, flexible knees. But they simply haven't found the right programs and packaging. Today, Bobrova's simple cross overs and movements just looked so hard in the gala. Zhulin is smart however as he covers that up by letting her play the goof. When I watch Loboda and Drozd I cringe. His skills are so much better than hers and he seems content to simply drag her around with little or no connection between them. How is that allowed for any dance pair that has to compete with the likes of the Parsons and C/P?

Who are the persons that trained I/K to have their basics? Why aren't all their ice dancers exposed to this technology. Because lets face it if the foundation isn't right it will be very difficult to compete with the best of the best. Are they plagued by internal squabbling and inept at working for the good of Russian ID as a whole? Because it surely does look that way.

Elena started as single skater. I think it was Lobacheva and Averbukh who teamed both Ilinykh/Katsalapov and Sinitsina/Zhiganshin up. Although both eventually broke up, you can say they had a good eye in both cases. Averbukh is of course busy with his shows, no idea if Lobacheva is still coaching.

 

[gmyers]

As has been said before by many others, the problem with ice dance in Russia isn't so much the lack of talent but the poor management of their talent. They need new blood that understands COP. They need to also stop viewing Tarasova as their dance czar. They are still holding to the tenets of 6.0 ice dance and not embracing COP. Zhulin is probably the only one who really gets it for better or for worse. When I looked at Stepanova in the gala all I could see is her posture or lack of it. How does an ice dancer get away with moving like that just because they have great extensions? It is so distracting and probably partially responsible for their results.

In terms of just ease and efficiency of movement Ilinykh and Zhiganshin have them all beat, they have very soft, flexible knees. But they simply haven't found the right programs and packaging. Today, Bobrova's simple cross overs and movements just looked so hard in the gala. Zhulin is smart however as he covers that up by letting her play the goof. When I watch Loboda and Drozd I cringe. His skills are so much better than hers and he seems content to simply drag her around with little or no connection between them. How is that allowed for any dance pair that has to compete with the likes of the Parsons and C/P?

Who are the persons that trained I/K to have their basics? Why aren't all their ice dancers exposed to this technology. Because lets face it if the foundation isn't right it will be very difficult to compete with the best of the best. Are they plagued by internal squabbling and inept at working for the good of Russian ID as a whole? Because it surely does look that way.

The internal squabbling is what you talk about. Russian ice dance tradition and COP. They are trying to combine the two when they really need to abandon the former. Why can't the tradition just be seen as being successful? Lol. There were many styles during soviet times. When they l/k almost lost to the Hungarians and then t/d emerged they changed some things.

I disagree a little because Zhulin destroyed B/S Olympic season with his old style belief on programs. Why did he actually change things based on a dream he had? He still makes big mistakes with programs.

It's so true about loboda but they are trying to make her the flower with weak skating skills. That won't work. It's not COP.

 

[Aqua Lady]

Have you seen the Gala Finale? S/B were very cheeky and flirtatious! I feel like those type of characters really suit them! I wanna see them do programs with that sort of theme! Can't stop smiling throughout the whole thing! I think it's also because of the music!

 

[coldblueeyes]

In terms of just ease and efficiency of movement Ilinykh and Zhiganshin have them all beat, they have very soft, flexible knees. But they simply haven't found the right programs and packaging. Today, Bobrova's simple cross overs and movements just looked so hard in the gala. Zhulin is smart however as he covers that up by letting her play the goof. When I watch Loboda and Drozd I cringe. His skills are so much better than hers and he seems content to simply drag her around with little or no connection between them. How is that allowed for any dance pair that has to compete with the likes of the Parsons and C/P?

I'll just say I disagree with this, don't want to show my true colors.

Now, about the russian ID, they are in a rebuilding stage. However, they are taking way too much time compared to the other countries. The evolution is coming slowly, and I'm not gonna claim it's coming at all to some of the schools. I really like how Zhulin worked with Hurtado and Khaliavin, and I think the packaging Zhuk and Svinin give their teams is usually good. They are still flawed, though, and that's why things are the way they are.

 

[NoNameFace]

Have you seen the Gala Finale? S/B were very cheeky and flirtatious! I feel like those type of characters really suit them! I wanna see them do programs with that sort of theme! Can't stop smiling throughout the whole thing! I think it's also because of the music!

yes, both teams were kind of trying out this Latin style subjected for next season's SD and both looked kind of comfortable - Ekaterina and Dimitry with that 'ballroom divas' attitude, a bit exaggerated, Bukins with that over-the-top, colorful aesthetic. It will be crucial for all Russian teams to find a way, some kind of 'niche' to work best of that Latin style as 2011/12 season was kind of disaster for me, considering their SDs with no attitude, black, funeral costumes and zero chemistry.

 

[chameleon]

The idea of Ruslan's basic skating being I/Z's biggest problem is one of the funniest things I've ever heard, considering that their individual basics are still one of their high points. His skating skills are great, maybe not as superlative as Nikita's, but more than an acceptable level for a world champion. If there is a big problem for them outside packaging, its that Elena doesn't follow his lead and they end up almost fighting each other when they skate, which slows them both down and weakens their skating as a team. They're actually better in the sbs than in hold. Ruslan and Elena still seem to have a great off ice relationship, but I think they need a firmer hand in coaching.

 

[elif]

Just watched S/B's new exhibition number. I don't know what to say...Also had a little sneak peek of what's about to come next season!

Yep. She was stiff as hell in salsa section.

I disagree a little because Zhulin destroyed B/S Olympic season with his old style belief on programs. Why did he actually change things based on a dream he had? He still makes big mistakes with programs.

Agree. He never let us the forget that season.

 

[machin]

I disagree a little because Zhulin destroyed B/S Olympic season with his old style belief on programs. Why did he actually change things based on a dream he had? He still makes big mistakes with programs.

Wrong. The fed made them change to four seasons which was indeed bad because put together within five minutes. The first Bird program could have been very very good by the Olympics. That was Zhulin's true vision for BS that season.
Its not Zhulin but the russian officials that destroyed BS, maybe on purpose.

 

[madison]

Wrong. The fed made them change to four seasons which was indeed bad because put together within five minutes. The first Bird program could have been very very good by the Olympics. That was Zhulin's true vision for BS that season.
Its not Zhulin but the russian officials that destroyed BS, maybe on purpose.

Well, I have to agree on that. The first Bird program could have worked for the Olympcs. Although I agree that the music wasn't iconic, the program was much better than what they ended to have: 4 seasons mixed with Birds choreo, which made them to return to the previous program. I know that TAT advocated a lot that the Bird program is bad :shocked:. And even when it comes to Anna Karenina program, her statements were mixed: sometimes the program was just wonderful, sometimes the opposite.

 

[coldblueeyes]

Well, I have to agree on that. The first Bird program could have worked for the Olympcs. Although I agree that the music wasn't iconic, the program was much better than what they ended to have: 4 seasons mixed with Birds choreo, which made them to return to the previous program. I know that TAT advocated a lot that the Bird program is bad :shocked:. And even when it comes to Anna Karenina program, her statements were mixed: sometimes the program was just wonderful, sometimes the opposite.

I think that the first bird program was a bit on the bland side, but still good. And certainly suitable for the Olympics. They would have a lot more respect from the judges if they went with that, but I still don't know what the Fed was thinking. It explains the state of Russian ID, the idea of f**king up a good team so much they had to go back to an old program.

And TAT, well, she does think the sun shines out of S/B's behind, or from S/K's last year. But B/S are not the apple of her eyes.

 

[Barb]

The Bird program was great!! After the dope scandal I thought they could come with a spectacular program this season hwell:

 

[madison]

Loboda is worse than before .
I think that Shpilvaya/Smirnov are already better than Loboda/Drozd.

 

[Ares]

Loboda is worse than before .
I think that Shpilvaya/Smirnov are already better than Loboda/Drozd.

I am not keen on any junior teams from Russia right now. In my view they're quite behind teams like Ponomarenko / Carreira or Parsons siblings. If you look back and compare with Ilinykh / Katsalapov in their age you see that they're just average. From up-and-coming Russian teams I like more Davankova / Shibnev, she's surprisingly
good for first season in Ice Dancing and that team has potential to make stride and shake things up in next few years more than the rest imo. I was impressed by their skating at Russian Nationals.

I only hope that Vasilisa's private relationship with Morozov won't hurt her in the future if he finds new love again which is bound to happen with his history.

 

[Aqua Lady]

Honestly not surprised that Smirnov and Shpilevaya took the Gold at Russian Junior Nats... Among the Russian junior dance teams right now, I see the most potential in them. Loboda/Drozd have been slipping off... Ranking 4th at the FD at Nationals is just

 

[Ice Dance]

They fell. It's not a sign of slipping backward, IMO. (If it was, Loboda & Drozd would have slipped off the podium as they did two years ago at Nationals).

More like Loboda & Drozd are fitting right in. With McNamara & Carpenter, Hubbell & Donahue, the Greens, Hawayek & Baker, & Guignard & Fabbri just in the last few weeks. The dance teams are pushing it this season. And taking the hit for it when they have mistakes.

Which is as it should be. Though yikes! we have having a tough month.

 

[gmyers]

I am not keen on any junior teams from Russia right now. In my view they're quite behind teams like Ponomarenko / Carreira or Parsons siblings. If you look back and compare with Ilinykh / Katsalapov in their age you see that they're just average. From up-and-coming Russian teams I like more Davankova / Shibnev, she's surprisingly
good for first season in Ice Dancing and that team has potential to make stride and shake things up in next few years more than the rest imo. I was impressed by their skating at Russian Nationals.

I only hope that Vasilisa's private relationship with Morozov won't hurt her in the future if he finds new love again which is bound to happen with his history.

And they are married so it's not just a breakup but a divorce which could be really ugly. But of course she must know he will have girlfriends and eventually divorce her.

I would have liked l/d to have a great Nationals and go to jr worlds with momentum like they almost won the jr gpf while s/s was last there but that's not happening.

 

[gmyers]

I was shocked at that interview with ilynykh. For first time had sympathy for Katsalapov! She is crying and sleeping for days and yelling at competitors in warm ups.

 

[sunn1ly]

I was shocked at that interview with ilynykh. For first time had sympathy for Katsalapov! She is crying and sleeping for days and yelling at competitors in warm ups.

Stop talking nonesenses the exact thing she says is "А сразу после проката хотелось просто выдохнуть — все получилось. Потом были слезы. Помню, что все два дня до награждения я вообще не выходила из номера. Полное опустошение. Мама звонила, говорила, что надо отметить, а я даже двигаться не могла. Только спала и плакала"
So after she is done with her FD instead of waching other events and getting even more wasted or giving interviews she spent two days resting from all the work and emotion and this is not during practise or season or preparation of the worlds but while waiting for the awarding. I think this was the best thing she can do instead of spending herself even more. You are really twisting her words.
And here is a link to the article so people can read for themselves instead of your biased talkings.

 

[flakyy]

It's telling that only an olympic season is important enough to have a good start to set yourself apart from competitors, as Ilinykh said.

Not taking into account i/K weren't exactly ready at the test skates 2013 ... Russian couples should look prepared at test skates if they ever want to cacth up again; others manage to do this - what is Russian ID doing during the summer break??

 

[bramweld]

It's telling that only an olympic season is important enough to have a good start to set yourself apart from competitors, as Ilinykh said.

Not taking into account i/K weren't exactly ready at the test skates 2013 ... Russian couples should look prepared at test skates if they ever want to cacth up again; others manage to do this - what is Russian ID doing during the summer break??

Hello, every test skate Ilinykh was ready, it was Katsalapov who always looked like a mess. Ilinykh was livid with him when they showed their programs at the start of the Olympic season (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3iA-6VzGPfo), because just as he did at EC 2017 with Vika he just bailed on the twizzles!! What's a girl to do when you can't have a frank discussion with your partner about his lack of mental toughness?

Katsalapov is talented but there are other more well rounded dancers coming up on the junior Russian team; Smirnov and Drozd not to mention Bukin. Smirnov and Drozd are more complete competitors.