2018-19 Russian Ladies' figure skating

[Shayuki]

I don't see it. She rushes through her movements.

Yeah, the flexibility is a godsend but I have no idea what the supposed spectacular artistry's about. Especially last season she was very dry in my opinion.

Valieva has artistry that is godsend. She can skate to a variety of musical styles, interpret and express accordingly. It is a natural ability that is unmatched by any Eteri skaters including Kostornaia and Shcherbakova.

Especially this part is just, what on earth.... Don't see that at all. Even Zhilina's far more talented in this regard.

 

[alvina9894]

Anna does also, though. :think: All of them in the ex. Well, I guess the last one is flat. She did struggle with landing it. I'm pretty sure these are safe from calls, though.

https://i.loli.net/2018/07/14/5b49966e60858.gif
https://i.loli.net/2018/07/14/5b49966e721c6.gif
https://i.loli.net/2018/07/14/5b49966e7d0ca.gif

We had this discussion before and shall not repeat. If you happen to hallucinate an outside edge from any of these lutzes, please see an ophthalmologist.

Here is a comparison of Kostornaia's 3Lz! at JWC and Shcherbakova's 3Lz of supposedly correct edge. Both are taken immediately after the toepick touches the ice. Both of them are utterly flat. If I must compare, even Kostornaia has more of an outside edge than Shcherbakova (which may be genuine or due to camera angle)
https://i.loli.net/2018/07/14/5b4998b7b3f30.jpg

 

[Crazy27]

4lz Anna Sherbakova
https://www.tulup.ru/forum/topic/37730/message507462.html

 

[Ophelia]

Kostornaia is definitely better than Valieva.

Kostornaia is pretty much better than almost all of the field at this point. Her movement, glide, line, musical awareness, and extension are incredible. IDK where she got it from and how she managed to have it at such a young age, esp since Camp Eteri isn't known for those things.

 

[chopinskate]

Kostornaia is pretty much better than almost all of the field at this point. Her movement, glide, line, musical awareness, and extension are incredible. IDK where she got it from and how she managed to have it at such a young age, esp since Camp Eteri isn't known for those things.

Agreed. I want her to get away from Eteri's camp of choreography so she can breathe a little between her elements and show her extension of movement to its fullest, and she does need more development still, but she has all the potential in the world. If she gets on the right trajectory, she's gold.

 

[alvina9894]

Agreed. I want her to get away from Eteri's camp of choreography so she can breathe a little between her elements and show her extension of movement to its fullest, and she does need more development still, but she has all the potential in the world.

I love Alena and I don't mind Eteri-style busy footwork, but moves like this are just too much

 

[chopinskate]

I love Alena and I don't mind Eteri-style busy footwork, but moves like this are just too much

Yeah, she should instead be made to fill that space with performance ability and projection.

 

[russianfan]

and we're back to "escape from the doomed camp"..

 

[Sam-Skwantch]

Yeah, she should instead be made to fill that space with performance ability and projection.

Two things I’ve never really seen her do. I’m not saying she can’t but last season both programs were pretty similar and lacked these two aspects of skating compared to her peers. It’s the reason I could enjoy her skate during events but very rarely went back and rewatched any of her performances. I fear R&J will be more of the same based solely on the soundtrack alone but I’m keeping my hopes high that she can insert a bit more character than she did this season. It’ll be interesting if she chooses music similar to Gubanova who had an amazing R&J that was both dynamic and dramatic. Certainly Anastasia’s version was full of performance ability and projection. Maybe not everyone connected with her but these qualities were very noticeable.

Alena is great though and I’m always rooting for her. She has a great personality and is a fearless competitor. I just don’t like her or any of Russia's skaters more than the next at this point.. They all have different strengths and weaknesses that are relatively equal even if in different aspects.

 

[chopinskate]

and we're back to "escape from the doomed camp"..

Hey, at least I'm consistent in my dislike for Eteri's camp of choreography. I would love to see Kostornaia work with TAT. Zagitova, too.

Two things I’ve never really seen her do. I’m not saying she can’t but last season both programs were pretty similar and lacked these two aspects skating compared to her peers. It’s the reason I could enjoy her skate during events but very rarely went back and rewatched any of her performances. I fear R&J will be more of the same based solely on the soundtrack alone but I’m keeping my hopes high that she can insert a bit more character than she did this season. It’ll be interesting if she chooses music similar to Gubanova who had an amazing R&J that was both dynamic and dramatic. Certainly Anastasia’s version was full of performance ability and projection. Maybe not everyone connected with her but these qualities were very noticeable.

Alena is great though and I’m always rooting for her. She has a great personality and is a fearless competitor. I just don’t like her or any of Russia's skaters more than the next at this point.. They all have different strengths and weaknesses that are relatively equal just in different aspects.

The thing is, she will be made to do something that might not let her breathe, when I think she is capable of being developed to do something like this in the future (though not this season): https://youtu.be/Kh3iW4I39DI?t=1m9s

It's the extension of movement and the space that is available for her to perform that will let her show off her capabilities, and will force her to work on it. I hope this happens, but we'll see if it does. I don't think her programs were great at all this season, as they didn't really show her capabilities to a good extent, but they were still enough to show her potential talents.

 

[Sam-Skwantch]

I love Alena and I don't mind Eteri-style busy footwork, but moves like this are just too much

Wow...I love that stuff. It’s a very beautiful position and nicely accentuates the program using atheticism. The difficulty and ability to relate such flexibility while still showing a high quality of control of her turns and edges certainly helps distinguish her from the field. So much better than someone going slow and relying on facial expressions or the “I feel this music sooo much” exaggerated theatrics IMO.

 

[chopinskate]

Wow...I love that stuff. It’s a very beautiful position and nicely accentuates the program using atheticism. The difficulty and ability to relate such flexibility while still showing a high quality of control of her turns and edges certainly helps distinguish her from the field. So much better than someone going slow and relying on facial expressions or the “I feel this music sooo much” exaggerated theatrics IMO.

No one's asking her to go slow or rely on theatrics. But if she were made to hold the a single position and extend that movement better, it would make it look good. Instead of focusing on switching positions right after she hit one, and then moving on to the next transition, she would then be able to project outwards and perform...

 

[Sam-Skwantch]

No one's asking her to go slow or rely on theatrics. But if she were made to hold the a single position and extend that movement better, it would make it look good. Instead of focusing on switching positions right after she hit one, and then moving on to the next transition, she would then be able to project outwards and perform...

If she would have held it out much longer she would have run into the corner of the rink and missed her spin which was timed up to match the piano. I don’t see why she should hold it out any longer though. It fits perfectly to the music and shows off her ability at the same time. That’s her strength and who she is. Why should it be any different?

Just saying...to me this section including before and after is a perfect example of what her identity is. Strong use of skating skills in relation to the music.

https://youtu.be/TQtYPWjYitU?t=58s

Look at the whole movement as the music defines it. She lifts her leg as the music begins to pick up (sort of teases the thought of a spin) but then the music drops a bit again as she makes a few turns and then executes a slight outside edge hold into a spin and when the music again picks up she flies into an upright spin with it but soon the music swells back down as she hits lower positions. My point is that the leg lift sort of hints the upright spin with the music phrasing but then pulls back a bit before actually hitting the full position as the piano then hits a more dramatic phrasing. I don’t know...seems rather nice to me.

 

[alvina9894]

I wonder why would anyone find Alena's SP and FS similar. They have very different styles of music and harbour very different emotions. Granted, there are jump entries and spin positions that are recycled (which is not uncommon with Eteri-style choreography), but she modified many of the gestures to fit the music. Let's revise her ending poses from Russian Nationals.

Short Programme
Free Skate

Even in mute, they are obviously not similar. I personally love her presence and character displayed both pieces.

If she would have held it out much longer she would have run into the corner of the rink and missed her spin which was timed up to match the piano. I don’t see why she should hold it out any longer though. It fits perfectly to the music and shows off her ability at the same time. That’s her strength and who she is. Why should it be any different?

Just saying...to me this section including before and after is a perfect example of what her identity is. Strong use of skating skills in relation to the music.

https://youtu.be/TQtYPWjYitU?t=58s

Exactly the reason why I consider this spiral badly choreographed. It is a beautiful spiral, but not in the right place. Alena's gesture (that extension down to fingertips!) saved it, but it could've been so much better.

 

[Sam-Skwantch]

I wonder why would anyone find Alena's SP and FS similar. They have very different styles of music and harbour very different emotions.
[

Haha..I meant her movement and overall skating...not the music. She adapts to music quite well. It’s where her brilliance lies but her performances and movements aren’t varied like someone like Tarakanova or Sasha who IMO offer a greater range of performance.

Gubanova is a favorite of mine but even she tends to fall into this sameness even though her SP and FS were totally different musically. Curse of the lyrical skater maybe?

 

[Sam-Skwantch]

Exactly the reason why I consider this spiral badly choreographed. It is a beautiful spiral, but not in the right place. Alena's gesture (that extension down to fingertips!) saved it, but it could've been so much better.

It fits the music structure so well though. Watch how she relates her spin to the intonation of the piano. Each position matches a tone perfectly...the highs and lows. Now consider the whole transition into this from the part I linked before as being one whole movement.

https://youtu.be/TQtYPWjYitU?t=58s

If you see how all her spin positions both high and low match the music and also consider the spiral as an extension of that theme it makes perfect sense and creates quite a beautiful picture. She begins to hit the high positions as the music builds but returns to a lower position as the music begins to lower a bit. The music certainly swells a bit for the length of the spiral.

 

[chopinskate]

That’s her strength and who she is. Why should it be any different?

No one's asking her to change her identity either. Suggesting something different and something that could be better doesn't mean someone isn't respecting someone else's identity.

And I don't understand how holding out a spiral for a bit longer is not a good display of skating skills. It shows balance and edge control (SS). It also would increase choreographic impact (CO). To address musicality, she could have been made to interpret the music with her arms and upper body (IN) (further showing her ability to balance and control her edges, too (SS)). She could have been made to show her performance skills (PE). She could have done all this right to the point where she ends her dip to the music (which she also doesn't have the time to fully extend through) and then move on to the transitions into the spin (showing her ability to fluidly move into transitions from a spiral (SS and TR)). This was all assuming that spiral should even have been placed there in the first instance.

 

[alvina9894]

It fits the music structure so well though. Watch how she relates her spin to the intonation of the piano. Each position matches a tone perfectly...the highs and lows. Now consider the whole transition into this from the part I linked before.

https://youtu.be/TQtYPWjYitU?t=58s

If you see how all those spin positions of high and low match the misic and consider the spiral as an extension of that theme it makes perfect sense and creates quite a beautiful picture. The music certainly swells a bit for the length of the spiral.

I love the spin and how it correlates with the high and low of the music perfectly. It makes the spiral even more awkward in comparison. I'm not a fan of the windmill arms right after the spiral either.

Another example of choreography out-of-place is this arm gesture that seems to come out of nowhere. It looks perfectly fine on its own but when you look at it in context of the music it really stands out.

 

[TruMan]

"performance ability and projection" - 20 posts per day

 

[atsumiri]

I love Alena and I don't mind Eteri-style busy footwork, but moves like this are just too much

No one's asking her to change her identity either. Suggesting something different and something that could be better

I think its perfect right now. I wish she will keep this moves.
it's new and fresh and couldn't be done any better.
this one is one of my favourite moves of Alena