2018-2019 Season - New rules

[yume]

ISU is basically telling skaters to not jump 3A (mostly ladies) and 4A.
And we are going back to the time when URs were score killers (Even more than a downgrade for the 4A )

 

[charlotte14]

I am probably in the minority, but it seems the lowering of the BV forces the skaters to earn the points on execution. I don’t think that’s a bad thing.

But hey, what do I know?

Knowing how the judges have been throwing out GOE and PCS based on reputation and momentum, I am not sure this will help. It’s not the rules but the human and the human will stay.

 

[Li'Kitsu]

I am probably in the minority, but it seems the lowering of the BV forces the skaters to earn the points on execution. I don’t think that’s a bad thing.

But hey, what do I know?

Eh no, not even true, as it still means the reduced values of the quads compared to each other make no sense, and given GOE are now in percentages of BV it hits GOE too.

If they'd reduce BV generally that would be one thing, but they're not.

Edit: Yata, great minds think alike!

 

[Yatagarasu]

I am probably in the minority, but it seems the lowering of the BV forces the skaters to earn the points on execution. I don’t think that’s a bad thing.

But hey, what do I know?

Except they are selectively lowering the BV.

And the BV influences GOEs now.

 

[narcissa]

“I really want to love this sport but ISU is discouraging me.” - say all the skating fans ever.

Well, I certainly can't say I find it all that interesting when results are almost predetermined depending on your nationality, and skaters CRY at being judged unfairly and are forced to sit there for the world to watch? I mean I know it's called the "Kiss and Cry" but personally I don't really enjoy watching teenagers seeing years of hard work and dreams get torn apart in seconds. Then again I don't enjoy reality TV, which for some reason is insanely popular here, but at least you know that's probably scripted.

The fact that they didn't even bother to double check their new proposal for obvious accounting errors kinda destroys my confidence in figure skating as a sport, TBH. Like, everyone else already thinks it's not a sport, but the fact that they didn't even bother to proofread the proposal they've been brewing for months, when they know it's going to affect hundreds of current and future skaters who've dedicated their entire childhoods, lives, and even long-term health to this sport, just seems downright abusive, IMO.

 

[Mrs. P]

I'd like to see this system in actual execution before I really give my judgment. I do think the system went the complete other way from 2010 as far as risk/reward and I'm willing to see how this plays out.

But I admit, that I haven't looked at this super closely relative to the rest of you, so I'm not putting judgment over whether the concerns are valid either.

 

[Yatagarasu]

I'd like to see this system in actual execution before I really give my judgment. I do think the system went the complete other way from 2010 as far as risk/reward and I'm willing to see how this plays out.

BV, and GOE thanks to way they are written, can only play out in one way. There's really nothing to wait for.

Math is math and we know it, even if ISU weeps about that fact.

 

[Izabela]

I would rather watch the judges take this part seriously:

"FOR + 4 and +5 THE FIRST THREE bullets highlighted in bold must be present"

(Or should I give up hoping?)

 

[charlotte14]

I would rather watch the judges take this part seriously:

"FOR + 4 and +5 THE FIRST THREE bullets highlighted in bold must be present"

(Or should I give up hoping?)

Dreams are free.

 

[yume]

I would rather watch the judges take this part seriously:

"FOR + 4 and +5 THE FIRST THREE bullets highlighted in bold must be present"

(Or should I give up hoping?)

:disapp: that means more candies.

 

[Danny T]

Heh, I think it's more Animal Farm. "We are equally downgrading all quads, but some quads are more equal than others."

Bringing this back, because I just calculated the percentage changes.

3A: 5.8%
4T: 7.7%
4S: 7.6%
4Lo:12%
4F: 10%
4Lz:15.4%
4A: 16.7%

Literally, what is the reasoning for the huge difference in percentage change? Why is the 4F suddenly so valued? Has the 4A threatened to burn down ISU HQ? Did Rittberger rise up from his grave to haunt the Technical Committee? :gaah:

You know what, I would even take the flipflop stand and see how undervaluing quads goes, but only if they all get hit equally. Like this, it just looks suspiciously like they are giving preferential treatment to some skaters and that's not a good look. Also, jumps aside, what are they doing to the steps? The spins? I can totally see how skaters with beautiful steps&spins but not-so-great jumps are awarded with this. Not.

ETA: what the percentage changes do not show is, of course, the absolute value change. Which, incidentally, makes 4A 1 point harder than 4Lz, but 3A still 2.1 points harder than 3Lz.

 

[synteis]

Actually, currently, it didnt look like judges were counting the checkpoints. It was more like "ok, this looks good, so forget steps into jump and whatever, +2 on that", or "ok, this is a top skater, whatever this person does is good, so +2/+3 without watching even".
Pretty sure they will keep doing it whatever the scale is.

Unfortunately, I suspect you are correct.

 

[CreepyBug]

4A's BV being only 1 point above that of 4Lz is just ... ???? Huh?

Edit:

And I just noticed, what the heck is the justification for 4Lo <, 4F < and 4Lz < all having higher BV than 4A <? Like any justification for that would do, because I can't think of any.

For all of 3A, 4T, 4S, 4Lo, 4F, 4Lz, < alone get you 75 percent of the BV, but for 4A it has to be 60 percent? Why is under-rotating 4A as punishable as both under-rotating and having wrong edge for 4F and 4Lz?

 

[DaNiCG]

I feel kinda bad, Im seeing this changes as to how it would affect my faves (they were mostly underscored :/), I was sad most were retiring, but damn, this changes seems to benefit just a group of skaters and prejudice another one, they say they want FS to be more than just jumping yet they decreased the BV of the elements? steps and spins included? and reducing the time to skate, 4L its almost as good as 4A? in what world!?! non skater had land a 4A before, how is that "a little bit harder" than a jump who most skaters are landing this days? even the ladies, and yet, not all of them seem to be brave enough to land a 3A, the amount of skaters who has a solid quad but messed the 3A, not mentioning all the ladies who are going straigh to quads without bothering for the 3A, how is an axel a "little bit harder" than the other jumps?

Who the hell aprove this changes? and who the hell propose them?

I wasnt mad, but after this rant I got angry

 

[vorravorra]

4A's BV being only 1 point above that of 4Lz is just ... ???? Huh?

Edit:

And I just noticed, what the heck is the justification for 4Lo <, 4F < and 4Lz < all having higher BV than 4A <? Like any justification for that would do, because I can't think of any.

For all of 3A, 4T, 4S, 4Lo, 4F, 4Lz, < alone get you 75 percent of the BV, but for 4A it has to be 60 percent? Why is under-rotating 4A as punishable as both under-rotating and having wrong edge for 4F and 4Lz?

They are taking preventive action to discourage skaters from trying 4A. Why, are they expecting a sudden flood of badly executed 4As?

 

[vorravorra]

And just when the top guys are getting comfortable with the multiple quads too Like during the transitional period from Vancouver to Sochi, people were falling all over the place and the Olympics was a nightmare, I still wouldn't agree to downgraded quad value, but I would've understood it. But now, when the top guys are gaining more quad consistency, with the Olympic champion having the highest success rate for quads and the World champion having just done two 6-quad free skates back to back, now they are lowballing quads, and selectively too? Ugh

Well, figure skating isn't limited to the top few and rules should not be introduced specifically to fit them. In theory, anyway.

 

[Yatagarasu]

They are taking preventive action to discourage skaters from trying 4A. Why, are they expecting a sudden flood of badly executed 4As?

More like, they want to discourage even 4A attempts, and then low-ball an executed 4A.

 

[oatmella]

I feel kinda bad, Im seeing this changes as to how it would affect my faves (they were mostly underscored :/), I was sad most were retiring, but damn, this changes seems to benefit just a group of skaters and prejudice another one, they say they want FS to be more than just jumping yet they decreased the BV of the elements? steps and spins included? and reducing the time to skate, 4L its almost as good as 4A? in what world!?! non skater had land a 4A before, how is that "a little bit harder" than a jump who most skaters are landing this days? even the ladies, and yet, not all of them seem to be brave enough to land a 3A, the amount of skaters who has a solid quad but messed the 3A, not mentioning all the ladies who are going straigh to quads without bothering for the 3A, how is an axel a "little bit harder" than the other jumps?

Who the hell aprove this changes? and who the hell propose them?

I wasnt mad, but after this rant I got angry

most skaters are landing 4Lz these days? or am I confused

Not *that* many skaters have successfully done them in competition

But yes - 4A is very difficult and should have BV higher than 12.5

 

[yume]

There will be many unfair results next season, more than usual.

 

[xeyra]

There will be many unfair results next season, more than usual.

There'll be an adjustment period, for sure. For skaters, especially. And for us, watching and trying to understand the results.