2019-20 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating

[Edwin]

The ice has thawed in the far North of Yagry, Arkhangelskaya Oblast, on the White Sea shore promenade Veronika Zhilina has put on her rollers: https://www.instagram.com/p/B_xn4UYJxdt, and these are the proper kind, short chassis, three inline wheels, nylon toe stopper. She can learn to jump in these.

Alina Gorbachyova however seems to struggle in her speed skating inlines, much too large for the indoors: https://www.instagram.com/p/B_sUtRfJyYZ/

Helmet and wrist, elbow and knee protection should be worn, even if you're a capable skater on the smooth frozen water surfaces. Sof'ya Samodelkina already grazed her knee bloody on the concrete of her yard (IG Stories already expired).

Everywhere, inline frames of the right kind are sold out. Boots shouldn't be a problem, all these fast growing skaters have a couple of old pairs lying about.

These kids are so lucky to live in the countryside, far from the contaminated cities with their strict stay at home orders apparently enforced on young children too.
Anna and Aleksandra are out in the open air often too. Maya Khromykh it seemed had to conduct her yesterday's live stream on the covered balcony, with heavy rain hammering on the tin roof and awnings.

I've read that the collective block heating hasn't been switched off yet in many Russian cities' older apartment complexes, so it can get very hot inside when the sun is out. Or cold when the May weather turns wintery again after the pipes have been drained.

On a side note, it seems the young boy skaters are less active on social media. Sof'ya's mate in mischief Lev Vinokur at least tries to keep up with his friend ;-)

 

[bubblecherry]

If anyone is interested why Evgenia went to Japan - Brian Orser is talking about it a little in his Olimpic Channel interview: https://www.olympicchannel.com/en/s...clusive-quadruple-axel-physical-hanyu-yuzuru/
He said Evgenia is in Japan with hopes for some shows that are coming up in July and August. I don't know what he means by that. It is not included in the typed text, but in the video it is around 7th minute mark.

I actually came here to post this.

Brian Orser, April 24th 2020

5:00 https://youtu.be/vI9EHidCnpE
"Evgenia is in Japan. She has been self isolating there with hopes of shows that will be coming up in July or August. Everyone has their fingers crossed for that, which I'm not sure [about the shows happening at this point], but she's ready to go if need be."

12:30 https://youtu.be/_TtTcQmgoRQ
"She needed to give her body a rest. I think she appreciates this break right now..."

I'm sorry, but the idea that Evgenia went to Japan for some deceptive reason is just not backed by reality. She and her own coach have stated she went for future business prospects. You can disagree with the decision to go, you can disagree with actions now, but stop assigning weird motives to her. They are not backed by facts.

 

[JazzUp]

Brian Orser, April 24th 2020

"Evgenia is in Japan. She has been self isolating there..."

Sure, Brian.

 

[egoshina]

If anyone is interested why Evgenia went to Japan - Brian Orser is talking about it a little in his Olimpic Channel interview: https://www.olympicchannel.com/en/s...clusive-quadruple-axel-physical-hanyu-yuzuru/
He said Evgenia is in Japan with hopes for some shows that are coming up in July and August. I don't know what he means by that. It is not included in the typed text, but in the video it is around 7th minute mark.

the plot thickens...

The argument that she couldn't possibly foresee the cancellation of Prism on Ice is now void, the new argument is that she was so smart that she could foresee the closure of borders/air travel until August and went to Japan in advance.

Splendid.

 

[egoshina]

I actually came here to post this.

Brian Orser, April 24th 2020

5:00 https://youtu.be/vI9EHidCnpE
"Evgenia is in Japan. She has been self isolating there with hopes of shows that will be coming up in July or August. Everyone has their fingers crossed for that, which I'm not sure [about the shows happening at this point], but she's ready to go if need be."

12:30 https://youtu.be/_TtTcQmgoRQ
"She needed to give her body a rest. I think she appreciates this break right now..."

I'm sorry, but the idea that Evgenia went to Japan for some deceptive reason is just not backed by reality. She and her own coach have stated she went for future business prospects. You can disagree with the decision to go, you can disagree with actions now, but stop assigning weird motives to her. They are not backed by facts.

You will be surprised to find out how many people considered their business travel non-essential, and postponed them until the crisis is over. But of course theirs just some billion dollar deals, concert tours and you know other non-important stuff. It can wait! Zhenya desperately needs to do some business in Japan! She couldn’t possibly not do it, she had no choice.

 

[Finley]

Both of you are completely missing my initial point, it's not about a presumably famous landscape that happens to be recognized by some, but the detailed research and records of her location and what she might be doing. I've in fact seen assumptions about which hotel she's staying at based on the furniture seen in the background of her posts. Are you seriously suggesting this behaviour is okay because people are currently bored? This is not a fanpage posting news, official photos and fanart, which is something you might do to occupy your time.

The people trying to find her hotel need to sit down and take a good long look at themselves and their lives. That is unacceptable on every level.

As for the photographs that she posted on her own social media that have been used to ascertain her location; these are my thoughts -

I posted my opinion on what was happening and explained my reasoning. You asked for facts to back up my statements. Specifically with regards to her location(s) among other things. I did my best. Not good enough. Novicefan asked for facts. I tried again. Nope, not having it. Also my discussion of this topic, and the way in which I discussed it, was deemed disrespectful, distasteful, exploitive and disgusting. Nice.

el henry asks for statements specifically about Evgenia. Four sources provided by various posters. Not those sources!

So now someone posts photographs from Evgenia's IG that back up the answers provided with regard to her location(s). This in response to multiple requests to provide proof. And that is being equated with stalkers trying to find her hotel?

 

[Edwin]

How many show opportunities are there actually in Japan, assuming season as normal? How many fixed shows, traveling troupes, which rinks and where (that should've been public knowledge well in advance)? Willing and able to pay the top wages an athlete of Medvyedeva's stature is worth and should demand? The show a high profile, highly artistic top quality production Yevgeniya should demand to protect her image? Beggars can't be choosers being the other scenario, which unfortunately is the fate of lesser stars.

Given the pandemic on the rise, the Sailor Moon show already about the cancelled (insiders must have known for sure, they didn't bother to travel), Olympics being postponed? Isn't it light headed wishful thinking on the part of BOrser the pandemic would be under control and live returning to full normalcy so short after the SM dates in Yokohama?

It still feels like bad advice to me, not thought through at all by any professional agency worth its commission. Still makes no sense, but if BOrser gave his blessing, FFKKR posed no objections, it's entirely on Medvyedeva now ...

 

[Finley]

Evgenia left Toronto on April the 1st. The borders were still open. The shows scheduled for May were still to take place. On April the 1st nobody, literally nobody, even here, could say for sure that the show she was going to would be cancelled. So please don't play a know-it-all on May the 4th.

Anyway, stupid me, I was sure that people here were concerned about her health, or, recently, about the health of these older Japanese in the Aomari Prefecture. How naive I was. Evgenia can have an access to an ice rink - that's a real problem . Guys, you still amaze me, honestly.

No more so than you amaze me.

I always appreciate it when I'm given the benefit of the doubt, so I will apply that in this situation. Zhenya said she was traveling for Prism on Ice and that she had 'no choice' but to do so. Maybe she was hoping against hope it wouldn't be cancelled. The Olympics had just been postponed, but hope dies last, so whatever. If she is going for an ice show in June she is going to need to keep her skating up to par. So she goes to the town with the still open ice rink where she had previously stayed and trained before the Olympics. Makes sense. The 'no choice' part sounds questionable, but again, whatever.

Show cancelled. Ice rink closes. Zhenya chooses not to take one of the Aeroflot flights evacuating Russian citizens. I can't blame her for that. Maybe Japan feels like a second home. Maybe she doesn't want to risk another plane flight with all the recycled air.

Japanese Government officials request people not to travel between prefectures out of concern for their elderly population and lack of existing available medical resources. Zhenya travels to one of the most vulnerable areas. After the governor of said province literally implored people not to do so. Are you seeing a problem yet?

Ok, bad decision made. It is what it is. It's done. This is where we get to the part where a bad decision trips and falls over another bad decision. Sometimes social media is not our friend. This is one of those times. I don't think she was being malicious but she most certainly behaved as if she was oblivious to what was going on around her. And the potential effect of her behavior on others. And the selfish motives of traveling during a pandemic for the purpose of seeking a place to skate when her show had been cancelled.

Now people start to criticize her on her IG and Twitter. Now is the time for a decision to be made. How to respond - Silence? Apology? Explanation? Clarification? Some combination of the last three? Anything would be better than the route she chose, which has been documented in screenshots of her comments and IG stories.

Sources (every single one of whom have never been less than 100% favorable and positive to Evgenia throughout her career) are not all on the same page, but other than Zakarian, more or less say the same thing. I'm excluding Piseev here because I honestly think he has no idea what is going on and just likes Zakarian's version best. Which is his prerogative.

It's not about the park, or the ice rinks, it's about her behavior. It's about her response to reasonable concerned criticism. Not hatred and bullying but reasonable concerned criticism from Japanese citizens. Can I say it again - it's not about the park or the ice.

 

[bubblecherry]

the plot thickens...

The argument that she couldn't possibly foresee the cancellation of Prism on Ice is now void, the new argument is that she was so smart that she could foresee the closure of borders/air travel until August and went to Japan in advance.

Splendid.

Um... what? We've known since she traveled to Japan that she was going in hopes of summer shows (or possibly other business). That's been common knowledge since she left for Japan. She literally stated that she was going early in case of complications later. Unless you were one of the people to look past what she, and everyone around her, said and started making conspiracies. This entirely lines up with everything that's been made public. Whether you agree that it was the right decision or not is another discussion.

 

[eterislouisvuitton]

I actually came here to post this.

Brian Orser, April 24th 2020

5:00 https://youtu.be/vI9EHidCnpE
"Evgenia is in Japan. She has been self isolating there with hopes of shows that will be coming up in July or August. Everyone has their fingers crossed for that, which I'm not sure [about the shows happening at this point], but she's ready to go if need be."

12:30 https://youtu.be/_TtTcQmgoRQ
"She needed to give her body a rest. I think she appreciates this break right now..."

I'm sorry, but the idea that Evgenia went to Japan for some deceptive reason is just not backed by reality. She and her own coach have stated she went for future business prospects. You can disagree with the decision to go, you can disagree with actions now, but stop assigning weird motives to her. They are not backed by facts.

The reality was that if they Olympics weren't able to be held in Japan at all this summer, they should've known that shows weren't happening either. And also referring to top skater, I mean like top 3 in the world or unbeatable, like the 3A are for now. Alina is still an elite skater and hinted at doing quads, so I will be excited, quad or not!

 

[bubblecherry]

No more so than you amaze me.

I always appreciate it when I'm given the benefit of the doubt, so I will apply that in this situation. Zhenya said she was traveling for Prism on Ice and that she had 'no choice' but to do so. Maybe she was hoping against hope it wouldn't be cancelled. The Olympics had just been postponed, but hope dies last, so whatever. If she is going for an ice show in June she is going to need to keep her skating up to par. So she goes to the town with the still open ice rink where she had previously stayed and trained before the Olympics. Makes sense. The 'no choice' part sounds questionable, but again, whatever.

Show cancelled. Ice rink closes. Zhenya chooses not to take one of the Aeroflot flights evacuating Russian citizens. I can't blame her for that. Maybe Japan feels like a second home. Maybe she doesn't want to risk another plane flight with all the recycled air.

Japanese Government officials request people not to travel between prefectures out of concern for their elderly population and lack of existing available medical resources. Zhenya travels to one of the most vulnerable areas. After the governor of said province literally implored people not to do so. Are you seeing a problem yet?

Ok, bad decision made. It is what it is. It's done. This is where we get to the part where a bad decision trips and falls over another bad decision. Sometimes social media is not our friend. This is one of those times. I don't think she was being malicious but she most certainly behaved as if she was oblivious to what was going on around her. And the potential effect of her behavior on others. And the selfish motives of traveling for the purpose of seeking a place to skate when her show had been cancelled.

Now people start to criticize her on her IG and Twitter. Now is the time for a decision to be made - Silence? Apology? Explanation? Clarification? Some combination of the last three? Anything would be better than the route she chose, which has been documented in screenshots of her comments and IG stories.

Sources (every single one of whom have never been less than 100% favorable and positive to Evgenia throughout her career) are not all on the same page, but other than Zakarian, more or less say the same thing. I'm excluding Piseev here because I honestly think he has no idea what is going on and just likes Zakarian's version best. Which is his prerogative.

It's not about the park, or the ice rinks, it's about her behavior. It's about her response to reasonable concerned criticism. Not hatred and bullying but reasonable concerned criticism from Japanese citizens. Can I say it again - it's not about the park or the ice.

Finley, I haven't agreed with everything you've said regarding this issue, but I appreciate that you've tried to be fair and you've been open to new information. Some people aren't doing so and it drums up emotions on both sides and makes these discussions toxic. I wish this thread wasn't so toxic, and I genuinely appreciate you trying to engage here in good faith.

Generally, I think this has been discussed to death. People are choosing the believe the information they'd like to believe, and rejecting information they'd not like to believe, as usual. I'm not even sure why I bothered to post Brian's words, knowing it'd be interpreted and misconstrued in the worst possible way by some people here. In my opinion, Mistakes were made and must be dealt with now. Hopefully, Zhenya (and everyone around her) will remain safe despite her travels, and hopefully she will come to the realization that she needs to stop posting (I suspect she will at some point) even if she believes she has good intentions. I wish you and the people closest to you safety and sanity during these times, Finley.

 

[Finley]

Um... what? We've known since she traveled to Japan that she was going in hopes of summer shows (or possibly other business). That's been common knowledge since she left for Japan. She literally stated that she was going early in case of complications later. Unless you were one of the people to look past what she, and everyone around her, said and started making conspiracies. This entirely lines up with everything that's been made public. Whether you agree that it was the right decision or not is another discussion.

I think it is more along the lines of her decision to word it as if she was being given 'no choice' in the matter. Then adding to that 'everyone else stay home' and implying she wasn't allowed that privilege. And then while in Japan doing what everyone has been asked not to do which is traveling between prefectures. Then posting about if on social media. Then choosing to respond to legitimate criticism of her actions in the manner in which she did.

As for it being the right decision, that depends on your point of view. From Zhenya's - 100% right decision to try to find ice to keep training and stay in shape to keep her dream alive. From the point of view of Japanese government officials and some segment of the Japanese population - not so much.

 

[NoviceFan]

I think people are forgetting there is a lot of things that transpires around a show aside from the show itself. How could she have possibly gone there way ahead of the June show, without the other cast having gone there? She is the face of the show and there are promotions that need to be made. In February, none of the other cast members were in Japan when she did the initial promo for her show. This is not Stars on Ice or Fantasy on Ice that do an annual show. This is an ice show being produced by an established brand in Japan to commemorate an important anniversary - there are significant commercial activities around it. Canada was closing its borders indefinitely - until now it is closed. The situation was different in Japan - they declared a state of emergency on April 7 (she flew April 1). I will not further engage in any discussions about what happened after - my point is only to make it clear that it is NOT inexplicable that she went to Japan when she did.

 

[Finley]

Finley, I haven't agreed with everything you've said regarding this issue, but I appreciate that you've tried to be fair and you've been open to new information. Some people aren't doing so and it drums up emotions on both sides and makes these discussions toxic. I wish this thread wasn't so toxic, and I genuinely appreciate you trying to engage here in good faith.

Generally, I think this has been discussed to death. People are choosing the believe the information they'd like to believe, and rejecting information they'd not like to believe, as usual. I'm not even sure why I bothered to post Brian's words, knowing it'd be interpreted and misconstrued in the worst possible way by some people here. In my opinion, Mistakes were made and must be dealt with now. Hopefully, Zhenya (and everyone around her) will remain safe despite her travels, and hopefully she will come to the realization that she needs to stop posting (I suspect she will at some point) even if she believes she has good intentions. I wish you and the people closest to you safety and sanity during these times, Finley.

Thank you for this. I truly appreciate your words. I have tried to make this about behavior and decisions not about the person. We are not our mistakes. Not even our worst mistakes define us. I've made so many bad decisions in my 20's it's ridiculous. I learned and moved on from all of them. And unfortunately, they were not my last mistakes! But again, learn, grow, forgive yourself, move on.

The reason this is getting so magnified is because it is being looked at through the scope of the pandemic. The reason it is hitting me so hard emotionally has very little to do with Zhenya and everything to do with the actions of people in my own country who apparently will not be satisfied until we are all in the same position as NYC Zhenya's actions (in my perception) just reflected (in a small way) what I am seeing from the population in my own country.

I still believe this issue will blow over. I still think Silence is the best route forward. Remember Alina's driving video? I thought that would never end. Then someone filed a police report to drag it out more. I was waiting for some word (explanation, apology, clarification, statement, anything!) from somebody - Alina, her parents, a member of her extended family or family friend who lived in Izvekhs. Not one single word from anyone. To this day. When the police announced they were dropping it, I thought: here we go again. But by that time I think everyone had exhausted themselves. Much like we are doing here. The horse wasn't just dead it was decomposing. No one wanted to have that conversation again.

Zhenya has tons of love and support in Russia, North America and Japan. Ultimately, she will be fine.

We all love the skaters we love and I can empathize with wanting to defend and protect them.

Also, all of my best wishes to you and yours.

 

[okokok1777]

Um... what? We've known since she traveled to Japan that she was going in hopes of summer shows (or possibly other business). That's been common knowledge since she left for Japan. She literally stated that she was going early in case of complications later. Unless you were one of the people to look past what she, and everyone around her, said and started making conspiracies. This entirely lines up with everything that's been made public. Whether you agree that it was the right decision or not is another discussion.

I said this a bit earlier, but the logic behind this decision has really confused me. IIRC all of the Japanese ice shows that Zhenya has performed in (or was slated to perform in) have an international cast (like Stars on Ice, Prism on Ice and Dreams on Ice). If the entry ban is still in place when those shows are supposed to take place, wouldn't the shows have to be cancelled anyways because a substantial part of the cast would be unable to perform? If the entry ban ends beforehand, then she wouldn't have any problems flying from Canada (or Russia) to attend. I just really don't understand the logic behind spending most of the summer in Japan solely for the chance to attend ice shows when the problem you're concerned about would preclude the ice show from occurring.

I would be more than happy to hear anyone else's thoughts on this

 

[egoshina]

Um... what? We've known since she traveled to Japan that she was going in hopes of summer shows (or possibly other business). That's been common knowledge since she left for Japan. She literally stated that she was going early in case of complications later. Unless you were one of the people to look past what she, and everyone around her, said and started making conspiracies. This entirely lines up with everything that's been made public. Whether you agree that it was the right decision or not is another discussion.

I am not sure why I engage in this discussion but it seems to entertain me.
Zhenya stated (and some but not all around her) that the reason for travel was Prism on Ice.
Prism on Ice was scheduled for 5-7 June. If one hopes that the show would go ahead as planned one would need to expect that by June the coronavirus crisis will be nearly over, with some international travel available (or someone from inside Japan replace some major characters, choreographers, and half of the cast).

Now we have new information - the reason to travel in April is to do shows in August. So one would have to forecast that the coronavirus situation is so dire, that between April and August there will be no opportunity to get to Japan.

 

[Finley]

I think people are forgetting there is a lot of things that transpires around a show aside from the show itself. How could she have possibly gone there way ahead of the June show, without the other cast having gone there? She is the face of the show and there are promotions that need to be made. In February, none of the other cast members were in Japan when she did the initial promo for her show. This is not Stars on Ice or Fantasy on Ice that do an annual show. This is an ice show being produced by an established brand in Japan to commemorate an important anniversary - there are significant commercial activities around it. Canada was closing its borders indefinitely - until now it is closed. The situation was different in Japan - they declared a state of emergency on April 7 (she flew April 1). I will not further engage in any discussions about what happened after - my point is only to make it clear that it is NOT inexplicable that she went to Japan when she did.

No one is saying it is inexplicable. It is easily explicable. There can even be multiple motivations for her decision to travel. More than one thing can be true simultaneously. I'm sure she hoped that the show would go on. Even if she thought there was only a slim chance. But just because her decision makes perfect sense to her, her team, her fans etc., does not mean everyone else has to agree that this was a good decision. For Evgenia? yes, a great decision. A decision in her own best interest. You have to admire her tenacity.

For the people who could potentially be affected by the consequences of her decision? Not really.

 

[NoviceFan]

I said this a bit earlier, but the logic behind this decision has really confused me. IIRC all of the Japanese ice shows that Zhenya has performed in (or was slated to perform in) have an international cast (like Stars on Ice, Prism on Ice and Dreams on Ice). If the entry ban is still in place when those shows are supposed to take place, wouldn't the shows have to be cancelled anyways because a substantial part of the cast would be unable to perform? If the entry ban ends beforehand, then she wouldn't have any problems flying from Canada (or Russia) to attend. I just really don't understand the logic behind spending most of the summer in Japan solely for the chance to attend ice shows when the problem you're concerned about would preclude the ice show from occurring.

I would be more than happy to hear anyone else's thoughts on this

This is only my guess, of course - I guess we all are guessing here anyway. But Canada was closing its borders - Kurakova confirmed that they got that notice. Japan was a little more different. The olympics were cancelled of course, but you cannot possibly compare the scale of an event like the olympics with a local ice show. Tokyo was expecting 10 million visitors to attend the summer olympics. Even South Korea, Taiwan, New Zealand or Singapore (countries that at that time, or subsequently has the virus under control) would have cancelled the olympics if it were to be held in their country. The problem is not just was happening on the ground, but also the feasibility of having 10 million people travelling to Tokyo. Prism on Ice is a local event, in comparison. Japan was not on lock down (actually until now it is not because such an order is not legally enforceable in Japan, supposedly) nor was it in a state of emergency at time she flew there.

 

[okokok1777]

This is only my guess, of course - I guess we all are guessing here anyway. But Canada was closing its borders - Kurakova confirmed that they got that notice. Japan was a little more different. The olympics were cancelled of course, but you cannot compare the scale of an event like the olympics with a local ice show. Tokyo was expecting 10 million visitors to attend the summer olympics. Even South Korea, Taiwan, New Zealand or Singapore (countries that at that time, or subsequently has the virus under control) would have cancelled the olympics if it were to be held in their country. Prism on Ice is a local event, in comparison. Japan was not on lock down (actually until now it is not because such an order is not legally enforceable in Japan, supposedly) nor was it in a state of emergency at time she flew there.

Yes - but they had announced an entry ban for an indefinite period of time from dozens of countries before she traveled. Based on her IG post, she left Canada because she was afraid that the entry ban would preclude her from attending Prism on Ice. However, several key members of the cast stayed in Canada and the US. How would the show go on without most of the main cast members?

Thank you for responding BTW!

 

[NoviceFan]

Yes - but they had announced an entry ban for an indefinite period of time from dozens of countries before she traveled. Based on her IG post, she left Canada because she was afraid that the entry ban would preclude her from attending Prism on Ice. However, several key members of the cast stayed in Canada and the US. How would the show go on without most of the main cast members?

Thank you for responding BTW!

Sure. Again, this is only my guess. Her obligations are not only skating in the show. In February, none of the other cast went to Japan, but she did, to do some promos - and at that time, most of the other cast members were free to travel as only a couple were preparing for Worlds. Of course once the situation changed in Japan, going there early was moot. But it does not negate the reason for it. Only my guess.