2019-20 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating | Page 379 | Golden Skate

2019-20 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating

It is one major factor. Not the only factor.
Crossovers are not equal, nor they are the only merritt of good skating skills. ISU criterias for SS are:
- Use of deep edges, steps and turns
- Balance, rhythmic knee action and precision of foot placement
- Flow and glide
- Varies use of power, speed and acceleration
- Use of multi directional skating
- Use of one foot skating

When they are judging SS judges are looking how one skater did in every of those criterias.)
 
Honestly, I have seen your interactions with other posters and how you pretend to be looking for information but then disregard and belittle their attempts to explain things and the information they provide. I am not going to waste my time. Watch Alina and Aliona do crossovers.. in any program... the different is clear. Everyone who has answered your query says that yes posture during crossovers shows a lot about a persons SS. You are choosing to pretend that isn’t true. I am not here to belittle Alina. She looks happy this year and so well-trained as Katymay mentioned but she doesn’t have the same level of skating skills as Alena, Rika or the other skaters I mentioned. All skaters have their good points and things they need to work on. If you are truly interested in finding out more, you certainly can make comparison through any program available on YouTube. The difference is clear.

Do not be so prejudiced against the interlocutor :) I really want to understand your point of view. Perhaps a poor experience in ice skating fails me. Like everyone else in my childhood, I skate a little on these makeshift skating rinks near schools (you know that make in the frost, pouring water from a hose any convenient area) - that's all my experience :) But I do remember that the easiest thing to learn is acceleration. It is much more difficult to do all sorts of tricky things- sharp turns, skate on one leg and all that stuff. So, in my simplicity, I always thought that SS first of all was connected with this stuff :) To put it simply, for me the skill of skating is concentrated in this 10 seconds start from this moment. At least I didn’t see what those who judges give a score of 6-7 for SS could do so (I mean all these 10 seconds).
 
But I do remember that the easiest thing to learn is acceleration.

It is? But then why are there so few figure skaters who excel at it?

Irina Slutskaya was outstanding (and I say this as Michelle Kwan's biggest fan. ;) ). Two powerful strokes and Irina was all the away around the end and headed back uprink. :yes:
 
Those are transitions ( Alina’s transitions into her 2A are beautiful and unlike last year she is actually doing them well— last year she was cheating those turns) which is a different category from SS.

Speed is easy to generate in an ugly way ( bent over) it is hard to generate correctly with just your knees.

Alina does have good one foot skating and a lot of steps and turns. So, she fulfills some bullets.
But, she does not have particular good :
Balance, rhythmic knee action and precision of foot placement
- Flow and glide
- Varies use of power, speed and acceleration.

I did notice a huge improvement in her flow this year. Anyway, again I am happy Alina is happy. This conversation has gone on long enough. Have a good day!
 
Crossovers are not equal, nor they are the only merritt of good skating skills. ISU criterias for SS are:
- Use of deep edges, steps and turns
- Balance, rhythmic knee action and precision of foot placement
- Flow and glide
- Varies use of power, speed and acceleration
- Use of multi directional skating
- Use of one foot skating

When they are judging SS judges are looking how one skater did in every of those criterias.)

Yeah, actually there is nothing specific about use of crossovers in ISU recommendations except in a negative way, as a recommendation for the skaters to use cross overs less as possible. But people can think whatever they want to. And then act surprised when judges scores come out :biggrin:
 
Hey guys, I'm bored and I can't sleep because Anna's dress snatched my weave. So I did a calculation of everyone's BV (as presented today, and as predicted for how it's supposed to be, for those who weren't clean). Note: No accounting for UR.

[...]

Ranking of Base Value (Delivered):

(1) Alexandra Trusova 67.48
(2) Anna Shcherbakova 57.01
(3) Elizaveta Tuktamysheva 48.11
(4) Alina Zagitova 47.46
(5) Alena Kostornaia 46.75
(6) Stanislava Konstantinova 42.01
(7) Evgenia Medvedeva 38.45
(8) Sofia Samodurova 36.42


Ranking of Base Value (Predicted):
(1) Alexandra Trusova 67.48
(2) Anna Shcherbakova 57.01
(3) Elizaveta Tuktamysheva 51.67
(4) Alina Zagitova 47.46
(5) Alena Kostornaia 46.75
(6) Evgenia Medvedeva 46.37
(7) Stanislava Konstantinova 46.19
(8) Sofia Samodurova 45.07

[...]

I'm kinda terrified what scores Trusova will earn once she lands those quads and thus her PCS begins to skyrocket. I'm not a fan of Dave of TSL, but I agree with him on this one. A 10-15 points cushion on BV alone in a field where multiple girls can lay down two 3As or quads in the FS is really something different. I really appreciate athleticism in this sport more than anything but this quad war waged by pre-teen girls seems wrong.
 
I'm kinda terrified what scores Trusova will earn once she lands those quads and thus her PCS begins to skyrocket. I'm not a fan of Dave of TSL, but I agree with him on this one. A 10-15 points cushion on BV alone in a field where multiple girls can lay down two 3As or quads in the FS is really something different. I really appreciate athleticism in this sport more than anything but this quad war waged by pre-teen girls seems wrong.


Hey, this was you refer about , has not even just began :scratch2: Once competition starts , we will see a lot of things going on , especially about consistency of these quads. But even if Sasha will be clear in every event and i wish her so , that is the way sport is going forward. Same goes with Nathan Chen. You cannot accuse him for putting 6 quads in one programm. If you want to be on the top, you follow the one in the top. Thats what Yuzuru did and now wants to put 4A in his programms ( as he has said in interviews last year ). If quads and 3A is the future of the ladies figure skating, thats not war, but simple development of Figure Skating. Someone had to push the boundaries and we can only give congratulations to this 13 year old girl back then to have the guts to actually land a quad in an actual competition and now everybody is working on a quad while last decade was just an exception.

Thats my opinion of course ;)
 
I'm kinda terrified what scores Trusova will earn once she lands those quads and thus her PCS begins to skyrocket. I'm not a fan of Dave of TSL, but I agree with him on this one. 15+ points cushion on BV alone in a field where multiple girls can lay down two 3As or quads in the FS is really something different. I really appreciate athleticism in this sport more thn anything but this quad war waged by pre-teen girls seems wrong.

It will be such an interesting season. I am not a huge fan of quads in general (unless they really add to the program). I am not the hugest fan of athleticism in the sport. But, I am a huge fan of Sasha's competitive mindset and willingness to go for a very risky layout. If the boys can do it, so can she. In all fairness, she will only have about a 4 point BV cushion over Rika( Rika should have a 3 point lead in BV in the short, and Sasha will have a 7 point lead in BV in the free) if Rika goes for the 4S in the free. And, Trusova (and Rika) will have to actually execute their planned content. Planned content does not win, executed content does. I expect to see a lot of falls this year because of all the girls going for harder content. I hope no-one gets hurt and everyone succeeds!
 
I don't really like this sort of belittling of Sasha. I don't like it when people talk about her winning as if she didn't deserve it or it's just not right.
 
I don't really like this sort of belittling of Sasha. I don't like it when people talk about her winning as if she didn't deserve it or it's just not right.

her content scares some people because she's the only one doing it and pushing the technical boundaries of women. i think some believe quads should only be done by men.
 
Omg guys go check out the insta stories of Maksim Pavlovich they're incredibly funny. :laugh2:
 
It's ok not to enjoy the athleticism and jumps as much, but this is figure skating the sport. In my view the technical side must be the most important here. There are figure skating shows and exhibitions to enjoy the more beautiful side of figure skating.
 
I don't really like this sort of belittling of Sasha. I don't like it when people talk about her winning as if she didn't deserve it or it's just not right.

her content scares some people because she's the only one doing it and pushing the technical boundaries of women. i think some believe quads should only be done by men.

I'm not sure whether those were aimed at me but I don't think either of those. What for me does not feel right are the age, physical health, training environment and the possible long-term effects (both mentally and physically, regardless the fact that the skater in particular is male or female, and the same applies for e. g. Gogolev). I didn't say a word about people being deserving achievements or about comparisons to male skaters.
 
I'm not sure whether those were aimed at me but I don't think either of those. What for me does not feel right are the age, physical health, training environment and the possible long-term effects (both mentally and physically, regardless the fact that the skater in particular is male or female, and the same applies for e. g. Gogolev). I didn't say a word about people being deserving achievements or about comparisons to male skaters.

It wasn't just at you. I think it's ok to have a discussion about quads, but tbh at this point it would be an ill-informed one. We simply don't have enough data to talk about consequences and what not. Also, multiple experts have said that you can regain something you lost, but you can't really regain/get something you never had (omg I'm quoting TAT). Obviously there's some wear and tear on the bodies, but how much we can't judge either at this point.
 
IAlso, multiple experts have said that you can regain something you lost, but you can't really get something you never had (omg I'm quoting TAT).

TAT speaking with the voice of Professor Umbridge: "Progress for the sake of progress should be discouraged"? Even Tat'yana Anatolevna will have to face this new reality, reluctantly probably, since 'that woman's Zagitova' proved she is still a force to be reckoned with :-)

NOT, #TeamTutberidzeForProgress is all about progress, elevating the sport to a new level, breaking with certain conventions that have ruled figure skating. Bring on athleticism, but to keep it beautiful and artistic, no flopping, plodding, labouring, it should look effortless.
The application of the Tutberidze Effect to children, novices and juniors is already starting to bear fruit. And other Moscow rinks are in the race to catch up.

If you have two simultaneous events going on, one with Khrustalniy skaters, the other without, where do you think the audience will stand in line to get admitted?

We still have to wait and see how the quads will spread, only a very select few skaters are capable of them, and this isn't going to change anytime soon for the non-power federations. Will Kostornaya, Khromykh or Usachyova ever compete quads? Even Kanysheva's is uncertain at this point. Only Akat'yeva's has been proven.

Will another Japanese women besides Kihira compete quads, or a Korean? Who besides Alysa Liu in the US?

Then there is the Triksel, a even more difficult skill to learn and compete successfully. I for one think those skills will remain rare and very exclusive to certain programs, perhaps certain skaters even and fade out when those skaters retire. Only their memories remain for us to cherish, only their records will stand the test of time in the books.
 
It's ok not to enjoy the athleticism and jumps as much, but this is figure skating the sport. In my view the technical side must be the most important here. There are figure skating shows and exhibitions to enjoy the more beautiful side of figure skating.

I don’t understand comments like this. If competitive figure skating were intended to be purely athletic, there would be no need for music, costumes, or programs - we could just have a series of skills in rotation - everybody do their quad, everybody do their sit spin, everybody do their 3A, judges weigh difficulty and execution for each move, and voila - add up the points and there’s your winner. Personally, I can’t imagine anything more boring.

I also think you underestimate the athleticism required to perform in shows and exhibitions.
 
Back
Top