2019-20 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating

[Mishaminion]

Mishin was supposed to be indignant last year before the World Cup.

Now ISU realized that in Russia the Federation was laughing at him.

Too many Russians upstairs - Liza and Sonya must move aside.

They simply cannot keep up, Liza's 3As are not enough. She has the same number of 3As as Alyona and yet the difference in many other areas, spins, steps, skating skills and overall is obvious.

I wish Liza moved coaches, I do not think Mishin is doing her justice now. The whole game has changed and he is too stuck in his ways.

Sonya, I love her but she has grown and filled out and she's unable to catch the others when she's fighting to get the jumps around.

 

[fabienne1996]

I agree with you .. if RF would substitute one of the 3A for Aliona or Zhenya in euros or World ... will be Anna ... she doesn't have the number of quads of sasha and her quad won't beat Kostornaia 3A in both program ...

Well... maybe RF can put 3 different skaters on euros and the other 3 in worlds ... everyone happy ...

That's what I said too, send 3 skaters to euros and than the a others to worlds, that would be amazing but probably will not be happening

 

[BabySloth]

Obviously the weakest skaters are those two nobodies from that lumbering old dinosaur Mishin's camp. Don't know why they'll bother showing up.

Liza is still a very good skater, two bronze medals in a GP field like this, and at the age of 22 is certainly a good achivement.
Sofia is struggling a bit, but she still managed to get decent results, a Challenger title, and made the Top 6 at both of her GP assignments. Calling them 'nobodies' is just rude.

 

[nussnacker]

Liza is still a very good skater, two bronze medals in a GP field like this, and at the age of 22 is certainly a good achivement.
Sofia is struggling a bit, but she still managed to get decent results, a Challenger title, and made the Top 6 at both of her GP assignments. Calling them 'nobodies' is just rude.

anonymoose_au says that out of frustration for Liza and Sofia, she/he wasn't trying to be rude.

 

[Thrashergurl]

Well, weakest of the Eteri girls and also weaker than Medvedeva. If both Zagitova and Medvedeva skate clean then I would put Anna behind both. Even with her quad. She is still so juniorish to me with so much to work on. I’m sure her team analyzed the scoring and heard the messages judges sent. They’re working hard to improve all their girls. I expect to see they’ve helped Anna as well.

 

[Mishaminion]

Liza is still a very good skater, two bronze medals in a GP field like this, and at the age of 22 is certainly a good achivement.
Sofia is struggling a bit, but she still managed to get decent results, a Challenger title, and made the Top 6 at both of her GP assignments. Calling them 'nobodies' is just rude.

It is a bit. Two GP bronzes is nothing to sniff at given the massive competition she faces just within her own country.
Her results are not at all bad, when you think about it.

Sofia I hope will get through this season and come out of it stronger, but there is very little chance she can learn new jumps or improve much while she is having issues making the rotation on her existing ones. Her results only look "poor" in comparison to the other Russian successes.

I think it is almost safe to say Stasya Konstantinova is unlikely to get info the mix.
She has a history of doing well at home but this season has been a disaster I don't see her being able to recover from that quickly. Her Rostelecom Cup performances were painful to watch, she knew it was probably her last chance to pick her season back up.

 

[anonymoose_au]

Liza is still a very good skater, two bronze medals in a GP field like this, and at the age of 22 is certainly a good achivement.
Sofia is struggling a bit, but she still managed to get decent results, a Challenger title, and made the Top 6 at both of her GP assignments. Calling them 'nobodies' is just rude.

I don't think they're nobodies, they're my favourites, but clearly the ISU and most of the people in this thread think they are. To say nothing of the disrespect they heap on Mishin one of the longest serving and most decorated coaches in the world.

Say one bad thing about Eteri and you're the worst person in this thread, but bash Mishin all you want.

Suggest one of Eteri's skaters leave her and you're an idiot, suggest Liza leave Mishin the coach who supported and believed in her when nobody else did and that's just fine.

 

[ec00834]

Well, weakest of the Eteri girls and also weaker than Medvedeva. If both Zagitova and Medvedeva skate clean then I would put Anna behind both. Even with her quad. She is still so juniorish to me with so much to work on. I’m sure her team analyzed the scoring and heard the messages judges sent. They’re working hard to improve all their girls. I expect to see they’ve helped Anna as well.

Even with Anna's five lutzes called, URs and not receiving all level 4s, she still scored higher than clean Evgenia (w/1 lutz called). I don't understand how exactly you're defining weak. If you mean who's score is going to be the highest if everyone bombs, then sure Anna's the weakest because she doesn't have the reputation. If we're basing "weakest" off of actual results and consistency from what we've seen so far, then Anna definitely isn't behind Alina and Evgenia.

 

[nussnacker]

I don't think they're nobodies, they're my favourites, but clearly the ISU and most of the people in this thread think they are. To say nothing of the disrespect they heap on Mishin one of the longest serving and most decorated coaches in the world.
Say one bad thing about Eteri and you're the worst person in this thread, but bash Mishin all you want.
Suggest one of Eteri's skaters leave her and you're an idiot, suggest Liza leave Mishin the coach who supported and believed in her when nobody else did and that's just fine.

Oh, come on.
You can't say 'most people in this thread', when it's a few comments just from one-two users.
This way, we can also say 'most people in this thread bash Anna', 'most people in this thread hate Sasha'...
I'm sure most people in this thread love/like both Liza and Sofia.

Yeah, one person suggested Liza to leave Mishin, it doesn't mean everyone or anyone else agrees with it.
The reason people reacted to suggestion of Anna to leave Eteri, only because it was like 15th suggestion of someone to leave Eteri, while this rarely happens to Mishin's skaters.
I don't think Liza will ever leave Mishin. She speaks about him as if he's her second father, they clearly have a very close relationship.
And I'm not sure she needs to.

 

[BabySloth]

anonymoose_au says that out of frustration for Liza and Sofia, she/he wasn't trying to be rude.

Oh okay. I misunderstood anonymoose. You never know in this thread. Some people just like to be unnecessarily harsh but if it was sarcasm it makes sense.

 

[Jontor]

The power of GOE

I've calculated how much in average the Russian girls get in GOE
I guess that's important when we talk about BV's?

These are the averages after the CS's and GPs the girls have done:

Kostornaia +25% (Fin, IdF, NHK)
Medvedeva +19% (AC, SC, Ros)
Zagitova +18% (IdF, NHK)
Trusova +17% (Nep, SC, Ros)
Shcherbakova +16% (Lom, SA, CoC)
Tuktamysheva +14% (Lom, Fin, SA, CoC)

Kostornaia has a significant lead over the others...

 

[VenusHalley]

Alina never had edge calls. NHK confirmed that the ones that she received at IdF was a mistake/misunderstanding - no conspiracy theories on IdF judging! Zhenya is a different case. Her BV is lower than Alina's. Alina has 3 lutzes and 3 flips. Zhenya has the same number of flips but only one lutz. Then she has 2 loops (BV 9.8) vs. 2 lutzes (BV 11.8). The edge that she gets now is a further hit. She got in Moscow only 4 points for the lutz that looked quite good from the stands. Alina just received 8.6 points for her lutz. These 6 points difference between them would be quite difficult to cover.

Or maybe Rusfeds hissyfit worked and now we are back to allowing skaters to flutz and underrorate their way to medals. Just when things were looking up.

Japanese fed will not have enough guts to throw hissyfit of their own and their "homecooking" will be "let's overscore others and throw our own skaters under the zamboni".

 

[ec00834]

Or maybe Rusfeds hissyfit worked and now we are back to allowing skaters to flutz and underrorate their way to medals. Just when things were looking up.

Japanese fed will not have enough guts to throw hissyfit of their own and their "homecooking" will be "let's overscore others and throw our own skaters under the zamboni".

Lol why are you so mad? You seem to have a lot of anger bottled up
Alina never had a "flutz" but believe what you want

 

[Mishaminion]

I don't think they're nobodies, they're my favourites, but clearly the ISU and most of the people in this thread think they are. To say nothing of the disrespect they heap on Mishin one of the longest serving and most decorated coaches in the world.

Say one bad thing about Eteri and you're the worst person in this thread, but bash Mishin all you want.

Suggest one of Eteri's skaters leave her and you're an idiot, suggest Liza leave Mishin the coach who supported and believed in her when nobody else did and that's just fine.

I do not disrespect Mishin, he deserves a whole lot of respect and credit for his achievements.

BUT

He is old school and stubborn and it shows, even Liza has said it is very hard to change his mind.
He needs to accept things have changed and help his skaters move with the times more.
I would support Liza if she did leave Mishin. Why? Because that would be her choice and I would respect that.

However, I too said about her leaving in frustration just like you do when you claim we all think Liza and Sofia are nobodies. I do not really think she would do it, not now.

Liza has been one of my favourites for years, but Mishin does need to accept the way things are and give his skaters a better chance of delivering against the new wave of "trendsetters"

If you want to call that bashing, go ahead but I certainly don't intend for it to be or think that offering any criticism at all is bashing

 

[flanker]

Lol why are you so mad? You seem to have a lot of anger bottled up
Alina never had a "flutz" but believe what you want

During the last month venus had written about 3-4 comments in this thread and all of them completely anti-Alina. That's how you have to take what she says

 

[Mishaminion]

Or maybe Rusfeds hissyfit worked and now we are back to allowing skaters to flutz and underrorate their way to medals. Just when things were looking up.

Japanese fed will not have enough guts to throw hissyfit of their own and their "homecooking" will be "let's overscore others and throw our own skaters under the zamboni".

What on God's green EARTH are you talking about?

 

[flanker]

I don't think they're nobodies, they're my favourites, but clearly the ISU and most of the people in this thread think they are. To say nothing of the disrespect they heap on Mishin one of the longest serving and most decorated coaches in the world.

Say one bad thing about Eteri and you're the worst person in this thread, but bash Mishin all you want.

Suggest one of Eteri's skaters leave her and you're an idiot, suggest Liza leave Mishin the coach who supported and believed in her when nobody else did and that's just fine.

Saying that the layout he is giving to his ladies is bad does not come from disrespect towards him, it's just stating the facts. Yes, Liza has three 3As in two programs, but the rest of the jumps is implemented completely wrong. First thing is not a single 3-3 combo. Second is 3Lz+2A+SEQ. Not only the BV of the programs is lower than usually with this layout but even space for high GOE is not wide when the combo with highes BV is 2A+3T+2T where you receive GOE only for 3T. Also combo in SP was originally 3T-3T. Then she tried 3F-3T, but she doubled the T in China (don't remember LV). They are literally throwing points for elements out of the window just because of the bad layout. The other thing is low PCS, namely because the lack of transitions.

As for Sofia, when we put her puberty struggles aside (this can be completely different the next season), her jumping layout is still completely same, SP, 3F-3T good, but then 3Lo and 2A on the end in the bonus part. Again, that's unnecessary low BV in comparison with others. Her FP layout sounds relatively good, but e.g. both 2As are in the bonus part instead of some stronger jumps that could rise her BV for a point or two. Still I agree that she was dreadfully underscored, with more reasonable scoring she could be somewhere around 190, but that would be 4th place at best. The gap to medals would be still too big.

All this doesn't need to be present forever. layout can be improved, Sofia will overcome the puberty (while at least some of the 3A can still expect some troubles), so who knows what the next season will bring to us, but it's not necessary to run around and blaming everything and everybody.

 

[Orlov]

I still think Anna is the weakest of all the Russian ladies. Many will disagree, but I see her as the weakest of them

nice jok

 

[Orlov]

Dear Iamhugefanbut-people, you cannot fool anyone

Come on, is't so hard to be less hypocritical and more direct? Just - "look at my avatar and remember that only three of them will stay alive at the end of December. So diiiiie!!!!!!!! Here URs! And here edge! And that! And this!!..."

Sincerity is so lacking in our hypocritical world

 

[Scout]

8 years ago, Elizaveta became the first to win both gp events in her senior debut - this year, we have three first time seniors who accomplished that!

As far as I know, no lady has ever had an undefeated first senior season. It will be interesting to see if one of Anna, Alexandra or Alena can do it.