2019-20 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating

[esteticlove]

Dear Spiral of Miles,

what you have written is very reasonable and I completely agree with you. The judging panel this season has been absurdly harsh towards Anna in all competitions, and not just here at the Europeans, starting back from the Grand Prix Series. She's always been unappreciated for a reason unknown to me, even though she's shown great skills and very hard elements. On the top of that, she actually proved everyone wrong by skating mostly clean despite the difficulty of her programs. As we saw here, she lost the gold due to the SP, since both she and her main rival Aliona did mistakes in the free. 77pts for being absolutely clean and doing the hardest combo 3Lz-3Lo in the second part is absurd. I know that Aliona gets high scores not only based on her incredible 3A, but also on the high GOEs on her jumps, which she deserves most of the time. However, her SP jumps weren't that sharp (kind of botched -3T), which didn't affect the scores. The skating skills are so,so. Aliona didn't seem quite in tune at this competition. Still, I respect her - her 3A were the best out there and she has the privellege in the SP. I'm not saying that Aliona doesn't deserve to win. Not at all. All I try to say is that Anna finally deserves fair scoring.

 

[dhjh811]

She was, but two of the calls were questionable, and even just one going the other way would've given her the gold. So, I stand by my statement that she should've won.

Her only questionable call was the 4lz downgrade. She should've gotten a ur for that triple salchow also. Besides, both Alena and Anna escaped any edge calls. If the judges were truly fair, Anna's score would have PLUMMETED. Her lutzes in this competition were dangerously flat, her lutz in the SP could be given an e. The right skater won today.

 

[kmw227]

In a way I think Sasha has become the victim of her own success and hype. She's the one who started the whole quad craze and people are expecting so much out her. The pressure of that, plus the pressure of a senior debut, combined with her own desire to push the envelope, puts her in a different category then Alena or Anna. All three of them had major pressure on them to dominate but I do think there was more on her. She seem's to be a bit lost compared to her training mates but hopefully she finds her way soon.

Either way she with all that pressure she has done far better then most. A testament to her strength

I completely agree. If being dubbed the Quad Queen doesn't put pressure on you, I really don't know what will. That's a lot for a brand new senior to handle. But, Sasha's determined and resilient and I have no doubt that she'll be back on track for Worlds :yes:

 

[Jontor]

I'll preface this by saying that I've always loved all of the 3A but have always held a soft spot for Anna, so I may be biased, but:

Anna deserved to win today.

None of the 3A were flawless today, so the win can't go to the one who was clean. Anna and Alena each had one fall, Anna on a quad lutz and Alena on a triple lutz. Each landed two difficult elements - Anna the 4Lz and 4F, and Alena a pair of incredible 3As. Anna backed up her skate with a 3Lz-3Lo and 3F-Eu-3S, while Alena had a (stunning) but easier 3F-3T. Both had level 3 steps with good GOE, and both have amazing spins, although Anna has more flexibility in her Biellmann and Alena more innovative positions. So, Anna wins technically for me - both with one fall, two ultra-difficult elements, and two exquisite combinations, but Anna with a harder element that she fell on.

Since both had a fall, their PCS was lower than in the past. I agree that Alena should have a higher score for skating skills, but today I think Anna was much better in interpretation and performance. That wasn't reflected in the scores. In the end, though, it's a sport, and with each skater having a fall, the one who produced the more difficult of their beautiful elements should've won. That's Anna.

It seems that Anna has to be completely clean (or have a minor error) with three quads to beat Alena with three triple axels and a mistake. That to me is critically unfair, and I think the problem stems from the SP rules. Triple axels and quads are both incredibly difficult, and yet only triple axels are allowed in the short. The reasoning for that aside, it would appear that the ISU is discouraging quads - discouraging harder elements - by having these rules and scoring Anna and Alena the way they did today. That's not progress for the sport, and it's disheartening. Fall on the second quad lutz aside, this was one of Anna's best performances (she's clearly grown into this program and it's so exciting to see!) but it seems like what she's doing isn't enough. And as a fan, it makes me upset and sad for her.

All this aside, she seems to do best when she's the underdog, so maybe this will let her go in and win Worlds decisively .

Completely agree. But it was close though and the tech panel were harder on Anna. If she didn't have those URs on her 4F or her 3Lo she would have won.
I'm pleasently surprised though that she was only a little of a point behind Alena in PCS. The gap is closing!

Great competition. Anna's time will come. It might be Worlds:luv17:

 

[colormyworld240]

Yeah, protocols are questionable to me. Anna's flip looked fully around, and while her 3Lz-3Lo was close, Alena or Sasha would've gotten away with a similar rotation. In fact, Alena's 3Lz was called clean, but if Anna's flip and combo aren't clean, then I think that should've had a call too. Not sure that would've made a difference, but combined with the < rather than << on the second 4Lz for Anna would've.

I'm even more disappointed now

I think the flip was very close, borderline, and because Amano is a strict caller I can agree that the under rotation was fair. The biggest issue is with the 4Lz downgrade. I mean from the angle in the Youtube stream, it was very clearly past the half point; close to a quarter. That would be an under rotation, but not downgrade. Just compare it to Sasha's downgrade, which was actually on the half way point. Overall, I think her UR calls were fair, as the other skaters were hammered when they were border line too. I think one of Alena's 3A was borderline as well as Sasha's combo, but it's strange Shinn didn't call those but he could've just missed it.

Anyway, Anna does need a 3A or 4T in addition to her arsenal if she wants to win. I really hope she is able to keep her artistry as well, because that's the most enjoyable part of her skating. And of course, stay healthy as she does seem much more prone to injury than Sasha who can add so many quads and remain healthy. Hopefully puberty will work in Anna's favour so she is able to build more muscle to make her stronger.

 

[Spirals for Miles]

It might be Worlds:luv17:

My custom title shares your hope!

 

[SkatingFan9]

And as of yet she has to still have w clean programs, if she again tries 5 quads at worlds the chances are high that she again will not have a clean run, if she goes for the watered down content , she has better chances in my ooinion

This was too watered-down. 3 quads and a double axel means she doesn’t control her own destiny.

She will do what she has to do to peak and win at Worlds. I think that 4 quads and a triple axel will be enough to ensure victory.

 

[esteticlove]

On another note... I see a big difference in Anna's double axels. They seem to have improved, she's not twisting herself into them anymore and they have better height. Maybe we'll see a 3A at Worlds?

 

[fabienne1996]

This was too watered-down. 3 quads and a double axel means she doesn’t control her own destiny.

She will do what she has to do to peak and win at Worlds. I think that 4 quads and a triple axel will be enough to ensure victory.

And from what I remember she has not even had a clean 4 quad programm this season , or am I wrong, it's nothing against her but as of know we have not seen her go clean

 

[BabySloth]

Her only questionable call was the 4lz downgrade. She should've gotten a ur for that triple salchow also. Besides, both Alena and Anna escaped any edge calls. If the judges were truly fair, Anna's score would have PLUMMETED. Her lutzes in this competition were dangerously flat, her lutz in the SP could be given an e. The right skater won today.

Agree. You are brave for saying this. Here on GS RSL wrong edges don't exist (of course unless the skater is Medvedeva).

 

[Jontor]

Sasha won’t be losing any sleep over this. Expectations weren’t too high, with her being in a weakened state and with a watered-down content. Also, Euros is neither prestigious or too relevant. Her goal is to peak at Worlds (why be European champion when she can just be World champion instead? )

I love your Sasha enthusiasm.:luv17:

 

[colormyworld240]

Here's what I think is happening for Sasha:
- Watering it down isn't going to help her. If she landed 2 clean quads today, she would've still lost by quite a bit. It would've been bronze to Anna and Alena.
- Planning 5 quads and having a skate like nationals would've still landed her in third.
- The only way Sasha can even have a chance at winning is if she lands all 5 of her quads cleanly, and the only way to have a shot at that is if she keeps attempting that crazy layout

Her PCS isn't going to magically go up to the 70s if she waters down her content. And if it doesn't, she doesn't have a chance with 2 quads. It's crazy to think about but it's her reality; bronze either way unless she hits it out of the park with 5 beautifully landed quads, then she can win. If not, then it doesn't really matter what she does she will always lost to Anna/Alena unless they have a meltdown which they haven't had yet. It's much easier to control what you do vs. how others are going to skate on a given day or how judges will score you. Also, Sasha was the only one of the Russians to have all level 4s today, but that is not enough to help her. She doesn't really have a choice but to go for her most difficult layout if she wants a shot at gold at any competition where both Anna and Alena are competing.

 

[Jontor]

Congrats to Alena! A really deserving win, even if she wasn't at her best.

Anna's downgrade may be just an underrotation, but it's Shin Amano himself who gave it. She also has flat edge in some lutzes so they basically cancel each other out.

Too bad for Alexandra. Must be frustrating to be 3rd for a third competition in a row. It's bit concerning that she fell twice even on a watered-down (for her standards) program, considering she made as many mistakes in December with 5 quads planned.

I wonder if RusFed will organize another competition for Worlds spots. Sasha's score was pretty big, but Liza or even Evgenia (or Alina if she wants to return) could beat it on a good day.

Well both Alina and Evgenia have announced that they have ended their season so that is not an option.

The only scenario when RusFed would pull any of the 3A from Worlds is if one of them didn't medal at Euros, and that didn't happen.
So it's safe to say that the 3A are going to Worlds.

 

[nussnacker]

On another note... I see a big difference in Anna's double axels. They seem to have improved, she's not twisting herself into them anymore and they have better height. Maybe we'll see a 3A at Worlds?

She said that her 3A is doing better, but not competition ready yet. Perhaps it’s close? It sounded like she’s landing it, or at least close to it.

 

[SkatingFan9]

Here's what I think is happening for Sasha:
- Watering it down isn't going to help her. If she landed 2 clean quads today, she would've still lost by quite a bit. It would've been bronze to Anna and Alena.
- Planning 5 quads and having a skate like nationals would've still landed her in third.
- The only way Sasha can even have a chance at winning is if she lands all 5 of her quads cleanly, and the only way to have a shot at that is if she keeps attempting that crazy layout

Her PCS isn't going to magically go up to the 70s if she waters down her content. And if it doesn't, she doesn't have a chance with 2 quads. It's crazy to think about but it's her reality; bronze either way unless she hits it out of the park with 5 beautifully landed quads, then she can win. If not, then it doesn't really matter what she does she will always lost to Anna/Alena unless they have a meltdown which they haven't had yet. It's much easier to control what you do vs. how others are going to skate on a given day.

If Sasha landed the quads today, she would’ve won gold, as neither Anna or Aliona were clean.
Sasha also never needed 5 quads to win gold. 4 quads and a double axel would be enough, as of now (they’re all trying to add more). By Worlds, 4 quads and a triple axel will in all likelihood be enough to control her own fate.

5 quads is Sasha being ambitious; not it being a necessity.

 

[Mishaminion]

Anna got away with her Lutz edge so I do not think the judging was that harsh on her

 

[NAOTMAA]

I don't think Sasha needs to add more quads. I think she needs to start stabilizing her triple axel. I think 3 quads and 2 triple axels combined with improving her PCS (she needs to allow herself to breathe during a program and perform as she can instead of focusing so much on the next quad) should give her enough if she's clean

All this talk about more and more quads will backfire because it will only get in the judges head that she's nothing but a jumping bean and her PCS will never go up even if they should. It already has backfired with Anna and Anna doesn't hype up more and more quads.

Either way I get the impression Alena is the international judges big favorite so I'm not sure either way. The judges just flat out prefer her to Anna or Sasha

 

[Jontor]

Her only questionable call was the 4lz downgrade. She should've gotten a ur for that triple salchow also. Besides, both Alena and Anna escaped any edge calls. If the judges were truly fair, Anna's score would have PLUMMETED. Her lutzes in this competition were dangerously flat, her lutz in the SP could be given an e. The right skater won today.

I am so tired of this nonsense about Anna's Lutzes. An e in the short? I strongly oppose this.

It's the edge when you pick that counts, and Anna always has an outside edge, then it sometimes goes to flat when she jumps up but that's okay!
An e means an inside edge and that is just ridiculous.

 

[Lzbee]

What I saw today is that Anna has genuinely massively improved her skating skills but Sasha's improvement has been less pronounced. On the other hand, Sasha has made big improvements in her performance and the first half of her SP was great at this competition.

Alena's jumps were not as good as usual today but there's still a lot of time before worlds so I hope we can see a confident and smooth performance there.

I love Alena but I do kind of want Sasha to win worlds...

 

[Jontor]

I think the flip was very close, borderline, and because Amano is a strict caller I can agree that the under rotation was fair. The biggest issue is with the 4Lz downgrade. I mean from the angle in the Youtube stream, it was very clearly past the half point; close to a quarter. That would be an under rotation, but not downgrade. Just compare it to Sasha's downgrade, which was actually on the half way point. Overall, I think her UR calls were fair, as the other skaters were hammered when they were border line too. I think one of Alena's 3A was borderline as well as Sasha's combo, but it's strange Shinn didn't call those but he could've just missed it.

Anyway, Anna does need a 3A or 4T in addition to her arsenal if she wants to win. I really hope she is able to keep her artistry as well, because that's the most enjoyable part of her skating. And of course, stay healthy as she does seem much more prone to injury than Sasha who can add so many quads and remain healthy. Hopefully puberty will work in Anna's favour so she is able to build more muscle to make her stronger.

What Anna needs is fair judging