2021-22 Japanese Nationals: Women's FS

[readernick]

There are many arguments to be made for bumping Mana for Mai, but I don't think it will happen. JF isn't US fed it isn't Russia fed. JF likes going with national results unless there is a compelling reason not to and, in the end, Mai hasn't had significantly better scores than Mana. Additionally,Mana has much more future potential. 75 percent chance they go with Mana.

 

[lurkerghost1]

I'm really quite surprised that so many people here are assuming that Kawabe is a done deal for the Olympics. All she's done is earned the right to be considered. And the rest of her body of work this year compared to Mihara does not hold up.

not really, Mana won a GP silver and Mai had two 4ths. Sure Mai is in the top 3 in some categories (season best, season ranking) but Mana is top 3 in nationals and tech PCS.

I wish Mai would go too and she definitely would have won bronze if she was clean. but JSF has shown the only skater they will make exceptions for is Satoko.

Anyway I expect Mai to win 4CC again so congrats to her. She should go to Worlds instead of Kawabe I think, she is much more reliable, it's true.

 

[rollerblade]

I wish Mai would go too and she definitely would have won bronze if she was clean. but JSF has shown the only skater they will make exceptions for is Satoko.

When did they make exceptions for Satoko? You mean the season where she was 4th at nationals, behind Tomoe Kawabata?

 

[gotoschool]

I have supported Mana and pointed out her underscoring on several occasions and I really like her performances especially her beautiful triple axel, but I am surprised that nobody has pointed out that several of her landings in the LP were ekked out leaning over, or rather rough with obvious hooks and all judged clean with no under rotations or deductions since I didn't see any drop in the tech counter after her performance was over. By contrast, Mai lost a couple of points in tech with overall cleaner landings. Also, Mai's standing ovations in the SP and LP translated into basically nothing in terms of PCS even though they have so often been justified as a reason for jacking up the PCS sky high for other skaters, but never for Mai. In terms of PCS, Mai's scores were basically only 2 to 3 points higher than Mana's in the LP which is very little, especially considering all the work Mai has painstakingly put for years into slowly improving her picturesque posture, buttery smooth skating skills, sophisticated artistic expression, model carriage, picturesque positions in her arabesque spirals, beautiful transitions and finished articulation and extension in every movement, and the mysterious depth of emotional resonance she has slowly been able to evoke which even reminds me of Mao to some extent, though Mai does it in her own unique way.
In my opinion, one of the best features of being liberated from the judgment of the scoring system is that it allows someone to decide for themselves the qualities they most like to see in a performance. While I think Kaori, Wakaba and Mana all skated really well and I was impressed with their performances, in my opinion Mai delivered the ones I cherish the most. In any case, what she had to battle back from with her illness and great loss of weight and strength to perform at this incredibly high level deserves some kind of recognition especially since there seems to be the interminable intention to force her down to fourth yet again. Shades of Dejavu that hearken back to Nationals 2018 when Rika and Mai were both lowballed in unison.

 

[CoyoteChris]

Wow...what a comp....finally got enough download speed to watch it....I would give a special medal to Mai for rising above adversity to perform at this level.

BTW, the winner of the advertisements ...the Mao ad!

 

[sailormoon]

Mana Kawabe is currently the hottest Japanese skater in my view and I'm glad she successfully landed the triple axel twice in the competition, which has been done by Mao Asada in the past. Mana almost certainly secured the Olympic spot because we appreciate the technical aspect of this sport.

 

[CoyoteChris]

Mana Kawabe is currently the hottest Japanese skater in my view and I'm glad she successfully landed the triple axel twice in the competition, which has been done by Mao Asada in the past. Mana almost certainly secured the Olympic spot because we appreciate the technical aspect of this sport.

Would love to see her and other up and coming Japanese skaters live at Skates Americas in the next 4 years!

 

[Arigato]

Wakaba's FS is so good. Kaori's is so mediocre. I wish it would be reversed.

Not when she botches an opening 3A. But I like the music.

 

[Joekaz]

Not when she botches an opening 3A. But I like the music.

Her step out on the 3A(which Kaori can't even attempt) is worth more than a perfect 2A, my friend.

 

[Joekaz]

Mana Kawabe is currently the hottest Japanese skater in my view and I'm glad she successfully landed the triple axel twice in the competition, which has been done by Mao Asada in the past. Mana almost certainly secured the Olympic spot because we appreciate the technical aspect of this sport.

Her 3A was great, but she got pretty sloppy through alot of the program.

 

[Joekaz]

I have supported Mana and pointed out her underscoring on several occasions and I really like her performances especially her beautiful triple axel, but I am surprised that nobody has pointed out that several of her landings in the LP were ekked out leaning over, or rather rough with hooks and all judged clean with no under rotations or deductions since I didn't see any drop in the tech counter after her performance was over. By contrast, Mai lost a couple of points in tech with overall cleaner landings. Also, Mai's standing ovations in the SP and LP translated into basically nothing in terms of PCS even though they have so often been justified as a reason for jacking up the PCS sky high for other skaters, but never for Mai. In terms of PCS, Mai's scores were basically only 2 to 3 points higher than Mana's in the LP which is very little, especially considering all the work Mai has painstakingly put for years into slowly improving her picturesque posture, buttery smooth skating skills, sophisticated artistic expression, model carriage, picturesque positions in her arabesque spirals, beautiful transitions and finished articulation and extension in every movement, and the mysterious depth of emotional resonance she has slowly been able to evoke which even reminds me of Mao to some extent, though Mai does it in her own unique way.
In my opinion, one of the best features of being liberated from the judgment of the scoring system is that it allows someone to decide for themselves the qualities they most like to see in a performance. While I think Kaori, Wakaba and Mana all skated really well and I was impressed with their performances, in my opinion Mai delivered the ones I cherish the most. In any case, what she had to battle back from with her illness and great loss of weight and strength to perform at this incredibly high level deserves some kind of recognition especially since there seems to be the interminable intention to force her down to fourth yet again. Shades of Dejavu that hearken back to Nationals 2018 when Rika and Mai were both lowballed in unison.

Mana got very low GOE on most of her jumps. Mai just made bigger mistakes.

 

[Arigato]

Her step out on the 3A

Was a botch. Hence the negative GOE for the element. — 1.60 I prefer a spin-free zone.

 

[Joekaz]

Was a botch. Hence the negative GOE for the element. — 1.60 I prefer a spin-free zone.

And that particular botch is called a step out. I prefer a more accurate spin free zone, evidently, hence that botch was worth 6.40, far more than a perfect 2A, as I stated in my own spin free manner, my friend.

 

[Arigato]

And that particular botch

Is still a botch. Merry Christmas.

 

[Joekaz]

Is still a botch. Merry Christmas.

Thanks for the astute commentary. Lay off the eggnog, you have had enough it seems.

 

[lurkerghost1]

When did they make exceptions for Satoko? You mean the season where she was 4th at nationals, behind Tomoe Kawabata?

that year yes, also the season before (2018-19) when she just barely got 3rd over Mihara thanks to a very lenient tech panel. She also had an exception to compete at nationals last year without having to do any qualifying (why they did not give a bye to Kaori, Wakaba etc. I don't know). And then she competed at the world championships 2021 even though she was injured and probably should have been replaced.

Satoko is my favorite skater along with Wakaba, but it's true Satoko is definitely the federation favorite.

 

[Joekaz]

that year yes, also the season before (2018-19) when she just barely got 3rd over Mihara thanks to a very lenient tech panel. She also had an exception to compete at nationals last year without having to do any qualifying (why they did not give a bye to Kaori, Wakaba etc. I don't know). And then she competed at the world championships 2021 even though she was injured and probably should have been replaced.

Satoko is my favorite skater along with Wakaba, but it's true Satoko is definitely the federation favorite.

She was the favorite, not anymore. Kaori has that for sure.

 

[Joekaz]

I'm glad she made it. You can tell how hard she worked for this.

But I can see how your fandom clouds your view of the importance of Nationals. It's not that they rarely pick someone off the podium because Nationals are so important; it's just because most times the people that they want to pick end up on the podium anyway. When they want someone else, they find a way. That's why all the other selection criteria exist.

And in hindsight, you have to agree that they made the right call four years ago. Sakamoto has gone on to become the ace of the ladies, and Higuchi remains just sort of there, still looking for her first gold medal of note.

Im starting to get less confident in Mana going. I would still favor her 60/40, but I think fan pressure and Fuji TV liking a good story could help Mai alot. As I said, we will see.

 

[zanadude]

The selection criteria are only for selecting the skaters to consider. Once the list is made, they can make the selection for any reason they want, be it consultation with an astrologist, or the "feel good" aspect of picking Mai, or whatever. If Wakaba weren't available, I'd say they might pick Mana just to have someone that can hit a triple axel.

But to look at this objectively, neither Mana nor Mai will medal at the Olympics. Probably neither would be chosen to participate in the team event, and it's really difficult to see them beating out either Kaori or Wakaba, let alone any of the Russian ROC skaters, in the individual event. With that in mind, there's really nothing to lose by sending the sentimental choice to the Olympics. And Mana probably benefits more anyway by going against a weakened Worlds field to earn more world ranking points.

 

[lurkerghost1]

The selection criteria are only for selecting the skaters to consider. Once the list is made, they can make the selection for any reason they want, be it consultation with an astrologist, or the "feel good" aspect of picking Mai, or whatever. If Wakaba weren't available, I'd say they might pick Mana just to have someone that can hit a triple axel.

But to look at this objectively, neither Mana nor Mai will medal at the Olympics. Probably neither would be chosen to participate in the team event, and it's really difficult to see them beating out either Kaori or Wakaba, let alone any of the Russian ROC skaters, in the individual event. With that in mind, there's really nothing to lose by sending the sentimental choice to the Olympics. And Mana probably benefits more anyway by going against a weakened Worlds field to earn more world ranking points.

I think the opposite, instead of sending Mana to both Olympics and worlds they should send mana to Olympics and Mai to worlds because Mai is very stable and would probably place top 6 at worlds and get them a spot.