Adam Rippon Makes a Coaching Change

[prettykeys]

So money is more important to you than Yuna winning?! Tsk, shame on you!

No, of course not! I'll happily lose the bet and see YuNa not-bomb (I gain more that way, and she doesn't have to win ) but it's kind of like insurance. Because if she does happen to bomb (which I think is unlikely, but given the nature of this sport), I will be major bummed and winning the bet would be a small form of consolation.

 

[Sinclare]

Really?

...If Adam Rippon can't land Triple Axel during crunch time in the 2010-11 season when he obviously has the jumps for sometime already : see the 2010 Worlds and the Japan Open and his two World Junior Titles, then it likely is not Brian's fault. Because besides the jumps, Adam has got the whole package...

...The bottom line is I don't think Adam's decision to leave Brian is a wise one and a decision that I think he will regret. Adam's skating has improved greatly overall in his two years with Brian. What happened to his consistency, I am not certain. He seemed on and off, sometimes great, sometimes not. But the issue seemed to be a jump consistency issue, which is easier to correct IMO than some more fundamental problems. I hope Adam is not blaming Brian for his own failure to land jumps like Triple Lutz because if his coach change decision is mostly based on his own luckluster results this year, then I think he will end up paying for it in the long run....

I agree that the axel is not a jump he needs to learn and your take on he needs to learn to perform it in "crunch" times or at least needs to look more confident with the jump. Maybe that was the issue, Brian was not the right person in the "crunch" times? Who knows? I don't think this was a hasty decision watching the K&C all season, I think it was in the making for some time. But I think just because someone can or has performed a skill doesn't necessarily mean they can teach it. And just because they can't teach it doesn't make them a bad person. Who knows how much time Adam has been with this technical coach this season as opposed to last? Maybe that was the issue.
As far as Yuna, I think much of her growth as a performer was David Wilson's mastery not so much Orser. (IMHO) I think that if Yuna didn't have the "goods" to win Worlds this year she would have WD by now, I expect that she will be in top form.

 

[iluvtodd]

I don't follow gossip, either. I wish Brian Orser the best, and I hope the new coaching arrangement works out for Adam. I have immense respect for Brian O. and Adam.

This is in reply to Joesitz. I thought I pressed the "reply with quote" button.

 

[sigrid]

I think the 3A is more of a consistency in competition issue for Rippon than anything else. He has landed them fine in past competitions (both 3A landed in the FS at 2009 Junior Worlds, 2010 Four Continents, and Japan Open this past fall).

I agree, I remember some vids from the 2011 Nats practices where he was landing good 3axels (and I'm talking about the 75% of them)

It wasn't a good season for Adam and I understand that he's looking for a change. If it's a good decision or not we can't know until we see the results. I really hope Briand will help him not only with the 3axel but also with his consistency in competition.
And I also would like to see some non-David Wilson choreo for him in the new season, at least in one of his programs, but that's just a personal thought.

 

[Krislite]

[...]

As for Yu-Na Kim being super human, let's wait till after the 2011 Worlds. If she bombs, as many think she probably will, then I hope the same Brian bashers would learn a dear lesson and be ashamed.

If this is the general expectation among the judges heading to Worlds then I am glad. So much better for Yuna when she finishes her performance.

 

[silverlake22]

But wouldn't Yu-na have won anyway? For example she seems happy and looks to be in great shape training with Peter Oppagard, could she not have won the Gold under his tutelage? She is a great talent, that accounts for something no matter who her coach is.

Gao has improved, but has not lived up the hype. Not saying that was Orser's fault, as she was rather over-hyped to begin with.

Gao has not even competed on the senior level internationally yet, and has been skating under the radar for the past couple of seasons, that could all change next season when she competes as a senior internationally. She might make a splash immediately like Kanako did, or she could get lost in the shuffle - we don't know yet and because she has yet to deal with big pressure, we don't know how she will handle it. Adam's situation is different. I have a hunch his issue might not be his coaching situation so much as his head. This season he seems to have become a bit of a headcase, and in that respect, making a coaching change is probably a smart move. I mean, it certainly seemed to help Alissa and Tomas this season. Not everyone has the mindset to be a champion. Yuna did, on top of being very talented, so it is not surprising she won the OGM. Brian is a good coach, but he's not a miracle worker just like all the other coaches out there. Adam has improved a lot under Brian, so we know that Brian is at least a good technical coach, but perhaps he isn't the best at instilling the right competitive mindset in his students. As I mentioned before, Yuna had the championship mindset when she came to Brian, he didn't have to instill it in her. It is too soon to tell if Gao has the right mindset or not, but if she does, she may stay with Brian for a long time and do very well under his tutledge. Adam at this point doesn't have the right competitive mindset, and seeing how he's been with Brian for 2 years, he's probably realized that working hard and having a good technical coach isn't enough to make you a champion. His competitive mindset is the missing piece of the puzzle for him, and he was probably trying to give Brian a chance, but after 2 years he still has some kind of mental block, and so he's leaving Brian and likely looking for a new coach who can help him develop the right competitive mindset.

 

[jayjayjayyy]

does anyone knows where will adam train after this change??

 

[Krislite]

does anyone knows where will adam train after this change??

He will remain in the Cricket Club. His "new" coach is actually one of the many trainers at the club that Adam's been working with for a while now.

 

[Sinclare]

I agree, I remember some vids from the 2011 Nats practices where he was landing good 3axels (and I'm talking about the 75% of them)

I saw the same at Nationals practices.
Here is his 4CC FS video from last year. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8pHhqa7b1yA
He was in 7th place more than 12 points out of first then went on to win the competition by almost 10 points.
Here is the FS video from 4CC from this year http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZBW_fyrSyUM He was in a stronger position, 5th after the short with less ground to make up. But he ended up more than 12 points from the podium. PJ said in the first video that Briand was with him at the boards and in the kiss and cry in 2010. I think that is the guy Adam wants to work full time with.
I must say after re-watching some of the Kiss and Cry facial expressions of Orser from this season with Rippon I cringe how completely absent he was as a coach and looked so uncomfortable like he was embarrassed. It is uncomfortable to watch --- I'd rather see a coach over the top waving etc (no offense Robin W.) than look embarrassed to be there. That kind of moody, emotional coach has got to takes its toll on a skater. :think:

 

[rocketry]

I wonder if Adam hadn't had two events where he exceeded expectations (Japan Open and Worlds 2010) if this would've happened. Being World Junior Champion twice is impressive, but with those two events he transformed himself from possible contender to contender or favorite for all podiums. Any way you look at it, Adam's stock did rise under Orser, but possibly more than Adam or Orser could have anticipated.

 

[Sinclare]

I wonder if Adam hadn't had two events where he exceeded expectations (Japan Open and Worlds 2010) if this would've happened. Being World Junior Champion twice is impressive, but with those two events he transformed himself from possible contender to contender or favorite for all podiums. Any way you look at it, Adam's stock did rise under Orser, but possibly more than Adam or Orser could have anticipated.

Your post makes the most sense. I don't know if it's true, but I am willing to buy it for today at least,

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

Shall some of us go to the YuNa News thread and discuss Rippon?

I think YuNa is one of two top skaters of today (with Orser and maybe Opergard) but I don't mix with gush threads.

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

He will remain in the Cricket Club. His "new" coach is actually one of the many trainers at the club that Adam's been working with for a while now.

Ah ha. Thank you for some unknown, as least for me, news about Rippon. I would assume he has many coaches and Briand will be his primary coach.

btw, do all skaters have many coaches? I can understand a separate coach assisting a skater with a technical problem but not for his overall tech. The Choreographer will give him a good routine which he can tweek to feel more comforable. I think he knows what he's doing.

 

[Sylvia]

Ah ha. Thank you for some unknown, as least for me, news about Rippon. I would assume he has many coaches and Briand will be his primary coach.

Yes to Briand as primary coach -- see the USFS press release that I excerpted in the very first post in this thread.

 

[mot]

btw, do all skaters have many coaches? I can understand a separate coach assisting a skater with a technical problem but not for his overall tech.

Not sure all do, but many popular coaches with many students look after them as a team, consisting of several assistant coaches, who are not necessarily specialist technical coaches. Akiko Suzuki once tweeted that it was good to have a few assistant coaches around when the tension between her and her main coach, Hiroshi Nagakubo, got a bit too much. When Mao was with Tarasova, whose personal circumstances prevented her from travelling to Nagoya where Mao would not leave, Zanetta Folle was with her in Japan before the Olys and the Worlds.

Also some skaters who are under the coaches based in foreign countries have another coach back in their own country too. Miki practices with her former main coach Yuko Monna when she is in Japan, Oda with his mum (also a coach), Daisuke Murakami is looked after by Nagakubo when he's in Japan, Amodio with Annick Dumont when in France, etc, etc.

ETA: There are of course husband and wife teams too - Yuka Sato and Jason Dungjen, John Zimmerman and Silvia Fontana, Pasquale Camerlengo and Anjelika Krylova, Nobuo and Kumiko Sato, etc.

 

[jaylee]

First, I would like to say good luck to Adam. I still think the US men's field is wide open. It is a pity that Adam couldn't stake his claim as a top American man this season by making the Worlds team, but next season is another season.

Interesting to watch now given this announcement - Adam Rippon's interview before 2011 Four Continents with Universal Sports - http://www.universalsports.com/video/assetid=bf8f9f39-c03d-411a-a619-6c0a44314d8f.html

At 4:20, you can hear Adam talk about what he did after his US Nationals LP; he took his skates off, and went outside, and he called his coach. Not Brian Orser (who was there at the competition), but Ghislain Briand, in Toronto, who was the one to talk with him about his skate and give him words of support. At the time, I thought it was strange, but it makes more sense now.

This change does not appear to be made due to technical reasons, because Ghislain Briand was one of Adam's coaches already; there was no need for a coaching change in order for Adam to work with him. Unlike Alexe Gilles's recent coaching change, this announcement leaves me with questions still. If Adam was changing coaches and locations it would have made more sense, but Adam changing head coaches to the assistant coach he was already working with doesn't. I don't think Brian is being blamed for Adam's triple axel misses, or else Adam wouldn't be working with Ghislain still since he's the jumping coach.

 

[dorispulaski]

It might be as simple as Ghislain charges less than Brian, and Ghislain's skill is what Adam really needs at this point.

 

[parma]

First, I would like to say good luck to Adam. I still think the US men's field is wide open. It is a pity that Adam couldn't stake his claim as a top American man this season by making the Worlds team, but next season is another season.

Interesting to watch now given this announcement - Adam Rippon's interview before 2011 Four Continents with Universal Sports - http://www.universalsports.com/video/assetid=bf8f9f39-c03d-411a-a619-6c0a44314d8f.html

At 4:20, you can hear Adam talk about what he did after his US Nationals LP; he took his skates off, and went outside, and he called his coach. Not Brian Orser (who was there at the competition), but Ghislain Briand, in Toronto, who was the one to talk with him about his skate and give him words of support. At the time, I thought it was strange, but it makes more sense now.

This change does not appear to be made due to technical reasons, because Ghislain Briand was one of Adam's coaches already; there was no need for a coaching change in order for Adam to work with him. Unlike Alexe Gilles's recent coaching change, this announcement leaves me with questions still. If Adam was changing coaches and locations it would have made more sense, but Adam changing head coaches to the assistant coach he was already working with doesn't. I don't think Brian is being blamed for Adam's triple axel misses, or else Adam wouldn't be working with Ghislain still since he's the jumping coach.

So what story would you draw from what you just said?

 

[lavender]

I can't imagine Yu na bombing. Maybe she won't skate up to expectations but I kind of think she will be just fine. However if she bombs it will probably mean that it just wasn't her day. Nothing more...

I'm just looking forward to seeing if she has improved her stretch, the position of her feet etc while in competition. So far it looks like she has from practice videos.

 

[SkatingAnalyst]

TWO SIDES of BRIAN ORSER to students...

Bad.
1. Not Flexible
2. He could be felt INCONSIDERATE to skaters
3. Too CONFIDENT that everything is well under his control

Good
1. Very good SPEAKER for skaters
2. Excellent ABILITY to coach
3. Very STRAIGHT and REASONABLE

In any relationship, if you felt being neglected or mistreated...You LEAVE...NO MATTER WHAT.