Analyzing Sotnikova and Kim's footwork in the FS

[qwertyskates]

Did I say it wasn't? You wrote a lengthy paragraphs with some pesky little arguments on how Yuna didn't perform the Music compared to Buttle, V&M, Chen ETC. Music ITSELF cannot be compared on par with Step Sequences alone. You ran out of your arguments, hence why you even contradicted yourself saying

Sure the thread was supposed to talk about the Stsq, but you just HAD to talk about how Yuna apparently "did not" meet your criteria in performing Adios Nonino.

Hey, I'm sorry I didn't know you are the official referee on this site and get to decide that it is forbidden to talk about Choreography AND Step Sequence AND Hitting the Musical Nuances in ONE post.

Apparently, it is ok to talk about Adelina waving, even about her "UR jumps", but not ok to talk about how Yuna was lacking in her performance.

It must really sting to see Buttle's and V&M's videos.

You don't have to be Piazzolla to recognize a flat performance.

 

[cooper]

Hey, I'm sorry I didn't know you are the official referee on this site and get to decide that it is forbidden to talk about Choreography AND Step Sequence AND Hitting the Musical Nuances in ONE post.

Apparently, it is ok to talk about Adelina waving, even about her "UR jumps", but not ok to talk about how Yuna was lacking in her performance.

You don't have to be Piazzolla to recognize a flat performance.

and her famous flutz.. i think you forgot that.. oh wait..

 

[Procrastinator]

Sigh. I hate figure skatin fans. People can't criticize Yuna without calling her flat and belittling her choreography as cheek strokes. Likewise, people can't criticize Adelina without resorting to calling her a huffing hippo who has no choreo besides hand waving. This is why logic and argumentation courses should be required at the secondary school level, folks.

 

[drivingmissdaisy]

She didn't do half the number of crossovers. They're spread out in her program. She does about 25.

6 into the 3-3, 4 into the 3F, 3 into the 3S, 5 (forward) into the second 3Z, 3 into the 2A, 4 more into the 3S, 3 into her spiral, 2 into her 2A.

So yes, she relies heavily on crossovers (30 in all) to gain speed for her jump elements. How do you get anywhere close to 30 (or even 25) in Adelina's program?

 

[sk8in]

The choreography that you don't like apparently, but she doesn't just stop everything for eight seconds before a jump without doing some choreography or turns. Why do you ignore the fact Yuna doesn't do transitions before the jumps and that does, in fact, impact PCS? It isn't only about how beautiful she looks skating.

Actually Yuna did an ina bauer before her triple jump combination, whereas Adelnia just skated up to her 3F. Again, not really sure what competition you watched. Maybe you imagined it in your head?

 

[sk8in]

6 into the 3-3, 4 into the 3F, 3 into the 3S, 5 (forward) into the second 3Z, 3 into the 2A, 4 more into the 3S, 3 into her spiral, 2 into her 2A.

So yes, she relies heavily on crossovers (30 in all) to gain speed for her jump elements. How do you get anywhere close to 30 (or even 25) in Adelina's program?

By counting them. Once again, consecutive crossovers give Yuna superior speed and ice coverage. If someone runs 400 meters in the same time it takes someone else to run 300 meters, they are not less athletic because the 300 meter runner ran backwards for 2 seconds, or stood still for the first 3 seconds waving her arms around. Also Yuna's triple triple combination was clean. So maybe if Adelina had been skating instead of standing around on the ice she wouldn't have under rotated her 3T.

 

[drivingmissdaisy]

Actually Yuna did an ina bauer before her triple jump combination, whereas Adelnia just skated up to her 3F. Again, not really sure what competition you watched. Maybe you imagined it in your head?

That's true, Yuna should get a 10 in transitions for doing that once, and doing nothing into her other jumps.

 

[cooper]

Sigh. I hate figure skatin fans. People can't criticize Yuna without calling her flat and belittling her choreography as cheek strokes. Likewise, people can't criticize Adelina without resorting to calling her a huffing hippo who has no choreo besides hand waving. This is why logic and argumentation courses should be required at the secondary school level, folks.

when a competitor/s didn't make a single mistake not even a 2 footed jump, nor ignore the obvious 3 flutz.. just attack the performance. it's the only way you can justify the result, after all performance requires subjectivity.. and it's easy to criticize and make a point..

and forget this

http://s17.postimg.org/ch03n68tr/capture2.jpg

or this

http://s17.postimg.org/t61jj35f3/capture1.jpg

 

[sk8in]

That's true, Yuna should get a 10 in transitions for doing that once, and doing nothing into her other jumps.

She should certainly have a level 4 step sequence (again, thread topic) and Adelina should not be rewarded for doing nothing in between her last 4 jumping passes that even resembled a figure skating program.

 

[drivingmissdaisy]

If someone runs 400 meters in the same time it takes someone else to run 300 meters, they are not less athletic because the 300 meter runner ran backwards for 2 seconds, or stood still for the first 3 seconds waving her arms around.

I didn't realize skating was a race, and the fastest person wins regardless of how threadbare her program is.

 

[sk8in]

GOE and skating skills are based in part on speed, so yes it matters.

 

[cooper]

She should certainly have a level 4 step sequence (again, thread topic) and Adelina should not be rewarded for doing nothing in between her last 4 jumping passes that even resembled a figure skating program.

well.. they attacked yuna's performance instead and ignored the whole topic.. because they couldn't counter what BOP's analysis..

 

[Sam-Skwantch]

well.. they attacked yuna's performance instead and ignored the whole topic.. because they couldn't counter what BOP's analysis..

I'm just glad there wasn't another thread created

 

[cooper]

I'm just glad there wasn't another thread created

well you just give them an idea..

 

[drivingmissdaisy]

GOE and skating skills are based in part on speed, so yes it matters.

As do transitions.

 

[sk8in]

which is why Yuna's last two 2As should have higher GOE than Adelina's.... and yet suspiciously do not!

 

[drivingmissdaisy]

which is why Yuna's last two 2As should have higher GOE than Adelina's.... and yet suspiciously do not!

Yuna's final 2A was very slow on the entry and exit. Everything about it was worse than either of Adelain's 2A.

Yuna's 2A is here at 4:10: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hgXKJvTVW9g

Do you really think it is all that good?

 

[sk8in]

The speed looks good to me, and it was packed between choreography actual complex turns and her final combination spin. Incorporating elements that well and tightly to the music are why PCS and GOE exist.

 

[drivingmissdaisy]

The speed looks good to me, and it was packed between choreography actual complex turns and her final combination spin. Incorporating elements that well and tightly to the music are why PCS and GOE exist.

If you consider (starting at 4:06) doing two back crossovers into a 2A is "packed choreography" and "complex turns" then I suppose you aren't ever going to appreciate Adelina's actual packed choreography and complex turns before her jumps. You don't have to agree with Adelina's win but it is silly to act like Yuna's 2A at the end of the program was so amazing because she did two back crossovers before and a spin after.

 

[sk8in]

starting at 3:55 she goes from spiral, turns her skate on one foot, changes of edge twice---you know in an appreciable way that Adelina appears to be incapable of, jumps off the ice twice---once turning 360 degrees from her left then again from her right, throws her left leg up, then throws her opposite leg up spinning down, then does a sort of two foot twizzle, glides back, then does two cross overs as she's continuing the choreography through her torso. This starts at 3:55, and she is jumping into the axle at 4:10---meaning she does it all in 15 seconds to the rhythm of the hammering piano keys. It counts towards the entrance in her jump.

And yes the choreographic moves in the torso do count.

Choreography and footwork transitions are not the same thing, no matter how many times you insist Adelina's handful of footwork moves count as such. Going back to the track metaphor it is difficult to compose yourself and project a performance to the audience while engaged in intense vascular activity. That is why it counts for something. Where as Adelina broke her performance and was struggling to get jump points, and turned that last moments of her skate into a weird generic exhibition of spirals and such---Yuna interpreted every moment of her skate.

http://youtu.be/hgXKJvTVW9g?t=3m55s