Andrew Torgashev

[el henry]

I am also worried, I hope he did not wear himself out competing at Nats so soon after injury. But 4CC is such a great opportunity for him, that he feels well.

(Also I don't watch very well in real time when it is my faves, I completely understand. The heart beats too fast to enjoy )

 

[Tav]

Well, happy he has a bye to the next Nationals, at least!

 

[noskates]

Even though the result probably wasn't what Andrew was hoping for, I think this competition did wonders for his confidence and I think that will be obvious in his next skate.

 

[skatingfan4ever]

I have a lot of thoughts. Andrew's free skate was not too bad, all things considered. He had much lower tech content than the others in the final group, but he fought so hard. The jumps he landed were so gorgeous. I love his jumps now, and they don't make me as nervous as they used to (say, on the JGP). It looks like he planned to do only one 3A. I wonder why he didn't do the 3A+2A at this competition?

Do you think maybe the quad attempt messed with his head for the Axel? In the SP he knew he was taking the quad out and he did a glorious 3A. At SA he missed the quad in the FS and did two nice 3As afterward, however. Ditto in the SA SP, where the 3A was his only successful jump.

The 3Lz+2A epitomizes the whole skate for me, and it showed a side of Andrew I've never seen before. It's like he said to himself, "I am NOT letting this program go. I will land my jumps and do my combos." He is becoming a mentally tough skater; I can see the progress. He was such a fighter here and fought for EVERYTHING!

His SA FS had better jumps, but the rest of the program was much better at Nationals, in my opinion! His delivery of the choreography was much better! I loved his commitment to every step and every moment! The footwork, the basic skating, and the spins were to die for! He gave the program his all, even though he missed some jumps. I enjoyed the program very much indeed. At SA he did the jumps but the rest of the program was a little flat (by his standards), but here it didn't fall flat for me.

I am proud of Andrew for competing at Nationals, doing a clean and beautiful short program, and showing his fighting spirit in the free skate! TOP FIVE FINISH!!! (If Jimmy Ma had scored any more points in the SP, though, Andrew would have been 6th). I wish him good health and stamina at 4CC, for sure. It's such a quick turnaround, especially given his recent injury.

Andrew and Max have a nice little rivalry going. Last year Andrew was 3rd and Max was 4th; this year Max was 4th and Andrew was 5th. I wonder who will finish higher at 4CC. My head says Max, but I wonder how he will handle the turnaround as well, and in my heart I'd like Andrew to place as high as possible.

 

[skatingfan4ever]

I just discovered this on YouTube. Jackie Wong and Gracie Gold were commentating the mens practice before the LP and discussed highlights from the SP. One of Jackie's is "Andrew Torgashev's footwork sequence." Then Gracie says that he has great knees and his quality of skating is really good and she's always been a fan.

Then, even better, Jackie says, "We're just literally watching him do crossover drills right now, of patterns across the ice, and it's like, to your point of knees, he's digging down into those knees."

Gracie then says she loves the sounds that his skating makes and that it's harder to hear in a program and in competition, but "even as he was skating by, just the sounds that his crossovers [made], finished with kind of a wally, it just is that beautiful skating sound that I love so much."
Conversation - https://youtu.be/1QnwlCjGTiA?t=2823

Andrew's Runthrough - https://youtu.be/1QnwlCjGTiA?t=3735
Some skipped parts, but the runthrough had some better jumps than the competition, unfortunately. His jumps look encouraging, overall. I have no idea if the quad (toe or sal) can become consistent, but clearly he wants to put it in. Injuries are so inconvenient. Gracie and Jackie thought he could have been scored higher in the SP. "The world of judging is sometimes difficult." And Jackie mentioned how precise his skating is. They like the air guitar moment. And, a couple weeks ago Andrew wasn't sure he was going to come to Nationals; I'm glad he could make it and skate relatively well.

There's other skate nerd stuff in the video, and an interview with Jason Brown.

 

[el henry]

Andrew's IG story shows him at the airport on his way to 4CC!

 

[Absurda]

The 3Lz+2A epitomizes the whole skate for me, and it showed a side of Andrew I've never seen before. It's like he said to himself, "I am NOT letting this program go. I will land my jumps and do my combos." He is becoming a mentally tough skater; I can see the progress. He was such a fighter here and fought for EVERYTHING!

This 3Lz+2A won him the top five

I have registered to write this

And certainly he skates like he was born with blades. It's magically

Sorry for my unsure English

 

[el henry]

This 3Lz+2A won him the top five

I have registered to write this

And certainly he skates like he was born with blades. It's magically

Sorry for my unsure English

Welcome Absurda, always glad to have another Andrew fan join the Fan Fest! You are right, his blades are magic.

Please post as often as you want to, your English is fine.

 

[Absurda]

Welcome Absurda, always glad to have another Andrew fan join the Fan Fest! You are right, his blades are magic.

Please post as often as you want to, your English is fine.

Thank you so much!

 

[Absurda]

Let's reminisce! Here are Andrew's programs at 2023 Worlds, with no commentary, full replays and full K&C.

Thanks for these videos

A little translation practice

After SP in K&C Rafael said
"You haven't competited for so many years. So of course you were shaking... You are training. All will be ok"

After FS in K&C
Andrew: "It’s the first time I’ve seen so many people come to watch figure skating"
Rafael: "I'm used to it.... And you get used to it... All will be ok"

I'm touched by this

 

[skatingfan4ever]

Yesterday I wrote here that "Andrew's free skate was not too bad, all things considered." As a very big fan who devours all his performances in detail and has listened to his interviews and learned his skating history, I can easily see the subtle differences between performances and recognize the progress he is making. I still am so moved by his Nationals free skate, for all the reasons I already said. I like looking for the positive in general, especially in a Fan Fest.

Today, though, I realized that if you're not a super fan who knows what Andrew has been through all throughout his career, it's very easy to look at that program and say, "Oh, that was terrible." He landed only a 3Lo, a 3F, and a 3Lz+3T. That's it. If you're not into Andrew's music or movement or style and he's not jumping well, the choreographic intention and passion can escape you. I am someone who watches for choreographic details with all skaters, so it jumps out to me if a skater skates with choreographic intention. I know other fans may not be like me.

I don't care about Andrew getting medals. He can finish wherever and we'd still love his skating. However, medals/high placements bring you a higher chance of getting future international assignments. If the non-Ilia quadsters besides Andrew suddenly become more consistent (Camden, Max, Tomoki, Jimmy, the up-and-comers from juniors), Andrew could easily get left behind. I don't care about Andrew's placements, exactly, but I do hope he can get future assignments (and be uninjuried and able to skate at them). I hope last year/this year won't be his two seasons of opportunity and then he doesn't get any more internationals because the U.S. quadsters all pass him by. The thing about enjoying a skater even if they don't medal is that you have to see them skate; they have to be in the competition.

Take Deniss Vasiljevs; no quad consistency, other jumps can be so-so, but he has very pleasing skating and spins. He has been able to be on the circuit for YEARS skating with the same tech content because Latvia can send him wherever they want since he's their only male singles skater. (The European skaters can do Challengers much more easily to begin with, but that's a whole other topic). Andrew's triples, in fact, seem much more reliable than Deniss's, but due to injuries and representing the U.S., Andrew's competition opportunities have been so few compared to Deniss.

I wouldn't want Andrew to be a Deniss and be the only top skater in a country, but it has its perks. Skaters representing weaker feds can compete a lot, provided they get the tech mins.

Andrew may do very well at 4CC and surprise everyone (that's my secret wish!), but I am suddenly so nervous about his future, even if he says healthy. Again, not because of medals or even the Olympics, but because I want him to get to do more international competitions. The only reason he got SA was as a host pick and he was our bronze medalist and went to Worlds. Now Camden is the bronze medalist going to Worlds. By the way, Camden has been able to skate much more often than Andrew and it hasn't gone great for the most part. If only Andrew could skate poorly at as many GPs as Camden has. I have nothing against Camden or any other US Men, to be clear. I'm just feeling frustrated that Andrew is seemingly "so far behind" if other skaters get their acts together. He's been rather unlucky in his career with injuries, although no one is more unlucky than Joshua Farris. I want to cry just thinking about Josh's career. Last year at Nationals and Challenge Cup Andrew got so lucky; this year his fabulous Nationals SP kept him up there (and Lombardia and SA allowed him to get 4CC).

And no, I don't care if Andrew gets consistent quads or not, except that he wouldn't be at such an obvious disadvantage if he did.

I guess you could call this post a cry for help! Sorry it is so long. Calm me down, please!!! Is it as bleak as I'm imagining? Thanks so much for listening.

 

[skatingfan4ever]

I am a lot calmer now, just from typing that all out. It is Andrew's career, not ours. Sean Rabbitt made it to so many Nationals and had to do Sectionals every single year. But he kept doing it (with no quad and no triple axel). If Andrew so desires and his body will let him, he could keep skating. If he wants to move on, he will. No matter what happens, I am so grateful to witness Andrew's skating in any amount.

Okay, I'm done being dramatic, I think. Here's hoping Andrew has no travel difficulties on his way to 4CC!

 

[el henry]

I completely understand @skatingfan4ever . Andrew's skating is so sublime, that of course we his fans would be content just seeing that complex and beautiful skating. The name of the game is points, and at this time, four revolution jumps garner points.

Without going too much into comparisons, but just dwelling on Andrew's wonderfulness, his quads are fine. When he lands them. And frankly, when he is healthy, he lands them as much as any other American man, save one. I would love for Andrew to be more consistent. But he is not competing for spots with models of consistency (and I say this with love. I have one obvious fave other than Andrew among the American men, but I do appreciate all the American men).

So interesting that you should bring up Sean Rabbitt. I loved watching Sean skate. Such a showman! (and I loved seeing him at the Boards, he seems like such an encouraging coach) Yet Andrew already has more international assignments that Sean had.

Andrew just needs to stay healthy to start making a consistent mark. Please skating gods please

 

[skatingfan4ever]

Question - Did Raf actually alter Andrew's jump technique? It looks like his landing posture and takeoffs are so much better now. But honestly I haven't gone back to look at Andrew's old jumps lately. I seem to remember that on the JGP he would collapse more on his landings. I am so impressed by his precise takeoffs and height and posture now, but how much of that is a recent development? Has he always had that and just needed more practice time and a better mentality?

People often say so-and-so should go to Raf for jump help. Well, Andrew did go to Raf and his jumps seem much better. But is it because of Raf helping with his technique, or not? Just curious.

 

[el henry]

I have not done a side by side jump comparison, and I am not technical enough to answer that question. It is an interesting one.

The constant "send them to Raf" for any skater with jumping issues is rather perplexing to me. Raf is not a guru with the answers to every jumping problem in the world. He does not have a secret technique that makes every skater better, stronger, faster. I don't see Adam Rippon (whose skating I loved) with world medals or held up as an example for his great jumping technique

That said, I think I have read that Andrew feels he has been helped, and that is all that matters. If the skater believes in their coach, that could be half the battle. So for Andrew, go Raf and I hope that whatever they do, works.

 

[skatingfan4ever]

I have not done a side by side jump comparison, and I am not technical enough to answer that question. It is an interesting one.

The constant "send them to Raf" for any skater with jumping issues is rather perplexing to me. Raf is not a guru with the answers to every jumping problem in the world. He does not have a secret technique that makes every skater better, stronger, faster. I don't see Adam Rippon (whose skating I loved) with world medals or held up as an example for his great jumping technique

That said, I think I have read that Andrew feels he has been helped, and that is all that matters. If the skater believes in their coach, that could be half the battle. So for Andrew, go Raf and I hope that whatever they do, works.

I also have little technical knowledge. I was so impressed when Andrew landed a 2A from a standstill with no speed. He had to completely reset and figure out how to even take off. He could have decided, "Oh well," and moved on, but instead he decided, "I'm going to do a 2A." It shows that he was being present, and wasn't checked out because of the mistakes. Not to mention having good enough technique to do a 2A from a standstill. I'm not a skater, so all I know is that from the position/situation Andrew was in, it looked like it would be difficult to do a 2A, and he did it. And it was the last jump of the long program, at the end of a "taxing week," while coming off an injury. Wow.

I'm fairly sure it's not easy to do, because Ashley said, "How did he do that?!" Adam responded, "I don't know how he did that, but he is fighting all the way through this program." Then when it came up in the replays, Ashley said, "This 3Lz+2A, he fought, fought, fought. How he did this, I will never ever ever know. That took so much strength, but that also highlights how trained he is, even with that injury. He wants it. That was such a good fight." I think Tara said, "Good for him, he corrected himself," and Johnny mumbled about him trying to get every point he can. So, all the former-skater commentators were impressed with it. "How did he do that?!" is my favorite line of commentary from his FS.

 

[Flying Feijoa]

I have not done a side by side jump comparison, and I am not technical enough to answer that question. It is an interesting one.

The constant "send them to Raf" for any skater with jumping issues is rather perplexing to me. Raf is not a guru with the answers to every jumping problem in the world. He does not have a secret technique that makes every skater better, stronger, faster. I don't see Adam Rippon (whose skating I loved) with world medals or held up as an example for his great jumping technique

That said, I think I have read that Andrew feels he has been helped, and that is all that matters. If the skater believes in their coach, that could be half the battle. So for Andrew, go Raf and I hope that whatever they do, works.

Hello, I'll just come out of lurking here to answer this question: Raf helps with consistency. Adam, Ashley, Michal Brezina, Mariah Bell and others were all experiencing a mid-career doldrum of sorts when they went to him. They then went on to experience a second wind as mature/late-stage skaters (a.k.a. Skating Uncles/Aunties). Jeff Buttle might count too as he got additional coaching from Raf after struggling with injury/inconsistency, and ended up as World Champion at the relatively ripe age of 25 with more modest but cleanly landed jump content than his rivals. Skaters' natural skillsets differ depend on individual physique, age, training history etc. - it's more informative to compare 2018 Adam (last/peak season) with 2012 Adam (just prior to coaching switch), not 2018 Nathan and not young fresh 2008 Adam either.

I agree Raf doesn't have a secret technique. I'm not an elite-level skater but it just looks like good old basic technique to me (supported by this interview with Michal a while ago: https://www.tulup.ru/news/699/michal_brezina_interview_english/ ). It sounds like Raf prefers more traditional technique (e.g. salchows without putting the free leg down) which you see with Nathan Chen, but for the skaters who come to him later in their careers it will also depend on what works best for them/what they're used to. Some aspects of his jump technique (e.g. low arms during jump rotation for Nathan) are Soviet, but old-school Soviet: not that different from old-school American, and in stark contrast to certain schools in modern Russia which basically to select the most promising youngsters with a particular body type and more or less drill them into being consistent by rote repetition with an 'anything goes' approach to technique. Guess how many mature/post-injury comeback skaters we see from that camp...

Before I hide away again, @skatingfan4ever hello fellow Josh Farris & Patrick Chan fan! I've followed Andrew since his JGP days and it's nice to see him winning new fans almost a decade later. As Jason is still holding his own in a field of quadsters with even less jump content, I'm not worried about Andrew's prospects as long as he stays healthy. There is room in every generation for a Gooey Knees Team Representative

 

[gsk8]

 

[skatingfan4ever]

WELL DONE, ANDREW!!! ANOTHER CLEAN SP!!! This one has the benefit of a mostly silent commentator. Peacock has the ISU stream, with the British commentator named Chris (I think?). He's silent expect to name the jumps, but after the program he is full of praise for Andrew. Andrew is in 8th place with an 81.15. The free skate has more jumps to get through, but we'll see how it goes. I so love this short program; it deserves more in PCS but oh well.

8th is about where I hope he'll end up after the free skate. It's best-case scenario, IMO. We'll see if he can stay in the Top 10, despite all the quads other skaters are attempting. Oh, and he's the top American right now, with Tomoki in 10th and Max in 15th. He was absolutely sublime!

 

[el henry]

Andrew did Andrew things, and on such a quick turnaround and little sleep, he still slayed.

This is such a great program for him, I almost hope he keeps it (he has repeated programs in the past). I'm almost liking the song. Almost.

As long as Andrew skates to it.