How do i convince my mom to let me get new skates?

[tstop4me]

okay! also thank you by the way to ic3rabbit, you’ve helped me and other beginners out so much

I also have a comment on pricing (total pricing), but I want to hear what Ic3 says first. Please be patient.

 

[reader3]

Are you parents hesitant to buy new boots because of the cost? If that's so, maybe you can come up with ways to help. Here are some ideas:

1. Offer to sell your old skates (find out what they're going for in your area by checking where other people sell skates).
2. Offer to sell something else you have that you don't necessarily need.
3. Find small jobs you can do either for your parents or other family members. Things like babysitting, cleaning, washing the car or other kinds of chores that save them money.

I've tried to suggest things that work for pre-teens and teens. If you're 16 or older, you would have more options for ways to contribute to the cost of new skates. Hope you get your dream skates!

Well said @sk8dreamzzzz.

 

[Ic3Rabbit]

Update: went to the skate shop!! she's an experienced coach and she told me that the freestyle Jackson's would be good for me, she measured my feet and apparently one of my feet is a 7.5 and the other is a 7! this was so embarrassing my parents laughed at me the way home, she recommended jackson freestyles, it that okay for my age and weight? it is a boot blade combo but she said my feet are wide and best for Jacksons.. I just don't want them to break down quick or my mom will yell at me for getting new skates again

Oh, good. Don't make any purchase until @Ic3Rabbit weighs in.

No. Don't buy the skates she suggested, they aren't going to be stiff enough for you and for your level.
She may be "an experienced coach" but that doesn't mean she knows what boots you definitely need. I'm actually terrified of what she suggested for you so I'm glad you didn't buy them. I'm also concerned with how your foot was measured. Did she trace your feet while you were standing still?

In a Jackson, you are at least Premiere Fusion or Synergy Elite. That is the lowest you can go with your needs and height/weight, and skating level.
You'll need a traditional intermediate level blade to go with those: MK Pro or JW Coronation Ace.

 

[sonitaskates!]

No. Don't buy the skates she suggested, they aren't going to be stiff enough for you and for your level.
She may be "an experienced coach" but that doesn't mean she knows what boots you definitely need. I'm actually terrified of what she suggested for you so I'm glad you didn't buy them. I'm also concerned with how your foot was measured. Did she trace your feet while you were standing still?

In a Jackson, you are at least Premiere Fusion or Synergy Elite. That is the lowest you can go with your needs and height/weight, and skating level.
You'll need a traditional intermediate level blade to go with those: MK Pro or JW Coronation Ace.

no, she had his jackson brand size measurement thingy where u slide ur heel to the back, she also measured my width and found that i’m a wide in jackson’s, the freestyles are built so differently then artistes, i was so confused because the artistes were too wide for my feet but the freestyles were too narrow, but i tried primiere and i didn’t like the way it felt , i’ll look for thesynergy elite, thank you so much!

 

[Ic3Rabbit]

no, she had his jackson brand size measurement thingy where u slide ur heel to the back, she also measured my width and found that i’m a wide in jackson’s, the freestyles are built so differently then artistes, i was so confused because the artistes were too wide for my feet but the freestyles were too narrow, but i tried primiere and i didn’t like the way it felt , i’ll look for thesynergy elite, thank you so much!

Yeah, don't like the way you were measured. Look for Risport RF3 Pro.

 

[sonitaskates!]

Yeah, don't like the way you were measured. Look for Risport RF3 Pro.

sorry for asking but i wanted to ask what size i should buy for skates (i’ll redo measurements for risport), but the lady told me one foot is 7.5 the other is 7, should i get a size 7.5 then? my feet grow really really quickly and i don’t want them pressing tightly against the boot really quickly, but then a size 8 would mean one foot is a whole size above

 

[tstop4me]

sorry for asking but i wanted to ask what size i should buy for skates (i’ll redo measurements for risport), but the lady told me one foot is 7.5 the other is 7, should i get a size 7.5 then? my feet grow really really quickly and i don’t want them pressing tightly against the boot really quickly, but then a size 8 would mean one foot is a whole size above

Looks like you're in a tricky scenario. All the more reason it's imperative for you to find a competent and experienced fitter and tech. Otherwise you could end up with a painful and costly mess. The person at the shop should have gone over options with you. The fact that she didn't is a red flag. I'll send you a DM later for follow-up discussion. I need additional details from you.

 

[Ic3Rabbit]

sorry for asking but i wanted to ask what size i should buy for skates (i’ll redo measurements for risport), but the lady told me one foot is 7.5 the other is 7, should i get a size 7.5 then? my feet grow really really quickly and i don’t want them pressing tightly against the boot really quickly, but then a size 8 would mean one foot is a whole size above

I'm going to send you info on a different shop in your area. I looked all around and you don't have great choices for fitters there. I even looked in Edmonton and nothing. The closest pro figure skating fitter that I would be most comfortable with would be Spokane Washington USA, but that's a plane ride or a 7 hour drive for you and I know that probably won't happen with all the convincing you already have to do with your parents.

I will DM you.

 

[SmallAminal]

Just here to say that buying "online" isn't always the $ saving move that you think it will be.
You still need to have your blades mounted (they may/may not charge you extra for this online) and there are often adjustments that need to be made to the blade mounting after the initial temp mount. Also, if you are looking at a heat moldable boot, you will need to see a skate tech locally who can do that for you and so you'll have to pay again for that (whereas its included when you buy the skates). Also, if you need adjustments OR something goes wrong, a local retailer may be better positioned to help you than an online retailer. There is quite a lot of value in having a bricks and mortar store that will support you as boots often need multiple adjustments or troubleshooting. Just something to keep in mind before you assume that you are saving $200 by buying online.

 

[tstop4me]

nope! said i was going to come back to the store but i was just going to purchase online since it’s 200$ cheaper (sorry to the kind lady!) they didn’t have my size in width anyways so she said she’ll have to order it online anyways

I also have a comment on pricing (total pricing), but I want to hear what Ic3 says first. Please be patient.

* That pricing differential is a bit bizarre. I'm in the US, not Canada, so pricing may work differently there. Perhaps other Canadian members in this forum will pitch in with their experiences of purchasing skating equipment in Canada.

* I checked the Canadian website of Jackson Ultima. The list price for the women's Freestyle FS2190, complete with Aspire XP blades, is Can$439.95. I checked 6 Canadian online sites (some charge shipping, some don't; I've not adjusted for shipping). Four are selling them at or close to list price. One has a holiday sale for Can$351.86. Amazon CA does not sell them directly, but various marketplace sellers on that site sell them for rip-off prices. The sellers and prices vary with size. For size 7R, the asking price is Can$1,180.51; for size 7W, the asking price is Can$935.15.

* So what price is the store that you just went to asking? And what price did you find online?

* In the US, for higher-end figure skating equipment (not your department, sporting goods, or discount store variety), you typically do not save money by buying online. Online retailers typically all charge list prices. If there is a significantly lower price on a particular item, then it's typically (1) a discontinued item that the retailer wants to clear out (either the manufacturer has discontinued the item, or the retailer no longer wants to carry the item), (2) an overstocked item that the retailer wants to reduce inventory on, or (3) a limited-time special sale (e.g., holiday, anniversary, or grand opening). There are always odd exceptions, of course: e.g., there once was a large US online seller called Kinzie's (now out of business); it charged list for most boots and blades, but had on-going discounted prices for Paramount blades.

* In the US, most full-time shops (see further discussion below) purchase from wholesalers at discounted prices and sell to end customers at list prices; that's how they can make a profit. But the total price you pay will typically be much less if you buy from a shop than if you buy the equipment online. If you buy the equipment from a shop, the following services are typically included: initial consultation and fitting, heat molding of the boots, additional adjustments of the boots (e.g., stretching and punching out), sharpening of the blades, mounting of the blades, and re-positioning and re-alignment of the blades. If you buy the boots and blades online (or from a distant shop), and have these services done by a local tech, you will have to pay. And the costs can add up rapidly. E.g., the shop that you visited did not charge you for initial consultation and fitting even though you did not buy from her (but maybe this is a prime example of you get what you pay for). The guy I go to charges US$85 for a 90 min appointment. This fee is waived if you buy from him. As another example, first-time sharpening on a new pair of blades you buy from him is free; US$29 otherwise. So before you decide to buy online, check what local service charges are.

* In the US, there are some shops that will charge service fees in addition to list price. But the service fees for equipment you buy from them are typically discounted from regular à la carte service fees. I also know some coaches who sell equipment part time. Often they don't do enough business to get a wholesale discount, so they buy retail and mark it up to make a profit.

ETA: I just saw that SmallAnimal posted while I was typing. So there is some redundancy in my post.

 

[sonitaskates!]

Just here to say that buying "online" isn't always the $ saving move that you think it will be.
You still need to have your blades mounted (they may/may not charge you extra for this online) and there are often adjustments that need to be made to the blade mounting after the initial temp mount. Also, if you are looking at a heat moldable boot, you will need to see a skate tech locally who can do that for you and so you'll have to pay again for that (whereas its included when you buy the skates). Also, if you need adjustments OR something goes wrong, a local retailer may be better positioned to help you than an online retailer. There is quite a lot of value in having a bricks and mortar store that will support you as boots often need multiple adjustments or troubleshooting. Just something to keep in mind before you assume that you are saving $200 by buying online.

that’s true! the website i was planning on mounts and sharpens the blades for you as well, but the skate shop we went to was 30 minutes away and my parents do not want to go back again so i’m really in a weird situation

 

[tstop4me]

that’s true! the website i was planning on mounts and sharpens the blades for you as well, but the skate shop we went to was 30 minutes away and my parents do not want to go back again so i’m really in a weird situation

I wouldn't go that route. One bad sharpening can wreck a pair of blades for good. Especially if you upgrade to a separate better blade, ask coaches and other skaters for recommendations on good sharpeners [ETA: specific individuals, not just specific shops]. Also, an online seller will simply moujnt the blades in a nominal default position. They can't examine you for pronation/supination or other foot issues. And what will you do for adjustments (if needed) and installation of the "permanent mount" screws?

 

[sonitaskates!]

* That pricing differential is a bit bizarre. I'm in the US, not Canada, so pricing may work differently there. Perhaps other Canadian members in this forum will pitch in with their experiences of purchasing skating equipment in Canada.

* I checked the Canadian website of Jackson Ultima. The list price for the women's Freestyle FS2190, complete with Aspire XP blades, is Can$439.95. I checked 6 Canadian online sites (some charge shipping, some don't; I've not adjusted for shipping). Four are selling them at or close to list price. One has a holiday sale for Can$351.86. Amazon CA does not sell them directly, but various marketplace sellers on that site sell them for rip-off prices. The sellers and prices vary with size. For size 7R, the asking price is Can$1,180.51; for size 7W, the asking price is Can$935.15.

* So what price is the store that you just went to asking? And what price did you find online?

* In the US, for higher-end figure skating equipment (not your department, sporting goods, or discount store variety), you typically do not save money by buying online. Online retailers typically all charge list prices. If there is a significantly lower price on a particular item, then it's typically (1) a discontinued item that the retailer wants to clear out (either the manufacturer has discontinued the item, or the retailer no longer wants to carry the item), (2) an overstocked item that the retailer wants to reduce inventory on, or (3) a limited-time special sale (e.g., holiday, anniversary, or grand opening). There are always odd exceptions, of course: e.g., there once was a large US online seller called Kinzie's (now out of business); it charged list for most boots and blades, but had on-going discounted prices for Paramount blades.

* In the US, most full-time shops (see further discussion below) purchase from wholesalers at discounted prices and sell to end customers at list prices; that's how they can make a profit. But the total price you pay will typically be much less if you buy from a shop than if you buy the equipment online. If you buy the equipment from a shop, the following services are typically included: initial consultation and fitting, heat molding of the boots, additional adjustments of the boots (e.g., stretching and punching out), sharpening of the blades, mounting of the blades, and re-positioning and re-alignment of the blades. If you buy the boots and blades online (or from a distant shop), and have these services done by a local tech, you will have to pay. And the costs can add up rapidly. E.g., the shop that you visited did not charge you for initial consultation and fitting even though you did not buy from her (but maybe this is a prime example of you get what you pay for). The guy I go to charges US$85 for a 90 min appointment. This fee is waived if you buy from him. As another example, first-time sharpening on a new pair of blades you buy from him is free; US$29 otherwise. So before you decide to buy online, check what local service charges are.

* In the US, there are some shops that will charge service fees in addition to list price. But the service fees for equipment you buy from them are typically discounted from regular à la carte service fees. I also know some coaches who sell equipment part time. Often they don't do enough business to get a wholesale discount, so they buy retail and mark it up to make a profit.

ETA: I just saw that SmallAnimal posted while I was typing. So there is some redundancy in my post.

hi hi! okay there’s a lot to cover here, so basically when we went there she said the skates were 595$ CAD, and she showed the box, there’s a website called figureskatungboutique which has a sale right now and they are 351 CAD with free shipping, im sure that’s the one you saw, I was thinking about alignment and things but if it came with a boot and blade combo i doubt she would align then again for me and she seemed pretty set on giving me a freestyle and not a seperate boot, she totally sold my parents on it because she said for my level i’m okay with a boot blade combo and she said we are saving a lot of money by just getting the combo, my parents immediately heard that and thought that i was trying to manipulate them earlier by getting better boots then i actually needed. she said “come back when you have your axel” for new boots, I told my parents i didn’t want to buy or order anything now because i don’t want to make any rash decisions, all this research on skates is making my head reel , but i also know it’s very important to get the right options and skates. The skateshop online does mount and sharpen the boot and blade if you buy them, about heat molding, there’s a ton of localskating shops inside of arenas in my area but they are all mainly directed for hockey players, is the heat molding process for hockey skates and figure skates alike or do they need different treatment?

 

[sonitaskates!]

I wouldn't go that route. One bad sharpening can wreck a pair of blades for good. Especially if you upgrade to a separate better blade, ask coaches and other skaters for recommendations on good sharpeners. Also, an online seller will simply moujnt the blades in a nominal default position. They can't examine you for pronation/supination or other foot issues. And what will you do for adjustments (if needed) and installation of the "permanent mount" screws?

i totally understand that, after a hockey player ruined my blades im scared to get them sharpened too, everyone i know also got their skates sharpened at the same place inside of the rink including coaches, but the day i needed mine sharpened it was a younger teen hockey player and i don’t think he knew a lot about figure skates, i don’t have any foot issues or past health issues in my feet except the now known problem of two different sizes. I honestly have no idea what i’ll do for adjustments, right now i’m thinking of just buying the boot and blade online without mounting them nor sharpening them and taking them to the lady at the figure skating store so she can adjust and align them for me as well as sharpen them, but then i also need to convince my parents to buy the boot and blade seperate because right now they think i have no idea what i’m talking about the store owner knows a lot more

 

[Ic3Rabbit]

hi hi! okay there’s a lot to cover here, so basically when we went there she said the skates were 595$ CAD, and she showed the box, there’s a website called figureskatungboutique which has a sale right now and they are 351 CAD with free shipping, im sure that’s the one you saw, I was thinking about alignment and things but if it came with a boot and blade combo i doubt she would align then again for me and she seemed pretty set on giving me a freestyle and not a seperate boot, she totally sold my parents on it because she said for my level i’m okay with a boot blade combo and she said we are saving a lot of money by just getting the combo, my parents immediately heard that and thought that i was trying to manipulate them earlier by getting better boots then i actually needed. she said “come back when you have your axel” for new boots, I told my parents i didn’t want to buy or order anything now because i don’t want to make any rash decisions, all this research on skates is making my head reel , but i also know it’s very important to get the right options and skates. The skateshop online does mount and sharpen the boot and blade if you buy them, about heat molding, there’s a ton of localskating shops inside of arenas in my area but they are all mainly directed for hockey players, is the heat molding process for hockey skates and figure skates alike or do they need different treatment?

You don't want a hockey shop. That is one big thing you definitely need to know.

 

[Query]

nope! said i was going to come back to the store but i was just going to purchase online since it’s 200$ cheaper (sorry to the kind lady!) they didn’t have my size in width anyways so she said she’ll have to order it online anyways

Yes - but stores, if they know what they are doing, can be very helpful. If you need to have the blades mounted or moved, or heat molded. They usually do an initial sharpening. They often do those at no extra charge if you order through them, and might even help on final mods, like customized insoles (that varies). And they may help you deal with the boot maker if there is a fit or other problem with the boots or blades - which happens moderately often. You might have trouble judging whether they are defective yourself.

It's very tempting to order boots from a discount mail order place. But this may be one place it makes sense to go to a good full service store with expert skate techs and pay full price.

 

[tstop4me]

hi hi! okay there’s a lot to cover here, so basically when we went there she said the skates were 595$ CAD, and she showed the box, there’s a website called figureskatungboutique which has a sale right now and they are 351 CAD with free shipping, im sure that’s the one you saw, I was thinking about alignment and things but if it came with a boot and blade combo i doubt she would align then again for me and she seemed pretty set on giving me a freestyle and not a seperate boot, she totally sold my parents on it because she said for my level i’m okay with a boot blade combo and she said we are saving a lot of money by just getting the combo, my parents immediately heard that and thought that i was trying to manipulate them earlier by getting better boots then i actually needed. she said “come back when you have your axel” for new boots, I told my parents i didn’t want to buy or order anything now because i don’t want to make any rash decisions, all this research on skates is making my head reel , but i also know it’s very important to get the right options and skates. The skateshop online does mount and sharpen the boot and blade if you buy them, about heat molding, there’s a ton of localskating shops inside of arenas in my area but they are all mainly directed for hockey players, is the heat molding process for hockey skates and figure skates alike or do they need different treatment?

OK. So looks like the shop you went to operates like some US shops: she marks up the prices over list. And yes, the online holiday sale you saw is the same one I saw.

Heat molding process varies with the particular boots, even for different figure skating boots (e.g., Jackson vs Risport vs Edea vs. ...). Just as one bad sharpening can wreck a pair of blades, one bad heat molding can turn a pair of boots into literal toast.

 

[tstop4me]

i don’t have any foot issues or past health issues in my feet except the now known problem of two different sizes. I honestly have no idea what i’ll do for adjustments, right now i’m thinking of just buying the boot and blade online without mounting them nor sharpening them and taking them to the lady at the figure skating store so she can adjust and align them for me as well as sharpen them, but then i also need to convince my parents to buy the boot and blade seperate because right now they think i have no idea what i’m talking about the store owner knows a lot more

* Time to hit pause. Buying the right figure skating equipment is unfortunately complicated and expensive. That's why there are so many posts here concerning equipment.

* Again, compare the total price (boots plus blades plus services) between different sellers (whether in a shop or online). Even at your local shop, ask the lady what she charges for services if you bought the boots and blades elsewhere; and ask her what she charges for the boots and blades and ask her what services are included if you were to buy the boots and blades from her. Then do the math.

* But even if there is a cost savings via the online route, remember the benefits of establishing a good relationship with a local competent seller; particularly, if you intend to stick with this sport for a while. [Though unfortunately the range of "local" will vary a lot depending on where you are.]

* Above all, ask around for who's good at specific tasks. E.g., one shop near me is owned and run by a guy who was an ex-competitive and ex-pro figure skater; now a coach. He knows figure skating, is knowledgeable about boots and blades, and is a good fitter. But his sharpening is mediocre.

* Right now you are in Artistes, a relatively soft recreational boot that is not closely form-fitted; it's also a bit too large; and you've just been starting out. So everything probably feels comfy and you don't feel you have any foot issues that need special attention. If you move to a more advanced boot however, all that will change. It will be stiffer and more closely form-fitted. Any mismatches between your feet and boots will become more apparent. And as you advance in your skills, working on deeper edges, spins, and jumps, proper positioning and alignment of the blades become more important.

 

[Ic3Rabbit]

i totally understand that, after a hockey player ruined my blades im scared to get them sharpened too, everyone i know also got their skates sharpened at the same place inside of the rink including coaches, but the day i needed mine sharpened it was a younger teen hockey player and i don’t think he knew a lot about figure skates, i don’t have any foot issues or past health issues in my feet except the now known problem of two different sizes. I honestly have no idea what i’ll do for adjustments, right now i’m thinking of just buying the boot and blade online without mounting them nor sharpening them and taking them to the lady at the figure skating store so she can adjust and align them for me as well as sharpen them, but then i also need to convince my parents to buy the boot and blade seperate because right now they think i have no idea what i’m talking about the store owner knows a lot more

Please check in with the other fitter I told you about in your area. See what they can do with you. The lady you went to is not only going to sell you a boot set that's not stiff enough for you, which means you could get injured and also need boots even sooner. And she's marking them way up according to others here. Just don't do it.

 

[DizzyFrenchie]

Sorry for entering a conversation where I can bring no technical competence, and for my poor English.
Sonitaskates!, one thing that might convince your parents that people on this thread are not trying to make you overspend, is what they're used to write in this same subject, and to make a statistic of it. I wouldn't be surprised if 90% of their answers were against overbooting, not underbooting, for instance with skating learners who don't jump doubles yet, are rather light and would like to buy EDEA Ice Fly, when it's not outright Piano. Also, they don't have any preferred brand in general, professing that each skater has their own best brand depending on the shape of their feet, their pronation/supination tendency etc.
Maybe, if your parents see how strongly they advise against overbooting, they may understand that regarding your choice of boots and blades, you may have been advised rather an underbooting by the shop salesperson, then they will be more likely to put the right figure on the cost of safe Figure Skating for you at your level and think about it, and discuss the matter with you on realistic bases (which may include a rather long trip to find a good shop/fitter).