ISU proposed figure skating changes

[Jontor]

I don't see the difference between a jumpless "artistic program" and solo dance, and that already exists as a separate event. I seldom watch the singles events because there are too many jumps and they have no connection to the music playing in the background. While it wouldn't bring any new fans, I sometimes think I'd rather see a no-music "compulsory jumps" segment similar to the former compulsory figures, and then reduce the number of jumps permitted in the free skate. As it is, all but a few top skaters have to spend too much time just setting up jumps with little time left to interpret the music except for a few random arm gestures stuck in here and there between jumps.

Well, you are the opposite of me then, I guess. I never watch Ice dance as I find it totally uninteresting, I'm afraid.

I agree, that there are too many jumps as it is right now in singles skating. Men's competitions are a mess, with boring skating setting up quads, and then they succeed...or not.

But I do think jumps are necessary to make the sport interesting. There is still room to adjust the program layouts as they are now. One or two lesser jump passes would increase the possibility of artistic skating a lot, and the difference between tech and artistic will be smaller.

I wouldn't watch a non-music jump competition either. For me, the beauty of the sport is to do difficult stuff beautifully, and the music is part of that.

 

[CaroLiza_fan]

No, there was only one until the 1970s, just before my years, when the short program was added. The pairs event was always contested first, our boast being that we gave the fans something interesting to watch while the others slogged away at compulsory figures and set pattern dances before getting to their free programs. (Their short programs were added later than ours, so for a while each discipline just had two parts, and then dance and singles became three each. Pairs never had more than two parts, and just one originally.)

Thank you for the confirmation.

I like the quip about the Pairs providing something interesting for the fans. They certainly are, regardless of whether or not the Singles Skaters and Ice Dancers were doing the less audience engaging segments.

Thank you again



CaroLiza_fan

 

[throw_triple_flip]

If the two free programs idea is serious that really shows how out of touch the ISU is with the financial realities that many skaters face.

 

[Diana Delafield]

Thank you for the confirmation.

I like the quip about the Pairs providing something interesting for the fans. They certainly are, regardless of whether or not the Singles Skaters and Ice Dancers were doing the less audience engaging segments.

Thank you again



CaroLiza_fan

You're welcome. I see I made a typo -- the short program for pairs began in the 1960s. It was first skated in the Olympics in 1968. I first got into competition as a Novice about 10 years later and the two-program schedule was established by then.

 

[Tutto]

I can't help feeling sad. Granted not all the proposals are likely to go ahead but some will and it seems like the end of our beloved sport.
One positive is the ISU must have realised that something to be done, but unfortunately, most of what proposed is as many said just outrageous. They will not bring new fans in and will sure lose some or all of the old guard.
The some very important issues are not addressed:

• Music rights
• Funding (especially of small federations)
• TV coverage

I agree there is less and less artistry in programs. But instead of making such drastic changes they could rebalance things by some small and effective changes.
For example, they could reduce a number of jumps in both segments. Bring a choreo sequence in SP and make some elements like a spiral a point earning element that will fill in the time of jumps taken out.
The pairs FS in particular I think have too many compulsory elements now there is hardly any space for choreo, it has to be addressed. Programs without jumps is a ridiculous prospect. I practically never watch galas because there are few jumps.
Most of all I hope there will be some consultations with the skaters, coaches & federations BEFORE the Revolution/Destruction will be allowed to go ahead.
What if we here are put our proposals together and petition it to the ISU?

 

[Isk]

Hm... Read in Maia's blog that ISU's main source of income is actually investment. So, rule changes, half-full vs half-empty stadiums, necessity to organize and manage competitions and sell steam rights sounds like some bothersome activity that doesn't pay but that they have to keep doing, and ISU congresses is a way to compensate, e.g. have some fun and socialize while doing it, so, yes, it has to be expensive.

 

[Isk]

If the two free programs idea is serious that really shows how out of touch the ISU is with the financial realities that many skaters face.

They already tried it: in the GPF in 1999-2002 skaters had to do two different FPs. The result was that skaters reused FPs from past seasons.

 

[flakyy]

To my own surprise I very much enjoyed the jumping competition RusFed produced. It was interesting to watch, clear, quick results and not boring at all. Very well presented. The quality contributed to the overall impression, especially men landed a lot of difficult moves with the choreography out of the way. I think it would be a good idea to get rid of the short and replace it with something like that. The free could loose one (or maybe 2) jumping passes and replace it with room for an intricate step sequence ... and more emphasis of pirouettes going along with the music etc. The the problem "he/she only jumps and the music is playing in the background and he/she still gets good PCS" could be solved to some degree (?).

 

[Anna K.]

Actually, it would be interesting to know what the ISU - or, the committee within the ISU that developed this list - actually want. What's the goal of these proposed changes? What do they aim to achieve?

Better viewer figures? It will differ from country to country anyway. There are many inner factors that decide the popularity of a sport within the scope of other sports locally.
Wider participation? Same.
Are there any problems felt by the entire trade of figure skating worldwide? Are athletes complaining about something? Or, maybe, coaches? Officials? TV producers? (Complaining of fans doesn't count; fans always complain.) Well, whatever problems have been there and whatever measures might be proposed, the ISU consists of national federations that will vote to decide what they want or not - and that's about it. In fact, the entire rule change may boil down to 2-3 little tweaks in the end

 

[Mathman]

In fact, the entire rule change may boil down to 2-3 little tweaks in the end

I would say that there have been only three major changes in figure skating throughout its history.

In the 1860s Jackson Haines (a ballet master) introduced "fancy skating" (continental style skating), including skating to music. He also came up with the notion of a blade that screws permanently into the boot.

In the 1930s Sonja Henie was credited with establishing the equation Figure Skating = Pretty Girls in Short Skirts, which dominated the sport for six decades. (Hey, don't laugh -- she won ten world championships and three Olympic Gold Medals and she died with $US 50 million in the bank.)

Then in the 1980s the powers that be (led by Sonia Bianchetti) decided that in the television age, what was wrong with figure skating was... figures. TV viewers had 0 interest in watching a parade of contestants tracing out big, slow circles.

Since then -- small potatoes. The IJS? In my opinion this did not have much effect on the sport except to identify, isolate and quantify certain positive and negative factors that have always been there.

 

[Mathman]

Hm... Read in Maia's blog that ISU's main source of income is actually investment.

This is certainly true, and is quite undisguised in their required annual financial disclosure documents.

No surprise there -- money makes money faster than people make money.

Still, the ISU does produce a product, and one that they take a certain amount of pride in.

 

[Mathman]

To my own surprise I very much enjoyed the jumping competition RusFed produced. It was interesting to watch, clear, quick results and not boring at all. Very well presented. The quality contributed to the overall impression, especially men landed a lot of difficult moves with the choreography out of the way. I think it would be a good idea to get rid of the short and replace it with something like that...

Different strokes for different folks, I guess. For me, I do not welcome the trend in figure skating to become more and more like skateboarding, aerial skiing, doing tricks on bicycles, etc. (Although I have to admit that I think trapeze is a cool sport, and also trampoline ).

To me, it is the "balanced program" concept that sets figure skating apart. Doing a quad Lutz -- OK. Working a quad Lutz into satisfying choreography, mixing it up with a variety of spins, steps and turns, hitting it on the beat of the music -- WOW!

 

[Anna K.]

So, the Latvian Public TV did it again. The journalist provoked our source into spilling the beans during the live commentary.

The journalist, voice tone implying that it must be something unimportant: ...but there probably will be some minor rule changes next season, so...
The Source, interrupts: No, there will be major changes! There will be one jump less in the free program and only two spins will have the base value. The third spin will be a choreographic spin with a fixed point value for whatever you do, like in choreographic elements in ice dance, where only quality will be judged.

Good job, TV guy!

To illustrate what "a choreographic element where only quality will be judged" means: that's how Smart/Dieck ramped up their free dance score. In FD, there are three do-what-you-want choreographic elements with same 1.10 BV. The total amount of quality GOE earned for these three elements in Dune program was (in Olys) 8.66. So, instead of 3.60 BV they got the total of 12.26 points for these three elements.
There are no do-what-you-want choreographic elements in RD, so their RD score remains modest.

 

[DancingCactus]

This actually sounds promising. Hope it will turn out to be true.

 

[Senseo]

Is there any remote possibility that the six-jump rule will be removed? I know many federations didn't want it, and in fact the technical committee imposed it. It remains to be seen whether they'll propose revoking it. I'm in favor of seven jumps in the freestyle, and I'm also in favor of more program time rather than less.

 

[saine]

Is there any remote possibility that the six-jump rule will be removed? I know many federations didn't want it, and in fact the technical committee imposed it. It remains to be seen whether they'll propose revoking it. I'm in favor of seven jumps in the freestyle, and I'm also in favor of more program time rather than less.

I doubt it. I know there's hope that they'll remove it like they removed the qualifying rounds that had previously passed. But they aren't going to backtrack on it after they got the federations to agree to them coming into force after the Olympic season.

 

[4everchan]

6 jumping passes and a choreographic spins sound good to me... We will see if that gives enough time for skaters to include more choreography and diversity.

 

[Tutto]

6 jumping passes and a choreographic spins sound good to me... We will see if that gives enough time for skaters to include more choreography and diversity.

I think it might be a step in a right direction. I still am hoping that one day the spirals may become ‘money’ earning elements and we could enjoy once again the beauty of properly executed ones, not done in a hurry like now.

 

[Blades of Passion]

6 jumping passes is bad, especially if the +2Axel sequences continue to be overvalued and they reduce to 2 jump combinations, as was originally proposed. Every woman's jump layout will be:

3Lutz+3Toe
3Flip+2Axel+2Axel
3Lutz
3Flip
3Loop
3Sal
(the only variation will be if someone repeats the 3Loop instead of the Lutz or Flip. Or if you have a 3Axel, then it means you're entirely cutting the Salchow from your training)

On the Men's side, they will stop training an entire jump type, likely 2 entire jump types. For example, this would be a typical jump layout in the Men's event:

4Lutz
4Toe+3Toe
4Sal
4Toe
3Axel+2Axel+2Axel
3Axel

No point in training a Flip or Loop anymore, unless you're able to do a Quad version, in which case you're then likely cutting the Lutz or Salchow jump out of your training, unless you're going for ALL the quads like Malinin.
----
The biggest problem and waste of time within programs are the footwork sequence rules. They go on far too long and fail to capture the music and create the magic that footwork sequences used to create, because of the stupidly restrictive and monotonous requirements.

The second biggest problem are the spins - they should ALL be "choreographic spins". This rule adjustment of the last spin being less restrictive will help a little, but not enough, particularly since it will always be 100% predictable that everyone's last spin of the program will be this element. Making the choreography predictable is not helpful.

 

[soccerjc77]

That AIN athlete can continue their season and go to the 2026 world championship.