K. Chen and B. Tennell selected for Worlds

Amei

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 11, 2013
Well yeah, there have always been rumors that the relative clout of different coaches figure into these decisions, and I can't help but wonder if there is anything to that. I also think it is unfair. I actually wouldn't have been surprised to see Mariah named, as she seems to do well with International judges. Amber is the only one of the three that actually rotates her jumps, something the international judges seem to be really cracking down on. (UR's). As lovely as Karen's skating is, there is no difference in her technical arsenal now as in the past four years, and I don't see the results being any different. I would ask the USFSA to practice transparency, and release their decision making process. They owe that to Amber and for that matter-Mariah.

See ice coverage's post below:

Three events from the 2020-21 season are on the list of USFS selection criteria for 2021 Worlds:
- 2021 Nats​
- 2020 GPs (in other words, Skate America)​
- 2020 ISP Points Challenge​
Amber was ahead of Karen in two of the three.

But ... 2020 Four Continents and 2020 Nats also are selection criteria, and Karen was ahead for those.

My heart was with Amber, but Karen is a reasonable choice.
If Karen can place fourth thru tenth at Worlds, she will earn Team A, Tier 2 funding from USFS for the 2021-22 season. I wish that Amber could have the same opportunity. As the U.S. silver medalist (and first alternate for Worlds), Amber has earned Team B, Tier 1 funding for next season.
 

apgold

Record Breaker
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Jan 10, 2014
Country
United-States
I can see why Karen was chosen due to her body of work. Amber is awesome but this is the first time she skated a clean free skate in a long time. If she had more consistency, I think she would have been chosen. I would like to see Karen have more difficulty in her free skate, she doesn't have a triple triple currently.

Of course, there is a 50/50 chance that Worlds will not happen anyway, so they might not even get the chance to go.
 

Amei

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 11, 2013
I can see why Karen was chosen due to her body of work. Amber is awesome but this is the first time she skated a clean free skate in a long time. If she had more consistency, I think she would have been chosen. I would like to see Karen have more difficulty in her free skate, she doesn't have a triple triple currently.

Of course, there is a 50/50 chance that Worlds will not happen anyway, so they might not even get the chance to go.

Well the Fed sent a message that its better to have a consistent level of mid-range success in the lower end of the top 10 with easy elements vs. increasing your technical difficulty.
 

Mathman

Record Breaker
Joined
Jun 21, 2003
Well the Fed sent a message that its better to have a consistent level of mid-range success in the lower end of the top 10 with easy elements vs. increasing your technical difficulty.
I don't really think that the USFSA is all that much into sending messages. You get so many points for a triple flip, so many points for a flying camel, so many points for musical interprettion. Add them up. It is what it is.
 

Skater Boy

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 24, 2012
this is a strategic choice. Understandable. Obvious Bradie but Karen has the experience, the reputation and the best chance to earn three spots with Bradie whereas Amber even if she skates well is not likely to place as high even with a triple axel. Karen on the other hand if skates well Top four is not impossible. Even if Amber did the 3A and was clean she woudl be hard pressed to get top 6.
 

NAOTMAA

Medalist
Joined
Nov 9, 2014
It's not totally out of the realm of possibility to think that Bradie and Karen could get the 3 spots back. A clean Bradie could potentially place 5th (outside of Rika the other Japanese ladies are not consistent and who knows who the 3rd Russian lady is) and if Karen keeps improving (as she did from SA to nationals) I could easily see her 8th. 5+8=13 :shrug:
 

readernick

Medalist
Joined
Dec 5, 2015
Excellent decision and I’m not surprised at all. It’s exactly what I would have done had I been the one making the call. Glenn wouldn’t have been a bad choice, either, but the thing is...she could score 190....or 170. 3A or no, she’s not a top 10 skater. ...yet. She also has a tendency to implode under pressure. And there would be a lot of pressure on her to help get that third spot and she has very little international experience. Chen would at least keep her head about her and get in the top 10 even with UR calls. She just needs to be clean and she’s definitely more likely to do that than Glenn.
What is your belief that Amber couldn't score more than 190 based on? Her international SP score is already higher than Karen's and she scored 190 at 4CC with two pops and a fall. I don't see why she wouldn't score higher if clean. If fact, she definitely would. Higher than Karen because internationally her PCS isn't lower and she rotates jumps. With a 3A she would be looking at 215+. I think the only argument for her not being chosen is that the fed believes she will totally fall apart under the pressure. Which might be true? Who knows?
 

alexocfp

Final Flight
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Nov 28, 2020
Country
United-States
Look at that. The fed actually not going with Bell. That would have sent a bad message to the others.

I‘m OK with this. Was willing to concede last night that if it wasn’t Amber, Karen would be the next best thing.

And I’m not going to criticize the decision if it all goes pear-shaped either. Because this shows the other skaters that results matter and they to can be in the running for a call up if they skate better down the line.
 

Jetta

Rinkside
Joined
Sep 13, 2018
While I am sad for Mariah, I do think USFS made the right choice. Amber unfortunately does not have the consistency to warrant being given the second spot.
 

amc987

On the Ice
Joined
Feb 12, 2012
This seems like a bogus choice. I agree with others: Karen hasn't improved significantly since last quad. Her international results have been middling since then, and her UR issues may limit her technical score. Amber placed ahead of Karen at Nationals, has been trying to add the 3A, and has generally made great strides. Her improvement/potential should've been rewarded with a Worlds spot, especially the year before Beijing.

The US seems very unlikely to get 3 spots back regardless of who they send. Shcherbakova, 2 of Kostornaia/Trusova/Tuktamysheva, Kihira, and Sakamoto probably all place ahead of Tennell, even if she's perfect. Miyahara may, too.
 

moonvine

Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 14, 2007
This seems like a bogus choice. I agree with others: Karen hasn't improved significantly since last quad. Her international results have been middling since then, and her UR issues may limit her technical score. Amber placed ahead of Karen at Nationals, has been trying to add the 3A, and has generally made great strides. Her improvement/potential should've been rewarded with a Worlds spot, especially the year before Beijing.

The US seems very unlikely to get 3 spots back regardless of who they send. Shcherbakova, 2 of Kostornaia/Trusova/Tuktamysheva, Kihira, and Sakamoto probably all place ahead of Tennell, even if she's perfect. Miyahara may, too.
This is what Phillip Hersh has to say about it if anyone is interested. https://twitter.com/olyphil/status/1350492162400641024?s=21
 

Skater Boy

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 24, 2012
See ice coverage's post below:
I am sure this was a tough decision. Amber did so well and has potential but she has geat potential to falter too or not be accepted as much as Karen or Mariah.

I am sure USFA really were thinking three spots and as much as it woudl be nice to give Amber experience the best shot or relative shot at three spots is to go with Karen and Bradie or even Mariah. Amber just isn't as accepted by the international judging world and I think the uSFA is still worried about her consistency - yes Karen and Mariah for that matter have thier issue but a few mistakes in the sp and you will see Amber struggling to make the cut for the fs.

I agree transparency would be nice but good luck.
 

Gabby30

On the Ice
Joined
Aug 8, 2019
I thought they would take Mariah over Karen. This is the only thing that should be talked about. Amber has no business at worlds, she doesn't have any kind of reputation or international results. But i doubt worlds are gonna happen anyway, so lets move on :shrug:
 

kirauza343

On the Ice
Joined
Oct 1, 2020
I think if Amber had been 2nd by a larger margin the fed would’ve had no problem sending her, but with her and Karen being virtually tied (less than half a point apart!) it makes sense to consider other factors. In fact I wouldn’t be surprised if it came down to Skate America’s results (the only other live competition they’ve had) where Karen scored significantly higher as the determining factor instead of Karen’s general reputation/past results. Amber still would’ve been a good pick to go to Worlds (after all she DID come in second at Nationals and beat all of the American ladies except Bradie), but this outcome is also good and understandable.

I do appreciate that they went based on Nationals results and rewarded Karen and Amber for doing so well. They could’ve easily found a way to justify sending Mariah based off her past record, but it would’ve sent a bad message to the rest of their skaters. Nationals is an important competition and ignoring how it went and sending a skater that cracked under the pressure and ended up fifth instead of one of the two eligible ladies who finished significantly ahead of her would’ve told skaters that Nationals doesn’t matter, they’re just going to pick their favorites anyway.
 

slider11

Medalist
Joined
Jan 12, 2014
Tough one. Arguement to send Karen, Amber or Mariah. But I think I agree with Karen as the best chance for a high enough placement to at least guarantee two spots and hopefully earn three for the Olympics.
 

Smith16

Rinkside
Joined
May 30, 2016
Given the unusual circumstances of this season why doesn't the USFS not hold another mini skate off between Karen, Amber and Mariah and then announce the worlds team? It's not like they should be in a rush considering we don't even know if worlds is going to even happen. People keep saying "what's the point of holding nationals then if you're just going host another competition to decide the worlds team"? If going by that argument then the world's team should have been Bradie and Amber who placed first and second and not Bradie and Karen who placed first and third.
 
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Amei

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 11, 2013
Given the unusual circumstances of this season why doesn't the USFS not hold another mini skate off between Karen, Amber and Mariah and then announce the worlds team? It's not like they should be in a rush considering we don't even know if worlds is going to even happen. People keep saying "what's the point of holding nationals then if you're just going host another competition to decide the worlds team"? If going by that argument then the world's team should have been Bradie and Amber who placed first and second and not Bradie and Karen who placed first and third.

What would happen if at this skate-off they all 3 skate clean and are within a few points of each other who do you go with then? IMO they opened Pandora's box by not going with results of Nationals.

I still think the Fed should have given the nod to Amber not only because she placed second but because of the 3 of the ladies, she's the one that has worked to increase her technical difficulty, by adding the triple axel to her SP, and the US ladies outside of Glenn and Liu are still performing technical programs that were competitive 15 years ago with a Worlds or Olympics podium.
 

Smith16

Rinkside
Joined
May 30, 2016
What would happen if at this skate-off they all 3 skate clean and are within a few points of each other who do you go with then? IMO they opened Pandora's box by not going with results of Nationals.

I still think the Fed should have given the nod to Amber not only because she placed second but because of the 3 of the ladies, she's the one that has worked to increase her technical difficulty, by adding the triple axel to her SP, and the US ladies outside of Glenn and Liu are still performing technical programs that were competitive 15 years ago with a Worlds or Olympics podium.
Who ever win the hypothetical skate off is the one who gets the second spot.
 
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