Ladies LP | Page 6 | Golden Skate

Ladies LP

Did the judges tell you this?
No, it's just a pattern that's emerging. For example, I don't think that Mirai all of a sudden started flutzing at Nationals and at junior Worlds.


Those are your opinions and mine are different. Vahaama is a true lyrical skater where the audience is drawn to her. She doesn't sell her tricks to rouse the audience, and yes under the CoP Vahaama will have a more difficult time to win a medal because tricks count more.
Those are my opinions and the opinions of the European and junior World judges, who scored Jenni lower in PCS than Caroline in separate and in the same competition. And this wasn't even Caroline's best in terms of presentation. Caroline's best PCS scores came in the short program at Skate America and in the free skate at the GPF. I've seen Jenni's programs in several competitions this year and while she is enjoyable to watch, I wouldn't say that she is any more of a lyrical skater than Caroline. I do prefer Jenni's skating over Laura Lepisto's, for example.
 
The American girls are prodigies, but many skaters (like our reigning Olympic champion, for example) take longer to season and develop.

Shizuka was an unusual case in many ways.

She went to college and her focus wasn't completely on her skating during her college years. She may have already had the jumps, but hadn't devoted huge amounts of time to practice. She also needed the right coaching to find the key to success, and didn't get that until the 2003-2004 season, when she won Worlds. She struggled with consistency in the 2004-2005 season, and was still struggling all the way up to the Olympics, where she faced only an ill and weary Slutskaya, and a reportedly injured and less-than-confident Cohen.
 
I am sure the technical specialists generally (must) do a good job. Everybody from the ISU can control them with the help of the super slow motion.
I just wish we could see the slomo as well. It would keep me quiet.

Joe

About Jenni - I would give her another year in Juniors to win it with a complete arsenal of jumps followed by an Oly win, if eligible or definitely a Senior Worlds win. We have our new Kwan and she's from Finland.

Come to think of it, it was Poykio who started the ball rolling in Finland - not Drei.
 
I just wish we could see the slomo as well. It would keep me quiet.

Joe

About Jenni - I would give her another year in Juniors to win it with a complete arsenal of jumps followed by an Oly win, if eligible or definitely a Senior Worlds win. We have our new Kwan and she's from Finland.

Come to think of it, it was Poykio who started the ball rolling in Finland - not Drei.

I just watched some videos of Jenni's skating and I think you are overhyping her. She seem's a bit gangly and comparing her to Michelle Kwan is laughable. Kwan had the full arsenal of jumps by the age of 14 and Jenni does not.
 
I just watched some videos of Jenni's skating and I think you are overhyping her. She seem's a bit gangly and comparing her to Michelle Kwan is laughable. Kwan had the full arsenal of jumps by the age of 14 and Jenni does not.

Kwan finished 4th at SENIOR Worlds when she was 14, and when she was Jenni's age, she won the World Championship.

Jenni is indeed a lovely skater, and she has the potential to do great things---once she has a full arsenal of jumps and can land them consistently.
 
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http://www.chicagotribune.com/sport...ng-world-juniors,1,4705173.story#comment-form

BTW, I saw a quote from Caroline who indicated that she appeared to be working on a 3A; I can't for the life of me wonder why she would undertake that before Junior Worlds. Her comment was that she was skating with two hematomas which could have impeded her speed and jumps.

Are you talking about the article that is up on Icenetwork? In that article it is Flatt who is quoted as saying she is putting the 3 Axel in her program next season. Zhang was quoted that she will be working on her jumps but not the triple Axel.
 
I had heard that Rachael was working on 3F+3L, but a 3A? That is news!

I thought she should work on upping the levels of her non-jump elements so that most of them would be L4, but if she can actually land a consistent 3A, that would give her a big edge.

When she moves up to Senior next season, she should get a slight PCS boost, especially if she continues to perform so cleanly and consistently. Another 5-6 points per competition in the PCS would make her very competitive, and a consistent 3A would make her formidable.
 
Hematomas?! Hematomas are serious, serious brain hemorrhages! Are you sure it isn't something else?

Hematomas are not just brain hemorrhages. The word refers to any collection of blood, such as a bruise. I think she had some serious bruising, that's all.
 
Jenni is indeed a lovely skater, and she has the potential to do great things---once she has a full arsenal of jumps and can land them consistently.

Jenni has landed ALL the triples in competition. She had to take the lutz out of her program because of her injury. She's inconsistent, but she does have the five non axel triples.
 
Kwan finished 4th at SENIOR Worlds when she was 14, and when she was Jenni's age, she won the World Championship.

Jenni is indeed a lovely skater, and she has the potential to do great things---once she has a full arsenal of jumps and can land them consistently.

And Kwan should of won silver or bronze
 
What an amazing year for the youngster, I have not been that excited since the Sasha/Michelle era and I am already looking forward to next season!

I have been a fan of Mirai since I saw her programs last year and her short programs have been great this year but it is a pity that she looked a bit tired/tentative during almost all long programs, in my opinion the best showing of "Copelia" was in Lake Placid were she actually attacked the program!
Her jumps have great height, her flow is amazing and I just hope she will work hard on her ur and landings.I do think she has a posture that remains me a little about Kwan..Good for her landing the 3Lz+3T a couple of times too.

Rachel's skating has grown a lot and I am so impressed with her jumps and smooth landings and she always seems to have fun out there and is already quite polished.She defiently sell her programs!I guess the "underdog" position has been valuable this year but it looks like she really has nerves of steel.Count me in as a fan!

Caroline and Jenni are also fantastic skaters and it has been so much fun following the ups and downs of Caroline.She has learned a lot and I think that she is the real "fighter" of the girls!
She has something more now than just the "wow" factor she had last year and I think she is the one that have developed the most along with Rachel.
I hope that she will seriously on her (F) Lutz, I am sure she will be able to fix it even if it will take time and hopefully it will be there polished going into the Olympic season.

Jenni has shown that she has the "wow" factor of the European ladies and to bad that she has been bothered by a injury.She had along with Mirai some really good "early" skates such as her progarms at "Finlandia Trophy".I love her presentation, one of the best of there and the Europeans next year may be exciting for the first time in ages!Good for her, attempting a 3x3 too..

Just my thoughts, now good luck to Mao,Yuna and the others ladies, I will be there rooring for them in Gotenbourg:clap:
 
Jenni has landed ALL the triples in competition. She had to take the lutz out of her program because of her injury. She's inconsistent, but she does have the five non axel triples.

It's one thing to 'have' all the triples and land them one time or another in competition, and quite another to land them consistently.

Mao has all the triples, including the 3A, but she doesn't do the salchow, and the triple toe is a rarity. She lands loop, lutz, and flip very consistently, and the 3A fairly consistently. However, she does have a pretty bad flutz.

Yu Na lands lutz, flip, salchow and toe very consistently. The loop is still a work in progress. She neither flutzes nor lips.

Carolina Kostner is generally inconsistent. She can land all the triples except the 3A, but she is capable of popping any and all of them at any given competition. Her 2A is a problem for her, and the lutz can be, but to a lesser extent. She neither flutzes nor lips.

Kimmie Meissner used to land all her triples except the 3A consistently, but has had major problems with lutz and flip this season. She says her problems are mental, and maybe the coaching change will help. Kimmie lips.

Yukari Nakano has all the triples including the 3A, and she is quite consistent with all of her jumps. She doesn't generate high PCS scores, though, perhaps because of a major wrap. She does not flutz or lip.

Joannie Rochette can land all the triples except the 3A. She lands her jumps consistently, but it's been a rarity for her to put together two clean performances in one competition. She does not flutz or lip.

Of the Junior ladies, Rachael Flatt is the most consistent. She has skated 3 clean competitions in a row---JGPF, Nationals and Jr. Worlds. She sometimes flutzes, but of her 12 lutzes this season, she's gotten only two flutz calls.
 
I finally watched Rachael's and Caroline's LPs, and it's no surprise coming from me, but I think Caroline wuz robbed. :p

Caroline's jumps here were the best I've ever seen them, and if she was a little short on the loop, it wasn't significantly noticeable. Her loop certainly looked more suspect in the SP, and it wasn't downgraded there. I felt the artistic element was a little missing in this performance, and in this regard I think Rachael was better (which is why it's puzzling that Caroline had higher PCS!). Rachael looked freer out there, whereas Caroline seemed more business-like, but I gotta say, there's no way that Rachael should ever get +GOE on any of her non-jump elements such as spins and spirals. She's very, very slow in her spins and the positions she hits are far from being in the same league as Caroline's and Mirai's. That donut spin she did ad nauseum was pretty ugh to watch.

Certainly, if some of CZ's jumps looked suspect, then so did RF's, although I'm not expert enough to say for sure. Overall, I'd say Rachael was better artistically, with Caroline being a little further ahead technically because of her vastly superior spins and spirals. I didn't notice much difference in either one's speed, too.

If anything, it sure did seem like Tarasova agreed with me. ;) I'd love to know precisely what her comments were, but she sounded very excited when CZ was on...not so much when it was Rachael's turn.

Off to download Mirai's LP.
 
I was not able to watch the competition :mad: but I've read reports that Caroline was a "low jumper". That might explain the alledged underrotations. Maybe jumping low creates some kind of illusion that she touches down before fully rotating.
 
Andalusia, I too am biased, so it comes as no shock that I disagree with you. I do agree that Rachael was better as far as presentation because nothing looked labored and she didn't look like she was thinking through every single element. I think that's what turns me off Caroline's artistry, I don't think it's there. She's graceful and very balletic, she can move beautifully I must admit. However, she pretty much just go from one move to the other and it seems like she isn't even listening to the music. It's just there and she's staying on beat, but she seems to just have her mind on how she's gonna do her next element. Someone mentioned earlier that they were surprised that the girls were basically the same height and that to me says alot about the way they move. During alot of Caroline's program, she seemed so frail and small, and almost forcing her jumps. Rachael's jumps on the other hand look practically effortless and the way she moves her entire body to the music is divine to me. Rachael is not everyone's cup of tea and she most certianly has her flaws, but I really think she was earned that title. Did they have the same amount of jumps?

I do however really, really love that it comes down to preference. I love that we have such variety with our young skaters. I'm not into little ballerina skaters, but within just the top four skaters we have such potential for great deverse champions. How exciting!
 
Mirai's LP
Go to minute 3:20 and have a look at her layback-spin - she practically stepped out of it! I don't understand how the spins are evaluated, there are so many examples where a spin was really badly executed, shaky (Takahashi and Ando come to my mind, who have a knack for messing up the last spins in their programs) or travelled all over the place.

Why are there no deductions for spins with obvious mistakes? Granted, Mirai got only 0,14 GOE for it, but do they calculate like this: oh, beautiful position, well-centered - oops, now she nearly fell, let's not give her the usual +2,00 GOE.

But isn't that wrong? If you do a beautifully rotated, high Quad toe and fall on it - you still get -3GOE, it doesn't matter how beautiful it looked in the air. If you step out off your beautiful Quad toe you get -2GOE. And then it just doesn't matter how beautiful the jump, how great the technique, how difficult your entrance - if you fall they deduct -3 points, if you step out they deduct -2 points. Because despite all the beauty and difficulty - the major basic technique, in this case landing the jump on one foot, wasn't there.

Shouldn't it be the same for spins? Yes, before the step-out it was beautiful - but one of the major elements of a spin - balance, control - was obviously missing towards the end, why not deduct points?

I have nothing against Mirai, and it's not the first time I noticed that. But it's such a great example - I couldn't believe they didn't deduct anything for it.
 
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