Lysacek Ventures into Fashion

[janetfan]

You Think?? Hello? When was the last time Evan landed a clean quad in a competition? Can you recall?

Hello - Can you read?
I said Evan's '07 LP from Natls would be hard to beat based on what I have seen this season.
You might be right that we don't have to go back to Yags - but any fair minded person can see Evan's '07 Natls LP is close to a perfect CoP/CoR program.

 

[Blades of Passion]

Since he has everything a competitor skater would want.

Will he meet the girl of his dreams?

The amateur skating World is missing him.

Thanks for the comedy everyone!

 

[dorispulaski]

a world championship, a national championship, and a Olympic gold medal? What more could a competitor skater want?

Not much, IMO, at least until he gets older and discovers life is not all skating.

 

[#1Kerryfan]

I think he is trying lots of things - he tried DWTS, he's thinking about acting, he did interviews for DWTS and now this. He's probably weighing in all his options because his life pretty much revolved around skating for the past ten years or so.
True, I have been missing him this season, but he has almost all the titles so I can see why he wants to get on with his life.
Personally, I really hope he doesn't go into fashion..... never been big on guys who go into design careers (fashion, cosmetology, art, etc).

 

[seniorita]

The dress does look a little heavy but, to me, it still looks very good and beautiful. Some real fashion designer's products are worse. So I think it's very impressive for Lysacek's debute.

Sure it is impressive, it is just not my type of dress, it sort of reminded me of a christmas tree. But they chose a real dimensions model instead of a skinny one and kudos for that. Actually my first impression of the image was that Vera Wang needs eating, and being next to Evan iwho is all shiny and bright looks even worse.

 

[Violet Bliss]

I think he is trying lots of things - he tried DWTS, he's thinking about acting, he did interviews for DWTS and now this.

None of these is really a career, just cashing in his current celebrity status with the OGM. You need real training and some talent to make a career. Celebrities put their names on fashions, perfumes, etc. which is good for as long as their popularity lasts, usually via continuation of their real career, e.g. being a movie star. The real value of Evan's OGM is still in skating which offers related opportunites when he stops competing. A different career is fine but he needs real ability in it.

Both Lysacek and Weir seem to be trying to have a career as public personalities. Unlike Weir, who is a natural in attracting attention, Lysacek doesn't have a wide appealing charisma. In their rivalry, celebrities circuit is not an advantageous arena for Evan, at least not in the long run.

 

[evangeline]

I did see that program and agree it was awesome. My favorite of the year and miles ahead of anything I have seen from Dai or Patrick this season.......

But Evan did not two foot his quad - and also did it in combination. Big points for that which unfortunately would boost his pcs under CoP scoring :sheesh:

And remember the CoP is the same as CoR - code of reputation.

I think Evan would win this season if he showed his '07 Natls LP.

You are unfortunately right (hence the reason why I said "if the judging was fair").

If the competition was held today and Lysacek and Kozuka had the same skates, I'd imagine that Lysacek will get 8s in SS and TR while Kozuka will get 7s, like at the Olympics. Lysacek will probably also get positive GOEs for those obviously superior 3As as well.

If the judging was fair or at the very least CONSISTENT, Kozuka should win out over Lysacek on the basis of his superior SS and TR, as well as the quality of his spins and jumps. But like that's ever going to happen

 

[Mathman]

Celebrities put their names on fashions, perfumes, etc....

Do you remember "Katia" perfume and the "Katia Sports" line of body washes and the like? They were sold via a deal with Target stores in the U.S. and were quite popular for a while.

 

[janetfan]

You are unfortunately right (hence the reason why I said "if the judging was fair").

If the competition was held today and Lysacek and Kozuka had the same skates, I'd imagine that Lysacek will get 8s in SS and TR while Kozuka will get 7s, like at the Olympics. Lysacek will probably also get positive GOEs for those obviously superior 3As as well.

If the judging was fair or at the very least CONSISTENT, Kozuka should win out over Lysacek on the basis of his superior SS and TR, as well as the quality of his spins and jumps. But like that's ever going to happen

Fair enough - and even if we both don't like it - reputation is really powerful in the IJS. More so than in 6.0 IMO.

I really did like Kozuka's LP from TEB. To be fair, it was more of a "workmanlike" skate than a great artistic skate - but actually since it is "Men's skating" he showed every quality I could hope for.

Not so sure with - or without "reputation" Kozuka's spins would beat Evan - and although it is not popular, Evan has better P/E. Make that "CoP" P/E.

The thing I don't like about the CoP at times (OK many times ) is that I see a "quantity over quality" factor too often.

Do I like Evan's choreo and IN? Really not so much - but he buries a skater like Johnny under this system just by being busier. Evan clearly outperforms Kozuka - who still comes off as a little shy.

Does that bother me - yes it does - and I like subtlety more than the obvious most of the time.
But I am not a judge - if I was I would have placed Dai first in Vancouver because his skating seemed the best to me.

One fall - on a quad in the LP I can live with. This nonsense with Patric (potentially the greatest skater in the world if he stops falling so MANY TIMES) is something I don;t get.

I like him - but won't give him gold or silver with so many splats.

 

[evangeline]

Fair enough - and even if we both don't like it - reputation is really powerful in the IJS. More so than in 6.0 IMO.

I disagree.

I think reputation is equally powerful in both CoP and 6.0, but reputation scoring is more obvious in CoP than 6.0. CoP breaks everything down so you can clearly see exactly where the absurdities in judging are--e.g. certain skaters receiving high 7s or 8s in transitions despite hardly having any. It is possible (and very easy) for us to find these inflated scores and point and laugh.

Whereas in 6.0, the scoring is much more opaque--so Surya Bonaly received some 5.8s and 5.9s for presentation. Maybe those judges prioritize pizzazz and spunk over actual choreography, or maybe they're scoring her based on reputation. Who knows.

 

[janetfan]

I disagree.

I think reputation is equally powerful in both CoP and 6.0, but reputation scoring is more obvious in CoP than 6.0. CoP breaks everything down so you can clearly see exactly where the absurdities in judging are--e.g. certain skaters receiving high 7s or 8s in transitions despite hardly having any. It is possible (and very easy) for us to find these inflated scores and point and laugh.

Whereas in 6.0, the scoring is much more opaque--so Surya Bonaly received some 5.8s and 5.9s for presentation. Maybe those judges prioritize pizzazz and spunk over actual choreography, or maybe they're scoring her based on reputation. Who knows.

Yea, but atleast in 6.0 we saw the presentation score right away - and we saw how each judge scored the skaters.

A most hilarious line from "Joesitz" on a different thread said something like "no wonder CoP judges want to to remain anonymous."

I didn't comment - but did LMAO at that remark.

gkelly, a wonderful poster, if not a bit of a "preacher" claims CoP is more transparent.
Sorry, I believe that statement is simply not true. Sure, if I want to go look up stuff a few days later I can see how the pure "subjectivity" of the score was reached.

Personally I belive it is "hogwash" to argue about "TR."
Chan winning with four splats because of SS or TR feels like hogwash to me if he falls down four times.

I value the effect of the program as a whole.
There is no mark and can never be a mark in the CoP for some of the uniquely beautiful skating of Chen-Lu.

If you ever saw her Live it was even more pronounced than what we can get from YouTube (understatement).

Even Mishin, Mr Tech" said you can't measure certain special qualities with the IJS. Sometimes a judge just has to say "that was magical, that was better, I am giving it 1st place.

The CoP fans don't seem to get that. In fact the CoP makes it worse IMO.
Yuna showed something magical in Vancouver.

What a shame fans argued over whether she was overscored rather than just saying "wow!!"

I dunno - I like when gkelly points out flaws in my arguments - and sometimes I learn from what she says.

But somewhere deep down - I don't see skating - I mean really great skating - as a matter of points.
The best skating - the skating that blends technique and art in a special and unique way is far, far above anything the CoP can judge or score.

 

[Blades of Passion]

a world championship, a national championship, and a Olympic gold medal? What more could a competitor skater want?

To be known as one of the greatest skaters ever?

Of course, I'm sure in his head he already thinks that.

 

[Olympia]

I value the effect of the program as a whole.
There is no mark and can never be a mark in the CoP for some of the uniquely beautiful skating of Chen-Lu.

If you ever saw her Live it was even more pronounced than what we can get from YouTube (understatement).

Even Mishin, Mr Tech" said you can't measure certain special qualities with the IJS. Sometimes a judge just has to say "that was magical, that was better, I am giving it 1st place.

The CoP fans don't seem to get that. In fact the CoP makes it worse IMO.
Yuna showed something magical in Vancouver.

What a shame fans argued over whether she was overscored rather than just saying "wow!!"

I dunno - I like when gkelly points out flaws in my arguments - and sometimes I learn from what she says.

But somewhere deep down - I don't see skating - I mean really great skating - as a matter of points.
The best skating - the skating that blends technique and art in a special and unique way is far, far above anything the CoP can judge or score.

You know I agree with you on most of this! I understand people's pleasure in parsing out the scores, but when I watch skating, I watch for "wow." Certainly YuNa at Vancouver gave me "wow." Thank goodness that such a magical skater is also a skater whom the judges can figure out how to score with monster marks, so we get to keep her! Also, thank goodness for coaches and choreographers who can keep their wits about them and design programs that bring out the beauty of skating but also add points to a score. That way we can keep other wonderful skaters such as Mao, Daisuke, and the rest.

It's good being a skating fan!

 

[doubleflutz]

a world championship, a national championship, and a Olympic gold medal? What more could a competitor skater want?

Are you using "competitor" to mean "skater who only cares about competition", the answer is of course ALL OF THE MEDALS! If Yagudin's injuries hadn't caught up to him and he'd been able to stay in shape, I'm sure he'd have competed in two GPs, the GPF, Russian Nationals, Euros, and Worlds every year from 2003 to now. He was hungry for the win beyond belief. It makes me laugh that people talk about Evan like he's some kind of ultimate competitor.

And if you just mean "competitive (non-pro) skater", there's always creating a beautiful program and showing something special to the audience. But this is Evan we're talking about.

 

[Layfan]

Do you mean the woman on his left? The one on his right is fashion designer Vera Wang, who has been designing his costumes lately. She was a skater and is famous for her wedding gowns. They have been pals and I'm sure she's a big factor in his foray into fashion designing.

Even's tweets have been about hobnobing and name dropping. Wang is not his only celebrity pal or new BFF.

Oh, yes - I meant left. I was thinking MY right, I guess. Of course I know the other one is Vera Wang - I'm a girl!!

Anyway, judging from several posts it IS the dress he designed. It's not perfect or anything but for a first a attempt I think he did great and it is flattering on that woman.

What a shame fans argued over whether she was overscored rather than just saying "wow!!

I never thought about it quite that way, Janetfan. Although I wasn't too interested in the debate over whether she should have won by 10 or 20 points... When I think about Yuna's performances I'm still stunned. Never have I have seen an Olympic gold favorite deliver such an impeccable, cool, calm and collected performance - yet I didn't feel that she held back or played it safe.

If Yuna had gotten a row of 5.9s and 6.0s I wonder if people would have thought she was overscored. I'm hope I'm not asking something ridiculous - but would she have deserved 6.0 for tech? I don't know if I would have given her 6.0 for presentation - but if she had gotten some I wouldn't have complained.

 

[childfreegirl]

Well, I am not really missing him. He did not do much for me. One of those skaters I will probably never feel the need to dig out a youtube link and watch again, while for many I do. Sorry.
And that is not that I don't respect him as an athlete. Because he was the ultimate competitor.
But good for him if he moves forward in his life. 25y of age is the right time to do it, if he wants something to achieve outside of skating.

I completely agree with this. The caption of the photo says he's working on a menswear line, so I imagine it will include a lot of black.

 

[janetfan]

If Yuna had gotten a row of 5.9s and 6.0s I wonder if people would have thought she was overscored. I'm hope I'm not asking something ridiculous - but would she have deserved 6.0 for tech? I don't know if I would have given her 6.0 for presentation - but if she had gotten some I wouldn't have complained.

In my opinion yes - I think Yuna would have earned some 6.0's if they had used that system in Vancouver.
She skated a little too early in the LP for judges to have gone hog wild - remembering that Mao and Joannie were to follow.

If Yuna had skated last rather than Mirai - then I think it would have rained 6.0's down on her in a way never seen before.

Years ago when I watched skating - marks and 6.0's were not the big thing. In '76 nobody could have cared less if Dorothy got 5.8 , 5.9 or 6.0. What we cared about was where they placed her and if she won the OGM.

 

[ranjake]

None of these is really a career, just cashing in his current celebrity status with the OGM. You need real training and some talent to make a career. Celebrities put their names on fashions, perfumes, etc. which is good for as long as their popularity lasts, usually via continuation of their real career, e.g. being a movie star. The real value of Evan's OGM is still in skating which offers related opportunites when he stops competing. A different career is fine but he needs real ability in it.

Both Lysacek and Weir seem to be trying to have a career as public personalities. Unlike Weir, who is a natural in attracting attention, Lysacek doesn't have a wide appealing charisma. In their rivalry, celebrities circuit is not an advantageous arena for Evan, at least not in the long run.

I don't know if that's true. I like both. I think they both may have a different niche. I think Evan may be preferable to some, Johnny to others- and like I said, for me , it's both. I actually miss both of them. I know Johnny's editing his book, and I'm really looking forward to that. But I have a question- did he release his song yet?? I was hearing he was recording, but I never heard any more about it. I also love Johnny's reality show, and heard that a second season is coming in 2011.

 

[Bluebonnet]

Unlike Weir, who is a natural in attracting attention, Lysacek doesn't have a wide appealing charisma.

Yeah, a natural in attracting attention through cross-dressing, outragous talks, and girly acting. I was planning to read his book which is scheduled to release in January. But the cover of his book has taken all my desire away. Now I'm not interested in his book one bit.

I actually think that Lysacek has a wider appealing in general population than Weir. Maybe he just doesn't have it in skating world, that's all.

 

[Layfan]

In my opinion yes - I think Yuna would have earned some 6.0's if they had used that system in Vancouver.
She skated a little too early in the LP for judges to have gone hog wild - remembering that Mao and Joannie were to follow.

If Yuna had skated last rather than Mirai - then I think it would have rained 6.0's down on her in a way never seen before.

Years ago when I watched skating - marks and 6.0's were not the big thing. In '76 nobody could have cared less if Dorothy got 5.8 , 5.9 or 6.0. What we cared about was where they placed her and if she won the OGM.

I didn't know that! Thanks for sharing. Maybe it was the same in gymnastics until Nadia got the first perfect 10

I have to agree. I think Yuna would have made history with a few 6.0s in tech AND presentation. She made history anyway with her "record" score. Somehow doesn't feel the same... but the skate is the most important thing.