Nathan Chen | Page 406 | Golden Skate

Nathan Chen

lurkz2 said:
I think this part will enflame the Raf haters in this thread:slink::
“What he told me is, ‘I want to try it.’ He doesn’t want to leave me, and he knows that I am the coach that basically made him who he is,” Arutunian said confidently.”
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You're right, lurks2
I have just finished reading the article, tbh I am not a hater, but now I am:devil::sarcasm::mad:...

Raf's recent interviews about Nathan seemed to be overlapped with N.Morozov's ones about Dai a decade ago.:slink:
 
I don't really have a problem with what Raf said, partly because I think Nathan is being pretty unreasonable himself.
 
I can agree he's being unrealistic and a little naive. I think asking Raf to go across the country is pretty unreasonable and from that interview, it won't happen. His other students have asked him in the past to travel and he wouldn't. I also think training alone is pretty unreasonable. I'm not saying it was a spur of the moment decision to enroll in Yale since we know he's known for awhile, but I also still don't feel anything was thought out at all. There's no super secret plan they aren't telling us about.

Though I'm not sure what recalculating in a year if this doesn't work could mean in the long run. There are really only two options. Leave Yale or leave Raf since the school can't move and Raf won't either.

We might get to page 600 with Yale talk again. :p
 
Yeah, I don’t think Raf said anything bad - we know he can’t be happy about the idea so I think he’s being pretty restrained with his comments, since we know he’s capable of saying what he’s truly thinking (see: that post-Olympics interview lol)
 
What’s the big deal? Nothing he said was false and I think he’s just trying to say that Nathan knows he’s had a lot of success with Raf and doesn’t intend to let that go. It came off more smug than he probably meant but I mean a coach is a big part of what makes the athlete what they are, that’s kinda the point of coaching lol.

Say whatever about him but no other coach would be willing to take on the task that Nathan is trying to do. It’s a big thing to ask a top coach with many top athletes to try to work out a schedule with you where you’re across the country going to an elite school but Raf is willing to let Nathan try it and do what he can to help because he actually cares enough about Nathan to do so. How many coaches would be willing to do that in his position? Not sure what there is to be upset about.

Anyways, he had a lot really great things to say about Marin. Excited to see her progress.
 
sherlock trollmes said:
Yeah, I don’t think Raf said anything bad - we know he can’t be happy about the idea so I think he’s being pretty restrained with his comments, since we know he’s capable of saying what he’s truly thinking (see: that post-Olympics interview lol)
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Acutally, for Raf you are right. He's pretty much let him try and I'll try. Pretty tame for him. :laugh:

more mickey ears!

https://twitter.com/Cozy0505/status/993831050894688258
https://twitter.com/Cozy0505/status/993825637285548032
 
besti loop said:
Uhm, am I blind, but what did he say? There's nothing to hate him for??
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What makes me surprised more is that Raf is like "I'm not going to do any mental training, a skater will gain good mentality by gaining good physical shape, look at Adam that's what he did at the Olympics!!"

“When you are physically strong and technically strong, the mental strength will start to show up sooner or later.”
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Uhmmm I think da heck not? Cause it clearly didn't work with Nathan? And in Nathan's case it'd better be "sooner" (the Olys) than later :D Ah, Rafael...
 
Actually I kind of agree with Raf on that point and I've seen it in other sports. Nathan's problem at the Olys was more a lack of experience than a lack of mental strength. Else he would not have been able to bounce back the way he has.
 
besti loop said:
What makes me surprised more is that Raf is like "I'm not going to do any mental training, a skater will gain good mentality by gaining good physical shape, look at Adam that's what he did at the Olympics!!"


Uhmmm I think da heck not? Cause it clearly didn't work with Nathan? And in Nathan's case it'd better be "sooner" (the Olys) than later :D Ah, Rafael...
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That’s exactly the problem. I know that Tatiana hired a sports psychologist for Yagudin to handle his mental problem. He had a melt down at the beginning of the season and almost wanted to quit. The psychologist was with Yagudin the whole season. It is the coach’s job to proactively address any potential weakness. Nathan did poorly at Worlds last season as well.
 
^^^ Correct me of I’m wrong but I believe both Ashley and Adam have used sports psychologists before while under Raf so I don’t think he’s against working on mental strength in that way, just that he thinks a big part of mental strength comes from being prepared physically and technically. If you’re confident in your technique/are healthy, it’d be easier to handle the nerves because one less thing to worry about.

If Nathan was having problems technically being as consistent as usual then that would play into why he in particular had problems during the Olympics other than just needing experience to build the mental strength. Whatever they did for Worlds, it seems to have worked.

sheetz said:
Actually I kind of agree with Raf on that point and I've seen it in other sports. Nathan's problem at the Olys was more a lack of experience than a lack of mental strength. Else he would not have been able to bounce back the way he has.
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In his most recent interview he said that he had never experienced being below the top six before throughout his whole competive career and didn’t know how to handle it because he’d never been in that circumstance before but now he does. Mental strength comes from being prepared, being healthy, confidence, and most of all experience. Some things you can’t be totally prepared for, you just have to go through it.
 
sheetz said:
Actually I kind of agree with Raf on that point and I've seen it in other sports. Nathan's problem at the Olys was more a lack of experience than a lack of mental strength. Else he would not have been able to bounce back the way he has.
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I mean, ofc he lacked experience but if he'd have a mental strength he'd cope with it... I don't like to mention other skaters but Yuzuru Hanyu didn't have the Oly experience back in 2014, though it didn't affect him because (I suppose) he was mentally strong, not as afraid of the Olys as Nathan.

I know it's useless to dicuss it now when everything already happened. It's just that I still can't get over it a bit, always wanted Nathan to be at the Oly podium (okay, who of those who are here didn't)...
 
besti loop said:
I mean, ofc he lacked experience but if he'd have a mental strength he'd cope with it... I don't like to mention other skaters but Yuzuru Hanyu didn't have the Oly experience back in 2014, though it didn't affect him because (I suppose) he was mentally strong, not as afraid of the Olys as Nathan.
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Say what? Hanyu skated a poor LP in Sochi and only won because Patrick was even more nervous.
 
^^ isn’t what he did in the free skate and at worlds coping with it? Hanyu had a disaster of a FS in Sochi, everybody else just happen to be even bigger disasters. In a normal year, that wouldn’t be an Olympic gold level performance but he bounced back in Worlds and showed in the next few years and this Olympics that he’s a worthy champion. He’s had to fall on his face plenty of times to get there though.

To me mental strength isn’t that you’re not going to fail or that you can stand the pressure each and every time, it’s that when you inevitably do fail (as everyone does), how do you pick yourself back up? Those who are strong come back with a vengeance, those who are not crumble but the initial failure isn’t what signifies the mental strength to me. It’s how you deal with the aftermath imo
 
I think a big part of Nathan’s problem with the past OG was wanting it too much and too soon and you could see how it was messing with his psyche. To be quite honest, for the whole season I thought it was a train wreck waiting to happen. You could see it in his approach, the way he was willing to do whatever it took to win gold, his insistence on 5/6 quads at the expense of almost everything, instead of building gradually from the ground up and letting everything happen organically. But if it wasn’t his time, it wasn’t. And I really think going through this has taught him a lot - things he probabaly would never realize otherwise.

I don’t think Yuzuru in 2014 is comparable because I don’t think he wanted it the way Nathan *wanted* it (ofc I could be wrong) and often when you don’t have that kind of expectation weighing on you you go in with a totally different mindset, and things happen unexpectedly.
 
Both Javier and Yuzuru have some nerve issues from time to time. I don't follow them closely, but at least I came across two BO interviews talking about dealing with Javier's nerve issues. One was around 2016 worlds, and one was 2017 TSL interview. In the 2017 TSL interview, BO also talked about dealing with Gabby's nerve issue during competition.

I was surprise that quite a few people, including some of his fans thought Yuzuru's biggest flaw is his nerve issue, since to me he has the nerve of steel. There was a thread in Edge in the past several weeks discussing about skater's biggest accomplishment/strength and biggest flaws. I did remember reading some discussion that Yuzuru credited Tracy Wilson about helping him with some emotional or mental issues.

So I don't agree with Raf comments about confidence/mental issue in this particular interview as well as the interview he did during worlds when he was asked how he was dealing with Nathan's issue. He was consistent in his answers, and that is my biggest issues with him.

Other than, I find this Japan Times interview a quite honest one, and have no other problems with it. It is going to a harsh reality Nathan has to be dealing when choosing to go to Yale while wanting to stick with Raf at this time.

Having said that, it is really hard to deal with mental/confidence/nerve issues, as "magic" as BO, his top skaters still suffer those issues.

ETA: I suspect that Nathan's education/college has been an issue between him/his family and Raf for some time. This impression was from the Russian media interviews Raf and Nathan did around COR, and the Raf's interview right after OG when family influence was discussed. Finally I think with all other differences resolved or somewhat resolved, Raf has to accept that fact he has a very different student compared with other top skaters. He was not enthusiastic about it or probably strongly against, but as he said, he is trying to do as best as he can to help, but not promise much.
 
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