Nathan Chen

[heyheyhey]

I think that was kinda his point, if you didn’t do the planned program that you trained all year for all that well in the team event, why would you then think it’s a good idea to add more difficult, unplanned, and untrained elements on the most important day? Very silly of Nathan and I said as much at the time but it’s was a necessary lesson. We all have growing pains. I believe that since then, he and Raf have had a very specific plan (albeit with trying to juggle school in between) and will follow it to a T. I have no doubt that they will bear the fruit of all the hard work they have put in the past 3 years (more like 12 years really ). I hope everyone remembers to enjoy it and not stress too much.

Also, I would not doubt that one day Nathan will try the 4axel in competition but I’m glad both he and Raf know not to bother until after the Olympics. After that, go for broke kid

 

[1111bm]

I wish they didn't go for 4Lz & 4F in the short in the upcoming season, but have little hope that this won't be the case.

Nathan likely won't return to skating after Olys, so we won't see any attempts at landing a 4A in comp I would think.
If he does return for a few seasons (after having taken a break I assume) he will likely continue to study full-time while competing. But without full-time in person coaching/technical advice from Raf and lack of recovery time due to his busy schedule, I don't see him training a challenging new element such as the 4A.
Plus, with being older and possibly old recurring injuries, he might even struggle to regain all of his old jumps, never mind a new element that's so hard on the body and carries a higher risk of injury. It would really depend on his physical shape.
But ultimately it would depend on what his goals are that make him return. If it's achieving certain technical feats then yes, 4A might be on his list of course (possibly depending on how it goes for Yuzu or maybe other skaters?).

Agree about Raf's interviews . If he was a poster on the internet, he'd be called the biggest troll.

 

[lurkz2]

If he does return for a few seasons (after having taken a break I assume) he will likely continue to study full-time while competing. But without full-time in person coaching/technical advice from Raf and lack of recovery time due to his busy schedule, I don't see him training a challenging new element such as the 4A.

If he returns I think it'll be after he finishes uni, he only has 1-2 years left at Yale after all.

I actually appreciate his ambitious content because he is the master of his destiny and is not at the mercy of the judges.

 

[Joe Mendoza]

I wish they didn't go for 4Lz & 4F in the short in the upcoming season, but have little hope that this won't be the case.

Oh but he is...but I think if he is consistent with his training with all his 5 quads - I think he'll be fine.

SP: 4Lz 3A 4F3T
FS: 4Lo 4Lz 4F3T 4S 4T1Eu3F 4T3T 3A

 

[heyheyhey]

I know he said he’ll take a break but I have a feeling he’ll come back prior to the next Olympics and try his shot if he still feels up to it and feels competitive enough. It wouldn’t be the first time skaters have done this and it may be good for him to take a break but I don’t see why he still couldn’t train while still studying since he won’t have the pressure of competitions. He obviously can handle the long distance training situation, it was more the competition schedule colliding with exams/class that seemed more of a conflict. I could be wrong and he’ll be completely done after this next season but I can see him wanting to push himself to want to do all the quads possible, maybe even a full quad program or quad quad combo. He’d have nothing left to lose, it would just depend on his goals and if they completely move away from skating. It would also depends on Raf as he seems to want to retire from full time skating after the Olympics. I can only see Nathan coming back if Raf also agrees to come back to that level of intense coaching. We’ll see but I think he has more to offer to skating so it’d be a bit of a shame to see him end it all so soon but then he also is probably destined for bigger things than skating if we’re being honest. I’ll savor it while I can regardless.

I personally love Raf interviews. He ruffles feathers (and I’m continuously amazed how some people on social media really think he was a no name nothing coach before Nathan ) but he’s honest and his skaters love the crap out of him. I’m glad Nathan has him and the rest of the team guiding him as they seem to be a strong support system to his overall well being and have done a lot to provide him the resources/tools to succeed in achieving his dreams (aside from Nathan’s own abilities and work ethic of course). I always think this could have been Mao too if it wasn’t for the unfortunate misunderstanding

 

[1111bm]

I think one likely reason he might want to return (after taking a break) would be to make the team and attend another Olympics. And depending on the skating scene by then and the physical shape he's in, hope to win a medal/another medal at them (his specific goals at a third Olympics will of course also depend on how the upcoming Games play out).
I'm basing this off of the way he usually talks about the Olympics and the significance they hold for him.

Of course it is also possible, that his "thirst" for attending the Games will be satisfied should he succeed at winning gold in Beijing. I'm not sure he's the type who would be motivated by chasing multiple/back-to-back titles if it means derailing his life post-skating, when he's already won every title at least once, save for Olys.

 

[Gilligan]

Well he hasn't won Skate Canada. Or Cup of China. Or NHK trophy.

Even if he adds one more next season in addition to Skate America, that still leaves two unclaimed. ^^

 

[LutzDance]

Agree about Raf's interviews . If he was a poster on the internet, he'd be called the biggest troll.

I personally love Raf interviews. He ruffles feathers (and I’m continuously amazed how some people on social media really think he was a no name nothing coach before Nathan ) but he’s honest and his skaters love the crap out of him.

I agree with both of these lol. Raf can be the biggest troll in interviews and say all sorts of crazy things, but I think deep down he has always had a vision for Nathan and worked hard to keep him on track. I also love how reluctant he is to shower praises on Nathan and instead always maintains he is not good enough. To me it's the biggest humble brag there is and very Asian parent

I don't think Nathan is very obsessed with winning titles or breaking records. In fact even if he continues skating, it probably won't be after a(nother) medal, as he frequently mentions how thinking about the Olympics can get overwhelming and clutter his mind. If he continues it will be that he misses competition. This season he jumped at any competition opportunity he can get, from both of the ISPs, LVI, to WTT (and even that random Aerial Challenge ), which to me shows how much he loves competing. If he still feels the same way after the games (or after he finishes with Yale) then he might be driven back to the competitive circle. As for physical shape, I think he still has a few years ahead of him. Maybe not enough to get a 4A, but given how relatively injury-free and full of stamina he has been he might still be able to compete with 4-5 quads for some time. Although I do wonder how he would continue to push himself technically should he continue post-Beijing. He's been very focused on stabilizing his quads for the past three seasons and it seems like the work is nearly done. Being such a good technical skater, he will probably want to continuously up his game.

 

[4everchan]

Well he hasn't won Skate Canada. Or Cup of China. Or NHK trophy.

Even if he adds one more next season in addition to Skate America, that still leaves two unclaimed. ^^

it will be hard for Nathan to win Skate Canada.... it would mean for him to bypass on Skate America. I don't imagine him doing both back to back while he is in school.

while i am here... i wonder if Nathan could make a SP work on a piece like this... he has the flow for it... also, the piece as a lot of repetitions so it can easily be cut without destroying it.

 

[LutzDance]

IG update, yet another photo from his LA trip last year?
https://www.instagram.com/p/COTuVQirccN/?igshid=3usmoayaqnre

Watching comedy with Mariah and the Brezinas
https://twitter.com/nathanchenjp/status/1388353276538540033?s=21

 

[Gilligan]

it will be hard for Nathan to win Skate Canada.... it would mean for him to bypass on Skate America. I don't imagine him doing both back to back while he is in school.

while i am here... i wonder if Nathan could make a SP work on a piece like this... he has the flow for it... also, the piece as a lot of repetitions so it can easily be cut without destroying it.

Thank you, your music contributions are always appreciated. 'easy to cut' music is especially welcome!

And I was mostly facetious about the other GPs. ^^ I don't see Nathan needing to cross off every comp including Nebelhorn, Golden Spin of Zagreb, Autumn Classic, etc. Just had to grump at 'won every title but Olympics,' because sometimes I'm ornery that way.

 

[zebobes]

I was mostly facetious about the other GPs. ^^ I don't see Nathan needing to cross off every comp including Nebelhorn, Golden Spin of Zagreb, Autumn Classic, etc. Just had to grump at 'won every title but Olympics,' because sometimes I'm ornery that way.

Yeah, because he also hasn't won Junior Worlds either... but unfortunately, there's nothing he can do about that!

Since I live in Taipei, I was always hoping that Nathan would come to a 4CC, but one year that it was here he was injured, the year that Junior Worlds was here he had already moved to Seniors, and he has already won a 4CC and so I think that I won't get to see him.

Yuzu actually came one year too, but that was at the beginning of his senior career, and so I didn't really appreciate his skating back then.

 

[lurkz2]

Yeah, because he also hasn't won Junior Worlds either... but unfortunately, there's nothing he can do about that!

Since I live in Taipei, I was always hoping that Nathan would come to a 4CC, but one year that it was here he was injured, the year that Junior Worlds was here he had already moved to Seniors, and he has already won a 4CC and so I think that I won't get to see him.

Yuzu actually came one year too, but that was at the beginning of his senior career, and so I didn't really appreciate his skating back then.

I don't think Nathan's too fussed about that considering that he was still junior eligible when he won his first senior title.

 

[Joe Mendoza]

Yeah, because he also hasn't won Junior Worlds either... but unfortunately, there's nothing he can do about that!

Since I live in Taipei, I was always hoping that Nathan would come to a 4CC, but one year that it was here he was injured, the year that Junior Worlds was here he had already moved to Seniors, and he has already won a 4CC and so I think that I won't get to see him.

Yuzu actually came one year too, but that was at the beginning of his senior career, and so I didn't really appreciate his skating back then.

I think 2016 was when he would have rocked it at both Junior Worlds (I think Daniel Samohin won Junior Worlds that year) and Worlds had it not been for that unfortunate incident during the Nationals Gala. But then again, had he not taken that rest because he literally had to - I wonder how the rest of his career would have been. Everything happens for a reason I guess. He may not have this made-up Super Slam, he still has a chance to get his Career Golden Slam in 2022, which TBH, I don't think he cares too much - he just wants that darn Olympic gold.

 

[Hronop]

Yay we have three votes on Shos 2nd movement. If anyone from Nathan’s camp lurks on GS, please let the team know

Four votes! I love it (as well as MacMillan's choreo, by the way)!

 

[1111bm]

I don't think Nathan is very obsessed with winning titles or breaking records. In fact even if he continues skating, it probably won't be after a(nother) medal, as he frequently mentions how thinking about the Olympics can get overwhelming and clutter his mind.
If he continues it will be that he misses competition.

Yes certainly, I don't think winning a specific medal or attending another Olympics as a sole reason would be motivation enough to commit to the daily rigours and monotony of training at that level again. And the stress of juggling both education and skating simultaneously, never mind missing out on a lot of activities that are part of a more average, social life.

I agree that if he decides to continue for a few more seasons, it'll be a necessary condition, that he still feels that competitive drive (maybe spurred on by up-and-coming new rivals such as Yuma, or maybe some old, returning ones? To see if he can keep up with them?).
It's going to be either that or because he will miss the structure and sense of purpose of training and a competition schedule.
Or both.

But he would still need to be motivated by something more than just returning to training/competing itself, I'm sure he'd be striving for specific goals, such as technical feats, as have already been mentioned, and a third Olympics including aiming for a(nother) medal.

I agree that breaking records or chasing certain titles (except for GPF, Worlds and Olys, with two already "ticked off") most likely isn't something he's particularly interested in.

 

[Hronop]

Ravel concerto

This, too! It's been in my mind all this time while I was reading this (super fascinating) discussion!

 

[Hronop]

Sorry for hijacking this thread with further musical musings, but I wonder if you think Bach's music (and by 'Bach' I mean JS Bach, of course) may suit Nathan's style. It has this 'cleanliness' of (melodic) lines and a considerable degree of (contrapuntal) intricacy that, I think, Nathan is def capable of translating onto the ice. Or maybe I am just imagining things because I've just watched Helgi Tomasson's "7 for 8" (for SF Ballet), which is based on Bach's keyboard concertos. The dancers there were also wearing simple black costumes which, of course, reminded me of that Shae-Lynn's shirt from the Glass free skate.
Bonus: Bach is non terribly overused in figure skating. And he's expressive, but this expessiveness is somewhat subdued.
Bonus-2: You can definitely add some contemporary choreography on top of Bach's music.
Anyway, just a thought.

Edited to clarify that by 'subdued' I only mean that it's not the Italian 'verismo' kind of expressivity (that's for Shoma, lol) - it's 'crisp' and 'sharp' though, and that's exactly what Nathan needs.

 

[LutzDance]

Sorry for hijacking this thread with further musical musings, but I wonder if you think Bach's music (and by 'Bach' I mean JS Bach, of course) may suit Nathan's style. It has this 'cleanliness' of (melodic) lines and a considerable degree of (contrapuntal) intricacy that, I think, Nathan is def capable of translating onto the ice.

As one of the worst perpetrators of hijacking this thread for musical discussions, I totally enjoyed reading your post and wish to see more At the risk of sounding dramatic, it fills my heart with joy whenever someone shares my taste in music and choreography, so I'm very excited to hear your support for music choices of Shostakovich and Ravel, and your admiration for MacMillan's choreoAs to Bach, his works are also among my top choices for Nathan, albeit I didn't think about the cleanliness of melodic lines as a(n excellent) rationale. Proof:

Bach, for his total blend of rationality and emotion, would also be a good fit.

And I've been expressing my desire for Nathan to skate to Bach on different platforms for two years now Would love to see him do a program in line with Forsythe's Artifact Suite.

I also recommended contrapuntal music for Nathan:

I have a new music recommendation for Nathan: Moondog. His experimental jazz features unforgettable melodies, colorful counterpoints, unorthodox time signatures, shifting rhythms, and persistent bass line/percussion reminiscent of minimalism music - a bag of goodies to be unpacked with creative choreography.

I also just love the way you distinguish Nathan's and Shoma's styles here "Verismo" is such an appropriate term! Making me think of Puccini whom I associate Shoma's skating with.

Edited to clarify that by 'subdued' I only mean that it's not the Italian 'verismo' kind of expressivity (that's for Shoma, lol) - it's 'crisp' and 'sharp' though, and that's exactly what Nathan needs

I think the term I would give to Nathan is "neoclassical": crisp lines, sharp attacks, music with "geometrical" structure, and ways of movement unbound by the language of classical choreography.

 

[Hronop]

For all ballet and Glass lovers here: did anyone see this? It was uploaded just a few days ago. Metamorphosis #2 starts at 8:22.