Phil Hersh's Tweet

[Spirals for Miles]

Soooo... Jackie livetweeted Alex and Chris' free like all the other pairs and he mentioned how the US is down to one pair next year. Phil Hersh said "One too many?"
What do you think? Is Phil right and we don't deserve a pairs spot? (I don't think he's right, and neither does Jackie) Or will the single spot push all the pairs to improve? Is it cyclical, and will the US pairs drought come to an end with the junior pairs, who just earned three spots?

For what it's worth, Chris Knierim replied "Maybe you should go out and save pairs *shrug emoji*" and attached the "you're a jerk" GIF. Many people came to the defense of SK/K and S/B but many agreed with Phil.

I don't normally start things like this but I was appalled at Phil's tweet.

 

[noskates]

I find Phil Hersh appalling in general. Way to support our skaters Phil. And to answer your question, OF COURSE we deserve a pairs spot. Alexa looked totally "off" today and we were wondering if she was sick.

I like Chris K's response.

 

[el henry]

I saw this too.

I almost never “tweet @“, but I was very sorely tempted. PH is painting himself more and more into a corner as anachronistic, nasty and irrelevant.

FWIW, I counted far more tweets in support of Alexa and Chris than agreeing with PH. Jackie Wong tweeted that it was a “low blow”, and Alexa, God bless her, tweeted that she was no longer going to be silent while Phil “tweet shamed” people.

I saw a tweet from Phil saying that this would not be accepted in any other sport, and what he said was normal. :disapp: As someone who follows (ETA: rather closely and fervently : ) another sport, *maybe* those kinds of comments would be normal in the Eagles subReddit. Is that the standard PH wants to be judged by?

Very disappointing. :noshake::noshake::noshake:

 

[Yatagarasu]

Is that the standard PH wants to be judged by?

This is the guy who went after the Juniors, saying that the list needs to be culled.

Philip Hersh @olyphil Mar 9

Let’s see. You have 44 women at #WorldJFigure for SP, and 27 can’t score even 50 points. (But 24 go to FS). How is that not a waste of money for whoever is paying the freight?

[x]

so it isn't surprising, unfortunately.

 

[StitchMonkey]

Others have already commented on how nasty it is... but what about how flat out ignorant it is? Every country gets one spot... there is no one too many... it just is a logical fallacy. He was trying so hard to be quick witted... he forgot to even make sense.

 

[Lamente Ariane]

I hope very much the single spot will serve as a motivation rather than a demoralizing factor for US pairs. As for Phil... :noshake:

 

[Spirals for Miles]

Just tweeted at him, haha....

 

[StitchMonkey]

I hope very much the single spot will serve as a motivation rather than a demoralizing factor for US pairs. As for Phil... :noshake:

And a motivator for USFS to put some love and money in pairs. I think they need to about double the number of events they send pairs to this fall.

 

[Weathergal]

I noticed Lynn Rutherford disagreed with him as well.

 

[karne]

I thought the double-down a few replies lower, after Jackie called him out - worded in a "if they can't win what's the point?" way - was much worse.

(To bring some lightheartedness to the thread, someone replied to Jackie's post of Max's elements with "was it a flutz?". Jackie's response was priceless. To be fair to the person, apparently Russian TV called his Lutz a flip.)

 

[gmyers]

Hersh is so right! Pairs has never been the bright spot in American skating but now it is at its Total complete nadir. It’s is right to make sarcastic comments about no spots being deserving! Things must be done!! Sbs triples are absent! It’s very bad. It’s very concerning.

 

[drivingmissdaisy]

Phil's tweet was harsh and unnecessary. We simply don't have depth in pairs. It's not like we left Gordeeva and Grinkov at home and sent the Knierim's in their place.

 

[karne]

And it's not like it's all on the Knierims anyway. This is the second year in a row they've been left to do the heavy lifting for spot retention because the other team couldn't make the free.

 

[cruzceleste]

Phil and Brennan are so annoying and negative sometimes... an athlete knows when he / she hasn´t perform there is no need to shame them.

And one thing is to offer constructive criticism, and is very different to only criticize...

Glad Alexa and Chris are defending themselves. Hope IceNetwork thinks twice before giving him another outsourcing job...

 

[Weathergal]

Hersh is so right! Pairs has never been the bright spot in American skating but now it is at its Total complete nadir. It’s is right to make sarcastic comments about no spots being deserving! Things must be done!! Sbs triples are absent! It’s very bad. It’s very concerning.

I disagree. Let's not forget that Kayne / O'Shea also are showing promise and most likely would have had a good showing at Worlds. They had an excellent showing at Nationals and won 4CCs. Do I think that's a guarantee? Well of course not. But I believe they withdrew because of injury. Can anyone confirm that? I wouldn't necessarily give up on them yet - or Stellato / Bartholemay, who have only been a pair for two seasons and just missed the cut for the finals. Canada only had Moore-Towers / Marinaro make the cut. I'm still shocked and saddened for Seguin / Bilodeau. But I still believe in Canada's pairs teams. No, things aren't great, but saying that the U.S. shouldn't get any spots at all is a little harsh and alarmist IMHO

 

[tosca]

I am so over Phil Hersh. Even the way he handled the Mirai situation was so misogynistic. He is quick to build up a skater and then tear them down.

 

[MK's Winter]

Phil is unfiltered. I appreciate that about him at times. This tweet in particular is one of those things that you think- don't tweet it. I see both side of the coin. Phil's tweet doesn't help the situation. I also see his point. Do I think the Pairs situation should rest solely on Alexa and Chris? No. I think it's a combination of USFS support, coaching failures, and economic factors.

Those things aside- the pairs field has become so deep- despite who was not here, it takes consistent skating and SP scores of 70+ to crack the top 10. That is crazy depth all around.

The problem in the U.S is that pair skaters seem to go so far with their coaches. Alexa and Chris have a strong twist, throws, excellent speed across the ice. While they have grown as a pair- they lack finishing and well structured programs. I thought they had their best programs in 2015/16.

Deanna/Nate and Tarah/Danny have pretty good in betweens, some good pair element and some ok ones.

All lack SBS jump consistencies. I know coaches want to keep students, build rink programs, and get the credit- but none of them are producing consistency. If I were the USFS, I would start looking at bringing the pairs to one location and have the coaches work as a group.

They could all learn from each other while building a better Pairs program. I think it would be good for teams to train together.

China, Russia, and Canada have all benefited from competitive training environments. I think it would help our Pairs develop consistency and better prepare nerves for competition. The USFS would have to assist with this financially of course, but they need to do something. If the want to see better results- they need to invest.

The USFS should also assist Pairs with obtaining show opportunities to take some of the financial burden off. It baffles me that our National Champions- jump issues aside- aren't on the Stars on Ice tour. That is another avenue that could help them grow, artistically at least.

And the USFS is where the coin flips. If the Fed doesn't make the changes to help their Pairs- why bother sending any. That is where I can see Phil's brash unfiltered point.

 

[el henry]

^^^
But Phil doesn’t make these types of detailed criticisms; he’s just being mean, and he thinks, maybe, funny? I don’t know. Like I said, his comments would be at home in an NFL subreddit. But not for someone who holds himself out to be a journalist.:sarcasm:

And Phil isn’t criticizing the Fed’s lack of support of pairs, he is directly snarking about the pairs themselves. I think if we asked Alexa and Chris, Tarah and Danny, Ashley and Tim, Deanna and Nate, and all the other skaters, they could come up with a million reasons that we should “bother” sending pairs to international comps.

I’m sure if PH actually bothered to think, he might come with some too. That might be asking too much.

 

[ladyjane]

Well, this is the same guy who wants Worlds to be eliminated, even if we saw some truly wonderful skates, redemptions from the OG, but also just plain good results at this Worlds, I can't even take it seriously. Come on. Be like Jackie who just reports on what happens, and is so concerned and involved with the skaters. He doesn't put them down, but just acknowledges what happened. So much more fair.

 

[gmyers]

I disagree. Let's not forget that Kayne / O'Shea also are showing promise and most likely would have had a good showing at Worlds. They had an excellent showing at Nationals and won 4CCs. Do I think that's a guarantee? Well of course not. But I believe they withdrew because of injury. Can anyone confirm that? I wouldn't necessarily give up on them yet - or Stellato / Bartholemay, who have only been a pair for two seasons and just missed the cut for the finals. Canada only had Moore-Towers / Marinaro make the cut. I'm still shocked and saddened for Seguin / Bilodeau. But I still believe in Canada's pairs teams. No, things aren't great, but saying that the U.S. shouldn't get any spots at all is a little harsh and alarmist IMHO

Sometimes it’s good to be alarmist! It can improve a program. I believe Russia was alarmist over its ladies and that’s when they said pre teens could win the ladies competition