question about levels

[BravesSkateFan]

I'm a little confused about the spiral sequence levels. Sasha put a COE spiral into her SP so that it would be a level 3. It was scored as a level 3, but I'm not sure why. The CoP specifically says that the spirals have to "curve equally in both directions" the IE and OE were certanly not equal. Have I misinterpreted the requirements? someone explain please!

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

It seems to me that the change edge spiral (I call it a serpentine spiral), is an extremely difficult element. A completely solid edge must be on the first spiral and skated in arc way. The cross over on the same skating leg to an opposite edge, as it is in school figures, one has to shift weight without disturbing the figure. This takes a moment of 'flat' before the new edge begins and should continue in an arc way albeit opposite to the first one.

Misgivings I have about this intricate difficult move is that most skaters who attempt the serpentine spiral go from edge to flat and then come out of the entire sequence too quickly. Even Ms Kwan occasionally does not hold the second spiral long enough although she does make the transition perfectly.

I'd give a level 3 but not for attempt - only for completion.

Joe

 

[BravesSkateFan]

So in your opinion Sasha's COE (or serpentine) spiral did not fit the requirement for level 3? Just making sure that we have the same consensus. Do you think Michelle's coe fits the level 3 requirement all of the time(provided she has the other elements too) or just sometimes?

 

[gkelly]

The official descriptions of the levels:

http://www.isu.org/vsite/vfile/page/fileurl/0,11040,4844-139039-156255-39935-0-file,00.pdf


Requirements for a level 2 spiral sequence:

Element includes three of the following
features:
· Sequence uses variety of spiral positions – plus inclusion of extra position or variety/creativity on minimum of two
positions
· Difficult acceleration steps between the spiral position
· Spirals curve mainly in one direction but at least one uses opposite curve, different edge combinations
· Use of upper body to increase difficulty of spirals and connecting steps

For level 3:

Element includes three of the following features:
· Sequence uses variety of spiral positions – required spirals plus inclusion of extra unsupported positions (no holding of the free
leg) or variety on more than two positions
· Minimum number of steps between spirals and steps enhance difficulty
· Spirals curve equally in both directions with unsupported change of edges
· Use of upper body and/or varied positions to increase difficulty of spirals and steps throughout the sequence

Because the short program spiral sequence requires at least three different spiral positions with at least one on each foot, a change-of-edge spiral by itself can't be "level 3"; it can only contribute to one or more of the "features" necessary for the sequence to be rated as level 3.

The other position(s) could also contribute to the "curve equally in both directions" requirement. The depth of edge would probably be covered by the judges' grades of execution more than by the caller's determination of the level.

But it does seem that the length of time the second edge is held after the change could make a difference in whether or not the sequence meets the level 3 requirements if it was otherwise borderline.

 

[BravesSkateFan]

Because the short program spiral sequence requires at least three different spiral positions with at least one on each foot, a change-of-edge spiral by itself can't be "level 3"; it can only contribute to one or more of the "features" necessary for the sequence to be rated as level 3.

I know that the COE spiral can't be a level 3 by itself, but it still seems to me that the COE has to have equal curve on both edges becuase "· Spirals curve equally in both directions with unsupported change of edges" is all in one bullet , the two are not seperated.

now if there were two seperate bullets one that said
-sprials curve equally in both directions
and one that said
-unsupported change of edge
then it would would be two seperate things, one requirement being a COE spiral (unsupported) and the other would be curves in equal directions. Which is what Sasha has.
Now perhaps this is really what the ISU means, but if it is they need to clairfy by seperating the two.

 

[Cactus]

Sasha Cohen has concocted a new move for figure skating. Due to the nascent nature of the COP, the move is listed as part of a level 3 spiral sequence. But fear not, soon it'll have its own designation as The Wobble. Other skaters are catching on: Fumie Suguri has incorporated the move into her programs. Another unique feature of the move is that it will be scored according to the loudness and duration of Peggy Flemming's gush in response. If Peggy is not available for the competition, another female commentator, such as Susie Wynn, must abandon her professional facade and fill in with an emotional outburst.

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

Braveskate - What I see on TV is that Sasha's change of edge is not going beyond the flat. Given her extraordinary extensions it is not easy to make that transition from one edge to another and hold it. But it is those extraordinary extensions which make it quite beautiful but not technically correct from my viewpoint.

Irina was working on a 'serpentine' spiral. She was doing it from back edges rather than forward edges. She succeeded but her extensions were not on par with Cohen, Kwan, and many others.

If you have slo mo on your VCR, see if you can check out that transition of Kwans and Cohens. Unfortunately, I do not have slo mo.

Joe