Responses Watching GPF on TV

[Mathman]

Hi, Runawaybunny, I'm glad you decided to post. Welcome aboard.

Rgirl, that was so interesting about managing one's energy level to hit the jumps just at the right peak. At the International Figure Skating Challenge Michelle said that after she hit her first jump she was so high on adrenalin that she couldn't come down in time to get herself together for the second jump, and so she missed her intended 3L/2T.

About the altitude factor, at the end of their programs the first three men's skaters were sucking major wind, looking like they were about to pass out. Now Plushenko's comment makes more sense -- he said he lost mainly because he didn't do his intended triple Salchow at the end, he was just too tired to do it.

Isn't it a shame that in this supposedly prestigious event they couldn't find six men who were willing to skate?

Mathman

 

[Sk8Fan]

Sandu/Plush

I guess I was lucky, they didn't interrupt skating with news on the West Coast. So I had a chance to see both free skates and re-watch them taped. I wouldn't call Sandu's performance "brilliant", he had some minor landing errors (both second landings on 4-3 were not clean, doubled some of his 3 jumps) and it wasn't that emotional and intense as was his short program. Plush had a very good and clean skate and all commentators, including Dick were saying that he 100% won before they saw the marks. So my point is that Plush clearly won free skate if not that double jump added to his 3 axel, not to take anything from Sandu, he probably had his best performance.

 

[Rgirl]

Thanks for the ABC link, Runawaybuni. Welcome to GS and I LOVE your online name! Sorry I can't help you with a tape of the men's GPF LP. It was cut off for me too.

Doggygirl,
Yes indeed, the preponderonce of aerobic vs. anaerobic muscle fibers is just one of many, many physiological, biomechanical, kinesiological, psycholgical, neurological, and a whole bunch of other body factors that affect how well a skater can cope with certain factors such as cumulative fatigue and altitude in this situation. As you said, of course there are things skaters can do to make the most of their strengths and minimize their weaknesses, but sometimes things are just out of their hands and IMO it's just as important for the skater to recognize those situations as those in which s/he could do something to improve. The reason being psychological. It doesn't do athletes any good to chastise themselves for things over which they had no control.

Needless to say, ITA with all your points about body type. You said, "As a dancer, I bet you had certain physical advantages / disadvantages too, and didn't get the opportunity to use whatever they were as an excuse when you were trying out for a particular production??" Yes indeedy. I was in a modern dance repertory company, which means we did a wide variety of styles of choreography by many different choreographers. Some choreographers would show up and just as you were, s/he LOVED you for the major role (if there was one) in the piece he was going to create or set. "Piece" in modern dance is the equivalent of "program" in skating and "ballet" in ballet. Other times the choreographer would take one look at you and hate your guts. And of course everything in between. More often than one might think it wasn't a dancer's look or abilities, it was just something about his/her personality or just vibe that the choreographer either hated or loved. I can see why it's so very important for an elite skater to feel a "sympatico" with his/her coach and choreographer in order to really excell. As long as you feel the choreographer/coach supports you, temper flares don't really matter and you want them to push you. But if you feel they can barely stand you no matter what you do, it just compounds the negativity. It's also psychologically draining. For a few weeks you can do no wrong with one choreographer, then another choreographer comes in and you can do no right.

"I assume you had to work to overcome your disadvantages in the maximum way possible, and do things to highlight your strengths?" Yep, just as every performing artist and athlete does. Sometimes dancers who are the most physically gifted don't have the ability to take criticism and push themselves. When Sasha was with Nicks, I wondered if such problems would hold her back. I've been very please to see her working so hard for Tarasova and clearly accepting constructive criticism. As Sasha said shortly after she changed to Tarasova, "She's the first coach I've found who pushes me harder than I push myself."

Interesting point about Plush doing not only all three of his GP events plus the final but also both cheezefests, Campbell's and the IFSC, all with a knee injury of the kind that particularly gets worse with time. However, we can't know what's going on behind the scenese with the Russian Federation. Plush may be subject to pressures we don't know about and perhaps the reason he keeps talking about his knee is to try to send a message to the [pwers tjat be. Of course I'm just speculating; it could just as easily be that it's Plush feeling he must win EVERYTHING! However, I hope I'm wrong about the latter and that he can skip Euros. to give himself a rest before Worlds.

Although I agree that some of the common reasons given for being tired, etc. etc. don't wash every time, I think when you get to the top five in the World, no matter what the discipline, that there is a general--emphasis on general--personality type that is highly self motivated and doesn't tend toward excuses. IMO, you just don't get to that elite level in any sport, especially one like figure skating where the number of true elites is so small, if you tend to make excuses for your poor performances. Some may when they're still young, but not for long if they want to excel and achieve their goals.

Some are the opposite--they can do it while they're young but as they start to mature, they find they just aren't cut out for it. Nicole Bobek and Christopher Bowmen are examples. Others, especially women, fall victim to eating disorders, such as ice dancer Jamie Silverstein.

Re "I've come to realize this year that I WANT to attend a major event in person." ABSOLUTELY!!! You're right, it is impossible to imagine what it's like seeing the skating live, feeling the energy of the crowd, the whole experience. As for Atlanta, usually there are ads on the various boards for available tickets at the 11th hour or even a couple of weeks before. And there are usually always tickets available in the nosebleed sections even for the big events, like the ladies final. If your budget and schedule allow it, by all means give it a try. And if not this year, next. Even more exciting is Worlds and to die for would be the Olympics in Italy. Of course these cost money, but seeing almost anything live is well, well worth it.
Rgirl

 

[Rixis]

ANGER!

I am amazingly upset about ABC's lack of responsibility with this. Yesterday, I couldn't see the short programs because I was out, so I asked my grandma to tape it for me and she FELL ASLEEP...today, I planned my day specifically so I could see the long programs...which I had been looking forward to so much...and the only free hours I had from 4-6, it wasn't ON!?! I can understand the Alert thing...but they should at least say the correct time that they are going to show their programs...and I had to settle for Kurt Browning's Gotta Skate??? No Plush?? This is an outrage! I had been waiting to see the Grand Prix Finals for sooo long...

 

[show 42]

Watching the pair's final, I am once again reminded why Pairs is my favorite discipline.......few pairs have made me cry.....first Gordeeva and Grinkov and now Shen and Zhao........they were fabulous and totally connected to each other......42

 

[sk8tngcanuck]

GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR @ CTV and ABC. I always had CTV to depend on and with their failure to cover the GP this year, I had resigned myself to ABC coverage. I checked my on screen guide today before I went to work and according to ABCSPO the GPF ladies and men's programs was running from 4-6pm. I was so pleased, had my day planned, got my dr. pepper and popcorn ready, cuddled in on the couch with my daughter, and Voila - GOLF!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Why oh Why does ABC do this to us???? Don't they understand our addiction?

Canuck

 

[Kasey]

Plush vs. Eman

"Technicality" or not...in my opinion, Plush out-jumped Sandhu...But Eman out-PERFORMED Plush. He relates to music, and feels it, better than almost any other skater I've ever seen (hmm, maybe Wylie or Robin Cousins is up there, but Eman IS pretty special in that way!)

It's frustrating, because I don't dislike Plush...I think he's got a LOT of talent...and HOPEFULLY, one day he will be choreographed by someone who will USE his talent and musicality, rather than to force movements on him that he doesn't seem to feel.

Again, just my opinion......

Kasey

 

[CassidyL]

GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR @ CTV and ABC. I always had CTV to depend on and with their failure to cover the GP this year, I had resigned myself to ABC coverage.

Why don't you just watch it on CBC next weekend? CBC, not CTV, are showing the international events this year.

 

[nymkfan51]

Rgirl ... ITA about Shen & Zhao!!! Something happened to them at last year's worlds ... I was there, and can tell you they just ignited the building with feeling. It appears that their GPF LP did much the same thing. I haven't felt this way about a skater other than Michelle in a very long time.

As for Sasha ... I'm with Peggy on this one. After she finished, Peggy said something like " I just can't believe she did this again." Very interesting about the energy theory ... that certainly could be a major factor. For me though, it just seems she thinks her way through the entire program and never lets go. Her best LP was really at Campbells this season ... since then she has made errors in every one. It's frustrating to watch ... she has way too much talent to continually be making these mistakes.

 

[rain]

I can't wait for the CBC coverage.....I loathe, hate and abhor ABC. Not only was I immensely annoyed about them breaking into the mens LP and cutting the two top skaters (God forbid we should miss any of the commercials though), but the commentators are unbelievably annoying. BE QUIET!!!! I kept shouting at my TV, unfortunately the speakers only go one way.

Anway, from what I saw, here are my comments.... Altitude was clearly a factor, particularly in the mens (haven't seen pairs or dance yet - waiting for CBC). I was in pain just watching them suck in air after they were done, and the ends of the programs clearly suffered. Though, as I said, I have yet to see Sandhu and Plushenko's skates in their entirety, let me just throw this out there.....some are saying Plushenko outskated Sandhu, but lost because of the rules. But that's exactly why we have rules. Who's to say that if the rules were different Sandhu wouldn't have thrown in an extra jump combo and still beaten Plushenko? He would have won IF..... Isn't that true of every skater in every competition? Off my soapbox now.

Ladies....They didn't struggle as much as the men and I enjoyed Liashenko, Arakawa, Cohen and Suguri. Arakawa did a beautiful skate - I'm really enjoying her a lot this season. Cohen's skate was lovely in spite of the falls, I just hope she blows everyone away at worlds with a fantastic skate. Loved Suguri. She's been one of my favs for several years and it's really nice to see her putting it together.

I have to agree with whoever said overall they were a little disappointed at how many mistakes were made cumulatively in the competition. I too expected a cleaner final this far into the season with these top performers.

 

[Doggygirl]

Hi all!

Rgirl, I enjoyed reading your thoughts correlating to your own experience. We are definitely on the same page. All these physical and style differences are another reason I like the COP, assuming it continues to develop into a system that truly rewards all aspects of skating - not just jumping. I think this system has potential to give skater/ coach/ choreographer teams amazing flexibility to construct programs that truly highlight a given skaters strengths, and be rewarded. I think we've only seen the tip of the iceberg in that regard, and next year's programs should be even better.

Rain, I'm with you on the disappointment overall in the limited number of clean performances, much less real "stand out" performances ala S&Z. I realize the altitude issue is tough, but in the case of the men in particular, I don't think we saw too many truly great performances at any altitude so far this year.

I truly admire real champions like S&Z and Fumie who managed to put together stand out, winning performances regardless of the challenging factors. I hope we see more performances like that as the season progresses!

LOL, I can't believe I say this stuff when I could make it around the rink once on my hands and knees without falling on my face.....

DG

 

[Nadine]

Belated thoughts on the aforementioned GPF...

Emanuel Sandhu - nice program.......haven't watched any of the men since Skate America or Skate Canada b/c I find them zzzz this season.......however decided to watch Sandhu & Plushenko b/c of the comments I read earlier about them on the net last week as concerned the GPF. And nothing has really changed for me concerning Sandhu.......obviously still has great presentation.......but this time he was able to land the jumps. And I say "good for him - CONGRATS"! But, alas, he doesn't move me nor has he ever (oops, when he first came onto the scene I was impressed by him, but the novelty has worn off for me). Anyhow, good job, Emanuel! ^)

Evgeni Plushenko - darn, I wish I would've taped this, as well as his NHK exhibition, b/c he truly blew me away (no lie). Wasn't expecting it b/c the last time I saw him skate earlier in the season I wasn't impressed at all. Thus, have avoided watching the men all together. Anyhow, as with the NHK exhibition, everything seemed to flow & he really seemed into the music & the moves. And to top it all off, the jumps were there as well as the spins (though the last one was kinda slow).

***Note: the two men that I watched - Sandhu & Plushenko - really seemed to take their skating up a notch for the GPF. And, as a fan of f.s., I really appreciated it. BRAVO! Thank You. ^)***

Now for a downer.......Dick Button'scommentary at the very end of the men's competition.........really p***ed me off (no lie). And, as a result, have lost quite a bit of respect that I used to hold for him. First off, throughout Plushenko's skate he raved about his choreography, jumps, et al. And both he & Terry Gannon kept saying (at the end of Plushenko's performance) how he was definitely going to win, blah blah. Then when it was discovered that Plushenko didn't win (btw kudos to Evgeni for the excellent sportsmanlike way he handled himself in the interview afterward & his praising of Emanuel), Dick Button says something to the effect of "oooooh, this is what figure skating is ALL about, artistry/choreography/dancing etc. etc., NOT all those damn triple jumps." I beg to differ - not about the results here (think this will make Evgeni stronger & more apt to work harder on his choreography and moves in between) - but about what figure skating is all about. Heck, for me it's not about what he constantly goes on & on about (btw Dick in his eligible days was known as a jumper, his presentation was ugh; maybe this is why he picks on those that he thinks are like him). If he doesn't like the jumps, then go watch ice dance & commentate for them b/c, to me, ice dance is not a sport and something I personally detest (especially since A&P and B&K left). Rant over, I can no longer take Dick's hypocritical commentary about jumps seriously (e.g. afterwards he was raving on & on about Sebestyen's jumps; however I kept thinking what a total & complete hypocrite; will no longer pay attention to him). Btw, great for Button & his COP - dancing on ice, no jumps, falls count, restrictions to the max (no free skating) - what an exciting so-called sport. :\

Julia Sebestyen - she reminds me of Irina Slutskaya so much in terms of not only looks but athleticism as well.......loved that she made the Final.......and the jumps that she landed were GORGEOUS (best in the competition by far; reminiscent of Michael Jordan). Good solid skate. Btw, she's a good spinner as well. ^)

Yoshie Onda - I actually like this music (i.e. "God's Face Moving Over The Water").....and in this program I can feel Yoshie's quiet inner soul.......no need for smiles where it doesn't belong IMHO. Good job, Yoshie Bear, don't give up! I'll always be your Fan - once a fan, always a fan, is my motto. ^)

Elena Liashenko - nice mature program, skated pleasantly. Good job! ^)

Shizuka Arakawa - ah, she just keeps getting lovelier & lovelier when it comes to this program (aka "Turandot").......enjoyed it tremendously, as always......and there has been definite improvement as the season has wore on. Can't wait to see her at Worlds! ^)

Sasha Cohen - funny, I was expecting to see a disaster from the talk on the net, but other than the falls (which I admit should be taken into account when scoring) she was spot on IMHO in terms of delivery, passion, fire, choreography, et al. She didn't give up, and I admire that. Good job! ^)

Fumie Suguri - wow, the first thing I noticed was her blindingly fast speed........man, she literally flew over the ice from beginning to end........amazing to watch (no lie). Kudos to her for taking it up a notch when it comes to the big competitions and for being well prepared. Well deserved win! ^)

Peace & Love, Nadine

P.S. All in all, a pleasant afternoon of skating, just get rid of Ole Dick.

 

[thisthingcalledlove]

ladies

Sebestyen is trying too hard to be Slutskaya. From the haircut right down to the tan boots and gold blades. IMHO I think she has bigger jumps than Slutskaya; she should try to look like herself more.

I don't like Sasha's Swan Lake cut. Maybe I'm alone on this one, but it's too abrupt for me. I like tempo changes that are gradual, and the slow section before the final presto (they took the slow section from ACT II, the presto from ACT III- the same presto used in Butryskaya's old Swan Lake LP) didn't fit with the presto. Oh well. Maybe it's because it was the first time I saw it, and maybe it'll grow on me. The opening cut (the Prologue) was beautiful, but there was nothing in it that wasn't already used by other skaters. I want skaters to use the Finale. That one uses the Swan motif and turns it into this violent dance of death- Great for footwork...

 

[Mathman]

Well, I finally got to see Plushenko's skate. It was on CBC, just over now.

Not to take anything away from Sandhu's performance, but to me Plushenko was still in a class by himself. I bet he won't make any mental lapses about the CoP rules again.

Mathman

 

[curious]

better to lose giving a great performance on a technicality. Plushy will be ready to kick butt at worlds.

 

[JonnyCoop]

Just got done watching all of it (yeah, I know, it took me a while )... Thought Sandhu's program was by far the most interesting men's program I've seen all year and if he could skate that well ALL the time (without the couple of iffy landings he had), Plushenko would seriously have to watch his back! Van der Perren was good, too, but as far as I'm concerned, all he pretty much has to do is stand there and he'd pretty much be a hit. Less said about Weiss, the better, tho I hope he plans on shaving that stupid thing off his chin for Nationals.

I thought all 6 of the ladies were wonderful, especially Arakawa, just a total class act there. I really like Sebestyen's program, but I wish she'd kick up her presentation a notch or two, because I think if she skated it clean and vamped it up a little, she could really have them out of their seats. Cohen's program this year seems off to me; one of the things I like about her is her ability to really use almost every note of her music, and this year there seems to be a lot of dead time between her elements, tho when she hits those, they're beautiful. Onda is coming along well, it's good to see her using choregraphy now as opposed to just jump jump jump like she's done in the past. Suguri was excellent, but I do think Arakawa was the best of the night.