Sasha. Comeback. Believe it.

[Mathman]

Yeah but can we actually be sure they will judge things fairly? Because I'm not.

We are always at the mercy of the judges. But I do not put much stock in all the sininster theories about factions in the USFS inner sanctum that are pro or anti a particular skater.

When it comes to selection to the Olympic team, I do not see any other possible motivation for the Association than to put the strongest possible team on the ice and hope for the best.

Yes, they gave Michelle the benefit of the doubt in 2006. But Michelle was the U.S. chanpion the year before, a five time world champion, etc., etc., etc. Neither Michelle now, nor Sasha, nor anyone else will be seeking any special deals this time around.

Here are the guidelines for selecting the Olympic team (in the official language, for nominating the team to the USOC.) In order of importance, they will take into account.

1. Placement at 2010 Nationals (January 1-14).

2. 2009 Grand Prix finals (Dec.3, 2009).

3. 2009 Worlds (Rachael was 5th, Alissa 11th).

4. "The most recent Four Continents." (Caroline was 4th at 2009 Four C's, Racahel 7th, Alissa 9th. In 2010, Four C's is squeezed in between U.S. Nationals and the Olympics. Conceivably, if USFS were in doubt, they could wait until after 4C's to make their final decision. I think it is more likely that they will name the Olympic team right after Nationals and not even send those skaters to 4C's.)

5. 2009 Junior Worlds. (Caroline was second, Ashley third.)

6. 2009 Junior Grand Prix final. (Will not play a role this year.)

Caroline and Rachael are the only skaters that carry any brownie points forward. I absolutely agree with Particle Man that Sasha will have to get first or second at U.S. Nationals to make the team -- and the same goes for everyone.

(On the men's side, I think Lysacek would go even if he finishes 4th at Nationals.)

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

What I do not understand is Sasha's drive! Why would she want to do the GPs when she doesn't have to, and the USFS is not forcing her? All she has to do is to make a good impression at Nats, and she will be selected to be on the Team. So the theory that the USFS will select her as part of team regardless of placement has merit. All she has to do is make an impression at Nationals.

We will never know what her strategy was to play with the GPs, and given this chestnut, if she does poorly, it will be remembered in the international scheme of being less than bright.

Sasha, Sasha, Sasha, just do the Nats, The GPs are only relevant in the Finals, and in an Olympic season - not even that.

 

[R.D.]

Sasha, Sasha, Sasha, just do the Nats, The GPs are only relevant in the Finals, and in an Olympic season - not even that.

But she has been GONE for 3.5 years. She needs all the experience she can get. Of course, she could just come into Nats and wing it, and that's what she might just do. Do you guys REALLY think she'll actually show up at SA? She's pulled out the last two times she got the event.

unless, of course, she secretly wants another shot at an OGM and is trying to deflect additional pressure by telling the public "it's not about medals, it's about me" or some statement of the sort (Which, I think, is actually a smart move)

Still, she would have been back last season IMHO if that were the case...so in that case, you actually raise a good point.

 

[jjane45]

What do you mean by self-destructs? What if she places 3rd at each? You seem to be suggesting that she'll get to go to the Olympics whether she earns it or not.

Did you miss out of this year's Nationals and all the judging controversies altogether? Please please fair judging at Nationals especially in an Olympic year!!!

 

[Spun Silver]

Did you miss out of this year's Nationals and all the judging controversies altogether? Please please fair judging at Nationals especially in an Olympic year!!!

Argue about specific judging calls, but the idea of the judges conspiring to put an undeserving skater on a Worlds or Oly team just seems silly and I'm very dubious that's what happened with Alissa. What would the point be? Sure, pushing an undertrained Sasha would get PR and sell tickets, but she'd also lose one for the team.

With Sasha, she's so far from being the apple of the judges' eyes, after her long break, that IMO she'll be lucky to be judged fairly. I don't think she'll get any breaks other than being allowed to compete at GPs - especially after Alissa this year, not to mention Michelle in 2006.

I don't understand the theory of Sasha skating just in Nats (Joe). Surely she needs the international judges to see her.

 

[antmanb]

What if Sasha only gets one GP spot and Rachael beats her at Skate America. Then, Rachael/Caroline both make GPF, and Caroline beats Rachael there?

What are they going to do then.

Or, Sasha gets two GP spots, and Caroline and Rachael do better at the GP than Sasha does?

Doesn't the USFSA rule say that they name the team based on the results of a bunch of competitions starting with Nationals and then running through worlds, 4cc, GPF, GPs. While they leave themselves discretion, if Sasha doesn't skate at nationals there is simply no way they will consider her over nationals 1 and 2 finshers because the people likely to be at the top of the nationals podium will have track records at the previous worlds and 4CC that Sasha doesn't. Unless Sasha went to two GPs won both, won the final and withdraws from nationals with some minor injury that will be fixed in time for the Olys she will not be picked over nationals 1 and 2 finishers.

Ant

 

[Andalusia]

Argue about specific judging calls, but the idea of the judges conspiring to put an undeserving skater on a Worlds or Oly team just seems silly and I'm very dubious that's what happened with Alissa. What would the point be? Sure, pushing an undertrained Sasha would get PR and sell tickets, but she'd also lose one for the team.

Yes, but the Nats judges also crowned their most inconsistent skater ever and sent her to Worlds last season when precious Olympic spots were on the line. Alissa could have placed third or lower and no one would have cried foul over the judging. So, who knows what politicking, if any, had been going on.

I absolutely do not put it behind the Nats judges and/or the USFSA to give Sasha inflated PCS, thereby placing her at the top of the podium or near it (that is, if they want her on the Olympic team). Even the technical marking may be questionable, considering Ashley Wagner's flutz was totally ignored in her Nats LP last season. Of course, if Sasha goes out there and completely bombs, the judges will be hard-pressed to hold her up, but if she manages a clean SP and one or two errors in the LP, I would not be surprised if the judges reward her generously in PCS. I think Sasha is capable of two good performances at Nats, especially since she would be slowly peaking and working her kinks out throughout the GP series.

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

But she has been GONE for 3.5 years. She needs all the experience she can get. Of course, she could just come into Nats and wing it, and that's what she might just do. Do you guys REALLY think she'll actually show up at SA? She's pulled out the last two times she got the event.

She has been skating for 3.5 years and very much in front of an audience and critics. While it is not doing triples, it does keep one in shape.

unless, of course, she secretly wants another shot at an OGM and is trying to deflect additional pressure by telling the public "it's not about medals, it's about me" or some statement of the sort (Which, I think, is actually a smart move)

What is it about "me"? Where am I going? No acting, no designing, no hollywood, not much of anything except skating. She has a drive to be remembered somehow, and skating is her best way, imo.

Still, she would have been back last season IMHO if that were the case...so in that case, you actually raise a good point.

I think she is thinking about her future. Can't blame her for that. Will she continue in SOA after a new Oly champ is crowned? She will have more pressure than Kwan had chasing her 10 gold US Nats medals.

 

[fairly4]

since when will the USFSA hold Sasha down at nationals,
they won't.

 

[PolymerBob]

Here are the guidelines for selecting the Olympic team.

1. Placement at 2010 Nationals (January 1-14).
2. 2009 Grand Prix finals (Dec.3, 2009).
3. 2009 Worlds (Rachael was 5th, Alissa 11th).
4. "The most recent Four Continents."
5. 2009 Junior Worlds. (Caroline was second, Ashley third.)
6. 2009 Junior Grand Prix final. (Will not play a role this year.)

Sasha will have to get first or second at U.S. Nationals to make the team -- and the same goes for everyone.

Something does not add up. If the last sentence is true, then the previous 5 points are irrelevant. Will the USFSA consider anything other than Nationals to decide the Olympic team? :scratch:

 

[Mathman]

Something does not add up. If the last sentence is true, then the previous 5 points are irrelevant. Will the USFSA consider anything other than Nationals to decide the Olympic team? :scratch:

That is what I believe in my heart of hearts. The other five are largely irrelevant. Note that they sent Mroz ahead of Weir to worlds last year.

The exception would be if one skater tore up the Grand Prix circuit, but finished third behind a lucky skate from an unheralded junior.

As for Sasha, I have to smile at the notion that she is some sort of evil enchantress who has cast a spell over the officials of USFS to rob them of their minds and bind them to her will.

 

[antmanb]

Something does not add up. If the last sentence is true, then the previous 5 points are irrelevant. Will the USFSA consider anything other than Nationals to decide the Olympic team? :scratch:

I strongly suspect that nationals place 1 and 2 will be all that matters in selecting the Olympic team.

The reason (i think) the USFSA clarified this (before the last nationals) was in the likely event that in the singles the skaters could only pull off 2 places for the Olympics. As it happens, the men did get three and the ladies got 2. I don't think there's any doubt that for the men the winner is guaranteed a trip to the Olys, but for the ladies, they wanted a get out in case a skater who did great in all previous competitions turns up and has a rough night at nationals. Since that hasn't seemingly happened and no one particular skater has been really "dominant" (zhang not going to worlds), Rachel probably the most on of all the skaters (subject to 2009 GPF results) I don't think the USFSA will use anything other than 1&2 at nationals.

Ant

 

[PolymerBob]

I don't entirely agree. If Caroline and Rachael tear a path of destruction through the Grand Prix after the season they just had, then finish 3rd and 4th at Nats, I am pretty sure they will go to the Olympics.

I think that's why the USFSA instituted the new rule.

 

[Sylvia]

I have good reason to believe that what this person posted on FSU is "on the money" about the reason for the rule change: http://www.fsuniverse.net/forum/showpost.php?p=2241999&postcount=16

 

[PolymerBob]

^^ I think that's probably correct. As I remember, the new rule was instituted before the shenanigans at Nationals.

I believe Nationals is still the qualifier for Worlds, just not the Olympics.

 

[antmanb]

I don't entirely agree. If Caroline and Rachael tear a path of destruction through the Grand Prix after the season they just had, then finish 3rd and 4th at Nats, I am pretty sure they will go to the Olympics.

I think that's why the USFSA instituted the new rule.

Technically what happens on the GP doesn't count, it's only the GPF that would count.

Even if, hypothetically speaking, Caroline and Rachel to qualify for the GPF and are the only US skaters there do you honestly believe that Caroline and Rachel finshing 3rd and 4th would get them to the Olympics if e.g. the skaters in 1st and 2nd were Sasha and Mirai/Ashley?

Ant

 

[janetfan]

For better or worse I think the 1-2 finishers at Nationals will go to Vancouver. A good showing at a GP event is always welcome but no way will that be the main criteria for selecting the team. Nationals is closest to Olympics pressure wise and that will make it the determing factor imo.
I hope for Caroline and either Rachael/Mirai.
Sasha would be fine too as long as she earns it. And maybe for Sasha the GP is important since she has been away for the last three seasons.

 

[PolymerBob]

Even if, hypothetically speaking, Caroline and Rachel to qualify for the GPF and are the only US skaters there do you honestly believe that Caroline and Rachel finshing 3rd and 4th would get them to the Olympics if e.g. the skaters in 1st and 2nd were Sasha and Mirai/Ashley?
Ant

If Sasha and Mirai/Ashley bombed during the Grand Prix, then pulled it together at Nationals, then I think Caroline and Rachael go to Vancouver. I think that's why the rule was written.

I don't fully understand this reluctance to accept the new USFSA rule. We seem to think they made up this rule ......... then secretly decided they will ignore it and send the National winners to Vancouver.

 

[Sylvia]

That's because it's not really a "new" rule. USFS has traditionally relied on Nationals as the main Olympic/World team qualifier because it's the fairest way (assuming that all the top contendors are healthy and able to skate their best). Making the GP Final can be a bit of a crapshoot (as we all know), so it's not really a good idea to put too much weight on GPF results.

 

[nubka]

in clarification to mine, sasha claims tenditis already, which is overuse of tendons by doing the same thing over/over example skating.
sasha is a competitior and a professional (so to speak) staying in skating and receiving money in other words > Her job.

When i overused my tendons, i couldnt come and claim at work , or they hurt so i won't work or cut back. I had to fill my quota, in other words , I had to keep up my excellent quoto and work. (otherwise it would affect my paycheck/promotion/ job. When I had neck and back pain, i had to work through it.
My co-workers would not appreciate picking up my slack at work for back, neck, pinch nerve, tenditis. I had to fulfill my obiligation at work by doing my own work and not letting other people pick up. They don't feel sorry for you because of back injury, tenditis when they can claim the same injury and they work through it.

Funny how Sasha injuries are okay to spread and feel sorry for but not caroline's (her what every she claimed this year) and not michelle's in years past.
Sasha is an elite skater , as such she knows these types of injuries comes with the job. so if she is really hurt and she claims she should quit /and or go see a doctor and not use it as an excuse for not skating well.

See they worked behind the scenes for sasha the past 3 years and not allowed the younger skaters to get ahead so they can put her on the Olympic team without going to nationals. if they got her two gp events, they already have on the team and in fairness to the other skaters, they should say so.
But not saying anything and answering me back. they essentially are agreeing with this position. Sasha already on the olympic team at the expense of a younger skater.
one thing they allowed michelle to get ***** about in 2006. Sasha isn't allowed any negative publicity. unfair and discrimantory

Sounds like someone has a giant axe to grind...:scowl: