Senior Ladies LP
- Thread starter Pikachuusb
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The protocols are up. Zhang received ! for three of her jumps (both lutz and flips). Her 3-3 was downgraded and scored only 5.37. Her PCS scores are all over including two 4s and four 8s (3 are from the same judge). Flatt also got a ! for her flip. Her 3-3 was downgraded as well. I'm noticing that she barely accumulated any positive GOEs on any of her elements, and in fact, when everything is done, her total tech score is slightly lower than her base value. On the other hand, Czisny earned almost 6 extra points on the total element score compared to her base value, mostly from her spins and spiral sequence. Her PCS scores are noticeably higher than all the others with lots of 8s. One judge gave her 8.75 for interpretation but I think the same judge gave 8.5 for Zhang for interpretation as well.
Interestingly Wagner, Flatt and Zhang all got level 4 for all of their spins and spiral sequence but Czisny got level 3 for her combination spin.
I watched Czisny's free program again on Youtube this morning and thought her win was well deserved. (I wasn't really enjoying her program last night because I was holding my breath) Yes, she had only 3 triples but then we just didn't have any skaters last night who had both technical content and artistry. However, I must say though, that if Flatt had won last night, I wouldn't have complained either. She skated well, at least her jumps were there, but what she was lacking was charisma that we have seen in Kwan and Cohen. She just didn't feel like 'a champion and I hope that she will grow and develop into one.
Interestingly Wagner, Flatt and Zhang all got level 4 for all of their spins and spiral sequence but Czisny got level 3 for her combination spin.
I watched Czisny's free program again on Youtube this morning and thought her win was well deserved. (I wasn't really enjoying her program last night because I was holding my breath) Yes, she had only 3 triples but then we just didn't have any skaters last night who had both technical content and artistry. However, I must say though, that if Flatt had won last night, I wouldn't have complained either. She skated well, at least her jumps were there, but what she was lacking was charisma that we have seen in Kwan and Cohen. She just didn't feel like 'a champion and I hope that she will grow and develop into one.
- Joined
- Jan 23, 2004
What is the point of a slkater doing 3-3 and consistently getting downgraded.
Either fix the jump or stop doing it. It makes more sense to me to do a clean and fully rotated 3-2 and get full credit for that and try to make up the points somewhere else..
Either fix the jump or stop doing it. It makes more sense to me to do a clean and fully rotated 3-2 and get full credit for that and try to make up the points somewhere else..
- Joined
- Jul 11, 2003
What Czisny brought to the competition was a clean SP, and only 1 fall to the LP. Everyone was happy. The Ovation came after the SP; and not quite after the LP.
My personal opinion was that she was extremely careful in both routines. I think this is the way for her to go. However, it does not give one the Czisny with the flair.
My personal opinion was that she was extremely careful in both routines. I think this is the way for her to go. However, it does not give one the Czisny with the flair.
- Joined
- Feb 17, 2007
I very much like Alissa, but had this been an international competition, I don't think it would have turned out this way. I have a feeling USFSA will be slower than usual to pick the ladies' teams for upcomming events.
As for the champion getting a guaranteed spot at Worlds, ................... well ....
If you own a Bible, open it up the book of Exodus, and see which Commandment makes that guarantee.
As for the champion getting a guaranteed spot at Worlds, ................... well ....
If you own a Bible, open it up the book of Exodus, and see which Commandment makes that guarantee.
Getting away from the who should have won exchanges, I was glad that Rizzo got nice PSCs. Yeah I am bored with Carmen but she has good presentation.
Overall I thought the judging was relatively good, relative to this being a Nats. Let's see how AC and RF skate at Worlds and how the judges assess them. Only two months to go lol.
Overall I thought the judging was relatively good, relative to this being a Nats. Let's see how AC and RF skate at Worlds and how the judges assess them. Only two months to go lol.
- Joined
- Dec 15, 2003
Iam in europe so could not watch. Are there any links to their short or free programs?
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- Aug 10, 2008
Alissa, and medal cerimony:
http://it.youtube.com/results?search_query=alissa+czisny&search_sort=video_date_uploaded
- Joined
- Nov 8, 2007
Aside from all the arguments on fairness of PCS and else, i would just like to say what many other people are probably thinking here:
So happy for Alissa that she could finally nail a good, even if not perfect, competition at nationals. No matter the performance, it feels good thinking that finally all her incredile potential produced a prestigious result.
So happy for Alissa that she could finally nail a good, even if not perfect, competition at nationals. No matter the performance, it feels good thinking that finally all her incredile potential produced a prestigious result.
Where are the protocols listed? One of the most annoying things about COP is the delay in issuing the judges' scores. I
- Joined
- Jun 27, 2003
I watched it this morning. I cried when Alissa realized she'd won.
Personally, I think the right of the two ladies won. Yes Rachel nailed everything but other than that I didn't feel there was much there. And I dont blame the choreography... Rachel just doesn't have a spark and doesn't really feel this music. Was she playing it safe and just counting points this time around, or is it the program? I don't know. But it didn't feel inspired. I agree with Scott - Alissa's had soul. She poured her heart into it. Yes, she showed that she knew she didn't do enough to win the free skate, but she had a nice cushion from the SP.
I thought Caroline had better presentation than Rachel, but she is very slow (though she seemed faster in the LP than the SP) and I think that's what's held her back at this competition.
Ashley's comeback was great, and I hope she can at least make it to 4CC.
Personally, I think the right of the two ladies won. Yes Rachel nailed everything but other than that I didn't feel there was much there. And I dont blame the choreography... Rachel just doesn't have a spark and doesn't really feel this music. Was she playing it safe and just counting points this time around, or is it the program? I don't know. But it didn't feel inspired. I agree with Scott - Alissa's had soul. She poured her heart into it. Yes, she showed that she knew she didn't do enough to win the free skate, but she had a nice cushion from the SP.
I thought Caroline had better presentation than Rachel, but she is very slow (though she seemed faster in the LP than the SP) and I think that's what's held her back at this competition.
Ashley's comeback was great, and I hope she can at least make it to 4CC.
- Joined
- Jun 21, 2003
I don't know about the Book of Exodus
, but in the USFSA by-laws, it is article ICR 6.04 (page 67).http://www.usfigureskating.org/Content/2008-09 RB Part 1 Bylaws.pdf
- Joined
- Mar 14, 2006
I just want to add that I'm very proud of Kristine Musademba (11th)! She looked regal out there - very secure and lovely. She'll be fabulous next year.
Any reports on how Angela Maxwell and Becky Bereswill skated?
Any reports on how Angela Maxwell and Becky Bereswill skated?
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- Joined
- Jun 21, 2003
As much as I am happy for Alissa, it is always a little disappointing -- especially to the skater -- when he/she wins by building up an early lead then backs into the championship with a less than stellar finale. (Mirai in 2008, Kimmie in 2007 --where, BTW, Alissa won the free program but was too far behind in the short.)
That's the trade-off of the CoP -- points, rather than placements, carry over.
At Worlds, Alissa will absolutely have to nail every one of her jumps in both the short and long to get a top six placement.
:agree: I do think that the IJS overpenalizes underrotations compared to its leniency towrad other errors. But the crackdown on URs has had one beneficial effect that actually surprised me a little -- it has unmasked the myth of the ladies' triple-triple combination.
That's the trade-off of the CoP -- points, rather than placements, carry over.
At Worlds, Alissa will absolutely have to nail every one of her jumps in both the short and long to get a top six placement.
Demanaris5 said:
:agree: I do think that the IJS overpenalizes underrotations compared to its leniency towrad other errors. But the crackdown on URs has had one beneficial effect that actually surprised me a little -- it has unmasked the myth of the ladies' triple-triple combination.
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Finally got around to seeing it. I chose to stop following this thread last night and decided I'd just wait and watch it unfold.
And I'm glad I did, although the anticipation was all but gone by then. Congrats to Alyssa BTW- to be honest, I don't know what to think of the final result. I knew it would be close, but I think it could have gone either way. I think the margin of victory was larger than it should have been, though. Rachel barely made up any ground despite throwing it down. Now, I think that was actually one of Alyssa's better Nationals freeskates, not as good as in 2007, but it could have been MUCH worse considering the pressure she was under. And I have to hand it to Mirai for pulling through like that. I figured she was DITW after seeing her cry even before she took the ice...like she KNEW it was going to be a disaster. Also Wagner for pulling all the way up to 4th- good for her. That SP took her out of Worlds contention, though, like I thought.
I think what sort of dulled the moment somewhat was Alyssa not being happy with her performance. I have to agree with the commentators in that there were actually some positive points to that skate and by her standards, it wasn't half bad. We've seen her melt down before and this wasn't even close. But I can't help but feel that being the emotional/sentimental favorite helped push her scores up just a tiny bit. And it could have made the difference in the results given her mistakes.
I guess this means that Czisny has to go to worlds then- she has work to do and I think she knows this, if her reaction following the FS was any indication. But seriously, nice to see her pull off this win. Like I say time and time again, consistency doesn't matter so much as delivering when it counts, and she did it here, at least in the SP, to give herself enough wiggle room in the free to afford a mistake and still win. At least she can say she has a major championship under her belt now. I think the topic now shifts to whether or not she'll make it to Four Continents in February.
And I'm glad I did, although the anticipation was all but gone by then. Congrats to Alyssa BTW- to be honest, I don't know what to think of the final result. I knew it would be close, but I think it could have gone either way. I think the margin of victory was larger than it should have been, though. Rachel barely made up any ground despite throwing it down. Now, I think that was actually one of Alyssa's better Nationals freeskates, not as good as in 2007, but it could have been MUCH worse considering the pressure she was under. And I have to hand it to Mirai for pulling through like that. I figured she was DITW after seeing her cry even before she took the ice...like she KNEW it was going to be a disaster. Also Wagner for pulling all the way up to 4th- good for her. That SP took her out of Worlds contention, though, like I thought.
I think what sort of dulled the moment somewhat was Alyssa not being happy with her performance. I have to agree with the commentators in that there were actually some positive points to that skate and by her standards, it wasn't half bad. We've seen her melt down before and this wasn't even close. But I can't help but feel that being the emotional/sentimental favorite helped push her scores up just a tiny bit. And it could have made the difference in the results given her mistakes.
I guess this means that Czisny has to go to worlds then- she has work to do and I think she knows this, if her reaction following the FS was any indication. But seriously, nice to see her pull off this win. Like I say time and time again, consistency doesn't matter so much as delivering when it counts, and she did it here, at least in the SP, to give herself enough wiggle room in the free to afford a mistake and still win. At least she can say she has a major championship under her belt now. I think the topic now shifts to whether or not she'll make it to Four Continents in February.
I'm so curious about the assignments of 4CC and Jr.Worlds; personally, I think it would be crazy to send Ashley to Jr Worlds, it would be very weird. What about this;
Alissa Czisny: world championships, does not do 4CC because it's like *next week* and she has the world university winter games to attend in February and can use that competition as preparation for Worlds.
Rachael Flatt: Worlds and 4CC
Caroline Zhang: 4CC
Ashley Wagner: 4CC
Mirai Nagasu? JR Worlds again? Or is she going to rest that ankle, which would probably be more sensible.
Alissa Czisny: world championships, does not do 4CC because it's like *next week* and she has the world university winter games to attend in February and can use that competition as preparation for Worlds.
Rachael Flatt: Worlds and 4CC
Caroline Zhang: 4CC
Ashley Wagner: 4CC
Mirai Nagasu? JR Worlds again? Or is she going to rest that ankle, which would probably be more sensible.
someone asked earlier in the thread if this nationals was really emotional - it really was for me, I cried a lot, and haven't even really been into the ladies much. So many really fought for their programs - and for me, any of the top four could have been in any order and I would have said, yep.
I'm thrilled Alyssa won, hate that it is 'marred' with a fall, and really understand why some would ask: what does Flatt have to do? But, I think i'm with Red Dog - I can still see Alyssa winning, but maybe with just a few less overall points. I think Wagner and Flatt and Nagusu and zhang and so many others should be proud. The biggest sad point is Bebe - I hope she is ok.
I like the idea of NOT sending Alyssa to 4CC to let others go - while she competes a little later in Collegiate then worlds...here's hoping.
I'm thrilled Alyssa won, hate that it is 'marred' with a fall, and really understand why some would ask: what does Flatt have to do? But, I think i'm with Red Dog - I can still see Alyssa winning, but maybe with just a few less overall points. I think Wagner and Flatt and Nagusu and zhang and so many others should be proud. The biggest sad point is Bebe - I hope she is ok.
I like the idea of NOT sending Alyssa to 4CC to let others go - while she competes a little later in Collegiate then worlds...here's hoping.
- Joined
- Aug 10, 2008
I think that her major rivals will be: Rochette, Suguri, Lepisto, Ando. These Ladies will be very motivated (I'm not sure about Ando). It's quite a difficult task for our Alissa, but who knows. After the SP all sort of things happen in this season. I'm afraid for the Lutz though.
Oh, I forgot Alyssa has that college event in Feb. Then, that will be her practice event...then it's straight onto Worlds. I must say, if "Good Alyssa" showed up even under all that pressure of being the leader and virtually everyone before her skating so well (yes, I know she made mistakes, but she still held it together IMO), I find myself suddenly having more confidence in her heading into the world championship. I still think Flatt is our best hope, but if Alyssa can skate like she did Thursday and last night, I think she will find herself in the top 10. Obviously, she may need help from the European ladies in particular, and maybe even her fellow teammate, but due to the rule we have no choice but to support her and put our Olympic hopes on her. Just what I feared, but suddenly I have hope that she may actually be able to pull it off. Let's just hope this win isn't a fluke, that's all.
ETA: I remember I sent her a note of congrats when she won bronze in '07. I think I'll do it again this year.
ETA: I remember I sent her a note of congrats when she won bronze in '07. I think I'll do it again this year.
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