You should check out Ilia Kulik's 3a. To me, that's the axel.
Some scientific analysis of Mao's 3A
- Thread starter Bennett
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You should check out Ilia Kulik's 3a. To me, that's the axel.
When you say looks sturdier on the ice, do you mean her physical appearance? Or are you saying her landings, etc, on the ice look sturdier? If you're saying physically sturdier, I would disagree. To me, Yuna looks painfully thin, Mao just looks thin. They are both very beautiful girls, however, and both look glowingly healthy.
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- Aug 8, 2009
The best thing to do is to actually go back and look at Yuna's skating. If you look carefully, you will see that Yuna's back remains fairly flexible, while her ankles and knees are now less flexible (almost immovable) compared to before.
This goes to show that if Yuna retires soonish after the Olympics, which is what has been indicated/hinted, it will not be because of her back so much, but more because I feel that her technique on her toe jumps incurrs great burden on the whole of her physique. She may be smiling as she lands those jumps, but I wouldn't underestimate the shock that those combinations give to her system.
In order to be able to land those triple-triple, she has to practice them, say, 5~10 times a day, 5 days out of the week. If she practices them 5 times a day, then that's 25 triple-triple combos per week, if 10 times, 50 combos per week. That's 100~200 combos a month she's practicing, meaning she's done 3600~7200 combo jumps in the past three years. (This is a very conservative estimate.)
Just go to an ice skating rink and try banging your toe into the ice with the intent to cause a force that would propell you into the air enough to complete three rotations. Next, jump into the air as high as you can (while skating backward if you can) and try landing it on one feet. In one combination, she does that twice, meaning she's forced herself to go through that 7200~14400 times in the past three years alone, so that she can do it in competition.
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- Oct 24, 2009
As far as toe jumps are concerned, I've notice how high Mao kicks her toe picking leg up before she does her flip jump. Higher than many other female skaters except skater like Caroline Zhang who has a huge kick. Good thing she does more edge jumps than toe pick jumps. Imagine the shock that she must put her knees, ankles, hips and everything else.
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- Aug 8, 2009
Well, as I pointed out earlier, they've already changed her toe loop technique, and I think they're going to change Mao's flip and lutz technique after the Olympics. They'll have to. Toe jumps with any kind of banging involved is lethal to the body.
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- Oct 24, 2009
Didn't Tara Lipinski injure her hips due to her practicing the 3Lo+3Lo combination? It seem edge jumps also detrimental effects on the body. It is no wonder that many singles skaters retire in their early 20's. I wonder how Shen/Zhao manage to still skate at top level in their 30's? I guess they have less jumps.
Because for pairs, there's someone else helping you along and if you're the girl and get tired, the guy can carry you along
. That's why I think single ladies should turn to pair skating when they get older 
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- Aug 8, 2009
Well, I don't know about bringing in Shen/Zhao into this discussion, but your point that the loop can be dangerous is taken. I guess that's why Mao doesn't plan for loop-loop combos.
Look, figure skating is a dangerous sport for all, including Mao. Someone asked why Mao doesn't do triple-triple, and I just pointed out that triple-triples are very burdensome to the body, during which discussion I pointed out the danger of doing toe jumps with a certain technique.
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- Nov 12, 2009
Yuna appears to have a bigger frame than Mao, even though Yuna's super thin, she actually has shoulders and hips, where Mao is more straight up and down. Yuna's legs also look more muscular, but that again might be do to the fact that she stretches less; the more you stretch the less muscle "bulk" you have. Yuna is listed as 5'5" and 103 lb and Mao as 5'4" and 99 lb and the general rule is you add 5 pounds per inch so they are virtually the same size, just built a little differently.
I tend to think they are healthy though because two signs that a person is too thin are yellowish skin, and thinning of and loss of sheen in hair. Mao and Yuna both have great skin and thick, shiny hair so I think they are fine. A lot of Asian teenagers are really thin. Miki doesn't weigh much more than either of them, and I have never thought of her as too thin, although she has lost weight since the 2006 olympics.
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- Nov 12, 2009
Tara did, but I think that was partially due to her growing and going through puberty. When she won the Olympics, she had not hit puberty or certainly looked like she had not . At 19 I think Mao and Yuna are probably done growing so this is less of a concern. Athletes often get injured during the years they are growing a lot (Yuna in 2006, Mirai last year, Caroline this year), but the injuries tend to come less often when they are done growing.
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- Nov 7, 2007
The Truth about Knee Bending
The unusual heavy knee bending has nothing to do with a soft knee or
a stiff knee in any jumps.
While Midori Ito uses her speed to get the hight & distance(Running jump)...
Mao Asada kills her speed for pre-rotation... consequently she must rely
heavily on her knee to get the hight & distance.(Standing jump)
A Standing jump requires a lot more "Knee Bending" than a running jump.
Try yourself at home.
The unusual knee bending is directly related with pre-rotation.
The unusual heavy knee bending has nothing to do with a soft knee or
a stiff knee in any jumps.
While Midori Ito uses her speed to get the hight & distance(Running jump)...
Mao Asada kills her speed for pre-rotation... consequently she must rely
heavily on her knee to get the hight & distance.(Standing jump)
A Standing jump requires a lot more "Knee Bending" than a running jump.
Try yourself at home.
The unusual knee bending is directly related with pre-rotation.
- Joined
- Oct 24, 2009
Here is what the ISU rules say about cheated take off:
So does this mean if the pre rotation is clearly more than 1/4 turn is it a cheated take off? Not sure..
I guess if the pre rotation is clearly more than 1/4 turn and take off does not happen until the end of the pre rotation, it would be considered a cheated take off.
Edit: Guide lines for jump GOE's from ISU rules:
However, nothing about "light, floating quality."
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Maybe the "light, floating quality" refers to no. 6 : superior flow? I've heard commentators praise her great flow on ice. I think this is just her style of skating. When Mao's does her jumps well, they seem so light and effortless as if she were floating on ice. Her Nocturne SP is the best example of this. I think this is partly influenced by her ballet background.
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- Oct 24, 2009
It actually states "delay in rotation" which usually mean like a delayed Lutz. And also while Mao may get good height on her jumps, distance covered is not her strong point.
That probably applies to delayed jump - i.e. slower roation on the way up, then rotations gets faster on the way down - needs hang time. I don't think Mao's jump fits into this one. You rarely see them in female FS.
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- Feb 5, 2004
Lu chen was the master of delayed rotation (almost sometimes tot eh detriment of landing them!) but she always had thefirst rotation go slowly and the second and third really sped up.
Ant
