Stars on Ice cast

[Manitou]

This is the “chicken or the egg” question and I don’t know the answer. Would bringing international stars help popularity? I really don’t know, because I truly believe that most Americans in the market for SOI would not be any more impressed by bringing in Yuzu than bringing in Vincent. And I say this as someone who would much, much much rather see Yuzu.

I saw international stars in what I swore was Champions on Ice, but now have no idea, in the 80s. Torvill & Dean were the headliners. But T&D were already famous in the US, on national news, and not just for a few seconds, to the extent that I am sorry to say Alina, Yuzu, Tessa & Scott and Aljona & Bruno on their best day combined do not have one tenth the recognition.

I think the recognition comes first, but that is just IMHO.

I might agree with you that Hamilton, Rippon and Eldredge attract more crowds in the US than Evgenia, Alina, Kaetlyn or Yuzuru. You don't target devoted FS fans, but casual people who want to see with their own eyes skaters they already know from mainstream media. And because Rippon has been trying to make lots of noise on media recently, he may bring some casual crowds who want to see a "celebrity" they just saw on TV. Those people don't give rat's a** about Zagitova, Miyahara or Savchenko. Most Americans don't give rat's a** about people whose names they cannot pronounce. That's the sad nature of it. Medvedeva? Who is "Djejeva"?
So while agreeing with you I am also venting my frustration over this reality.

 

[Yatagarasu]

This is the “chicken or the egg” question and I don’t know the answer. Would bringing international stars help popularity? I really don’t know, because I truly believe that most Americans in the market for SOI would not be any more impressed by bringing in Yuzu than bringing in Vincent. And I say this as someone who would much, much much rather see Yuzu.

I saw international stars in what I swore was Champions on Ice, but now have no idea, in the 80s. Torvill & Dean were the headliners. But T&D were already famous in the US, on national news, and not just for a few seconds, to the extent that I am sorry to say Alina, Yuzu, Tessa & Scott and Aljona & Bruno on their best day combined do not have one tenth the recognition.

I think the recognition comes first, but that is just IMHO.

Well, for one, it wouldn't really be something that would get resolved in a year or two, we're talking long term. And long term, the thing that matters most is - marketing.

Depending on your long-term strategies, I do think you'd be surprised how well it could work out. But much like world-wide we're stuck thanks to ISU being completely incompetent in terms of marketing skating, I think USA is stuck in terms of how USFSA is so laser-focused on your own skaters. I mean there's nothing wrong with that, duh, Japanese skaters are primary in Japan, Russians in Russia but there's a more open feel towards the rest and it's only a question of educating your own audiences. This includes squeezing NBC into allowing for a broader feel.

Plus let me tell you something. I think you're seriously underestimating the number of people who travel to see international stars. There were quite a few Americans trying to fight for tickets at both NHK or say FaOI, one of the shows, in Japan or SOI this season. This is a regular thing and it costs them through the roof. Then add all the others, who would travel to US to see them. It's much easier for a Canadian, or a Mexican, or heck even an English speaking Euro, to find our way around the US, than Japan.

There's a market there but it needs to be tapped and that takes long-term planning and marketing, marketing, marketing. Japan does this so wonderfully and Plushenko isn't booked solid until mid-2019 because he's bad at it, or rather, Ari his agent who's been moaning about marketing for ages but simply cannot push through his ideas on a broader scale.

Of course, as I said, shows alone are not enough, it's more of a broader push that's needed to resurrect skating in the US that alas, seems pretty much dead in the water, but on the other hand, I am telling you, even just shows, don't underestimate the audiences, both US and international, who would travel if you just give them the right names. They travel to Japan. They'll travel to the US. But they won't travel just for Ashley and Adam.

 

[Barb]

American people are not interested on international figure skaters, period. That is the reason why US Nationals are more expensive and sell more tickets than Skate America and 4cc even when you can see elite skaters of the prestige of S/M, Mao Asada, V/M, Daisuke T., Patrick in SA and 4cc. SOI is directed to general public, not figure skating fans.

Japanese people are different from any other country, Evgenia, Plushenko, Javier are recognized on the streets, on the Shibs fan thread someone said that she went to Japan for work and the Japanese person with who she worked, knew perfectly who Maia and Alex are.

I am not American, so I don´t understand why someone would prefer see to Ashley or Bradie than S/M or Daisuke, but things are like that. And it seems Canada and Russia are the same.

 

[MACGoldSeal]

I'd be interested in going to the Long Island show, but there is no pair team scheduled. Our Pairs situation is well known to the members of this forum. How are young kids going to experience Pairs skating if a platform like SOI doesn't include it in the program? I'd buy a ticket in a minute if Danny and Tarah were on the roster. They're great people, friendly, talented, the hope for the next few years. As it is, I'm giving this show a pass.

 

[Yatagarasu]

American people are not interested on international figure skaters, period.

See, if that were true, who are the Americans traveling to Japan to see the shows there, or NHK? And these folks exist and they're a regular occurrence. Thanks to Yuzuru, I run into them all the time because of how difficult it is to get tickets in Japan, or needing help to navigate, etc. So it's not true. And Yuzuru is hardly the only person they like. There's a market there. Especially when considering that if you have those names, the international fans would travel.

 

[MACGoldSeal]

Chapis, when I first read your comment, I disagreed with your premise that Americans are not interested in international figure skaters. I was going to tell you of my experience at Skate America, where the support for all the skaters was excellent. The applause and support for all the skaters was loud and appreciative. Then I slapped myself on the head and thought, but who is the audience for Skate America? Hard core fans, not the general public. The Arena wasn't even sold out for any of the segments, either. So, what do we do to get skating back on the radar of the casual skating fan? Where I live we have had Sarah Hughes win a Gold Medal at the Olympics, the New York Islanders win four Stanley Cups in a row in the 1980's, so figure skating and hockey are popular, but what can we do in areas where skating isn't a blip on the screen of casual sports fans?

 

[Barb]

See, if that were true, who are the Americans traveling to Japan to see the shows there, or NHK? And these folks exist and they're a regular occurrence. Thanks to Yuzuru, I run into them all the time because of how difficult it is to get tickets in Japan, or needing help to navigate, etc. So it's not true. And Yuzuru is hardly the only person they like. There's a market there. Especially when considering that if you have those names, the international fans would travel.

Of course they exist, but they are not enough to fill arenas. I have traveled from México to see competitions to other countries and that does not mean that everyone in México are interested in figure skating and that the ISU can come to do competitions here (although it would be great if they did ).

 

[plushyfan]

And it seems that Russia has enough own skating shows. Maybe some American skaters should be invited to Russian skating shows.

Johnny Weir especially but Elladj Balde also skated many times on Plushenko shows. But last years Emanuel Sandhu was there too, and Elvis Stojko also performed on it.

 

[Manitou]

See, if that were true, who are the Americans traveling to Japan to see the shows there, or NHK? And these folks exist and they're a regular occurrence. Thanks to Yuzuru, I run into them all the time because of how difficult it is to get tickets in Japan, or needing help to navigate, etc. So it's not true. And Yuzuru is hardly the only person they like. There's a market there. Especially when considering that if you have those names, the international fans would travel.

I don't know how this is really. There are marketing people who make decisions. They go only for the highest possible probability of success. They do not experiment. And the stereotypes are that Americans like only Americans. That's the best tested formula. It's somebody's money and if you spend money hoping for a return then you may be uncomfortable with experimenting.

It's funny, though, how wrong this can be. Take soccer. For decades the media trumpeted: soccer is not American, soccer will never succeed here, there is no place for soccer! But look around everywhere! There are more kids playing soccer than football. Soccer teams and leauges are going crazy. All tickets for my town's MLS team are sold out one year in advance. There is already obsessive soccer craziness happening. But media are still dumb.

 

[oatmella]

Seems that American skaters are not featured much or at all in international skating shows. The only American skater in the SOI Japan show is Nathan, who has quite a lot of fans in Japan.

 

[Yatagarasu]

Of course they exist, but they are not enough to fill arenas. I have traveled from México to see competitions to other countries and that does not mean that all of Mexico is interested in figure skating and that the ISU can come to do competitions here (although it would be great if they did ).

Of course not (and I know another Mexican who travels for skating lol; it would be great if ISU would get at least something there, maybe Donovan could help in the near future), but this is why I say international fans travel, so you included. If we mix what domestic audience exists, plus the rest, it would be financially viable. That's all that counts at the start and word of a success spreads better than anything. Oh hey, I had a great time, come see. Start with 3 shows, not more.
It's interesting for example that Yuzuru, and Mao too, are pushing down the prices of tickets for their shows currently. The idea is to make it more accessible and family friendly. So another thing that's good to use, as that also helps.

And then, it really is a matter of trying to educate the audiences thanks to a push by both the Fed, and heck, even NBC. It's a thing that would take years but it's not impossible. You just need to want it and get great marketing guys to handle it, boosted by the fed.

 

[Manitou]

You just need to want it and get great marketing guys to handle it, boosted by the fed.

The Fed has much bigger things to worry about than bringing foreign skaters to American SOI...

 

[Yatagarasu]

It's somebody's money and if you spend money hoping for a return then you may be uncomfortable with experimenting.

No risk, no gain. But that's why you limit the initial investment. I mean you have folks like Ari, Plushenko's manager, who have so many years in organizing these under their belt. Start small, market well, get your money back and get the buzz going. Covering the expenses is what you do at the start because the idea is you turn profitable down the line.
And lol true about soccer. I remember that it'll never take hold yet look where USA is now.

Seems that American skaters are not featured much or at all in international skating shows. The only American skater in the SOI Japan show is Nathan, who has quite a lot of fans in Japan.

To take the risk of offending, it's because Nathan is the one US star, talking internationally. Nathan was everywhere last season too, so even before his Worlds win.

ETA and yes, chapis below of course has a point, the Shibs! They're everywhere too.

 

[Sasha'sSpins]

I'm going for Mirai, Nathan, Adam and the Shibs but it'd be nice if Stars On Ice threw in the current Olympic champs and other medallists like Champions On Ice did in days of yore. I'm grateful I got to see Gordeeva & Grinkov, Yagudin, Plushenko, Baiul, Bonaly and many other international stars in their prime. I'm very happy that I got to see Cohen and other U.S. stars later on but it's sad that we get less (if any) international stars now on the Stars On Ice show.

 

[Barb]

Seems that American skaters are not featured much or at all in international skating shows. The only American skater in the SOI Japan show is Nathan, who has quite a lot of fans in Japan.

The Shibs, Mirai, Gracie, Adam were invited recurrent to THE ICE, The Shibs did SOI Japan too and they were in Denis T. skating show in Kazakhstan.

 

[Manitou]

... Start small, market well,

Bringing Medvedeva and Zagitova is not "starting small"...

 

[liv]

Years ago, when I regularly attended Canadian SOI, they had international stars. We had Gordeeva Grinkov, Hamilton, Yamaguchi, Bechke/Petrov, Yagudin etc., come here and perform. I loved it and went yearly back in the mid to late 90s and early 00s. Then it stopped. Suddenly it was Canadian stars with one or two others and I stopped going as the prices rose. My reason for going was to the see the very best, not just the best Canadians (even if they become the world's best). I stopped going and haven't been back since.

 

[Yatagarasu]

Bringing Medvedeva and Zagitova is not "starting small"...

I meant in the number of shows. Like do a 3-day thing, and that's that. Like FaOI does, only instead of the three cities, do just the one spot.

 

[Manitou]

Years ago, when I regularly attended Canadian SOI, they had international stars. We had Gordeeva Grinkov, Hamilton, Yamaguchi, Bechke/Petrov, Yagudin etc., come here and perform. I loved it and went yearly back in the mid to late 90s and early 00s. Then it stopped. Suddenly it was Canadian stars with one or two others and I stopped going as the prices rose. My reason for going was to the see the very best, not just the best Canadians (even if they become the world's best). I stopped going and haven't been back since.

That's exactly like me talking about American SOI....

I remember seeing Yagudin and Slutskaya in my town. Now, if I want to see Evgenia I will have to go Moscow...

 

[RobinA]

Well, whenever they make us a favor by inviting current Russian skaters let me know...

As for this one I don’t think I want to spend an entire evening watching Wagner and Rippon. Limit it to only H/D, S/S and Nathan, or simply take out Wagner and Rippon, then I might be interested.

Count me in. With some French ice dancers and some Japanese skaters and I'm there. I mean, why I STOPPED going to ice shows was because it was too much money for mainly North American skaters who weren't really doing much.