State of US Ladies in skating III: 2014-15 Season
- Thread starter R.D.
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- Jul 31, 2014
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- Feb 26, 2014
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Thanks.So it's not a new video, then. Do we know how is it going now?
I don't think we have heard anything. I don't think it is a high priority right now.
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- Dec 29, 2013
Am I the only one who noticed that the guy holding the fishing rod is clearly helping keep Gracie in the air. It's not that uncommon and I see it a lot in person when coaches go fishing around my rinks but it is very apparent that he is helping her achieve extra air time. Regardless....it looks pretty good but her 2a is already not that great so I'm not expecting anything to come of this. She was a much better jumper back then anyway.
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I thought helping was the point of the pole. Isn't part of the point so the skater can get a feel for it and figure out what they need to change. It seems that even with the support, you still could get a feel for how high you need to be, how fast you need to be, how far you fall from the apex to landing, etc. Basically even with help, I would think a skater could get some idea of what they need to change/work on.
I agree Ashley is skating the best she's ever skated right now, and has a very good shot at the podium (...maybe even the win, but hopefully she doesn't read this; she does better with underdog status).
But I disagree about the competition being weak. Liza and Elena are showing more consistency and/or more technical content than we've usually seen between 2011-2014. We just saw them deliver four clean skates at Europeans, with the result coming down to less than a point. While it's true that Ashley now has no PCS disadvantage--and could even have some advantage over Elena--she has to deliver on her technical content.
That being said, it's not the end of the world if there are no medals this year. So long as the "three per country" limit remains, the Russian girls have pretty much maxed out their dominance so far as Worlds are concerned.
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- Dec 29, 2013
Oh no you're right. The main function of the harness is helping gain air time and also preventing a skater from falling hard which reduces the consequences of failure and encourages better effort by removing some of the fear. I just noticed the coach straining it a bit more than usual in that video than I do in normal real life situations. Then again no one is doing 3a at my rink which requires more air than the standard triples going down around me. No biggie...just an observation.
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- Feb 26, 2014
I know it's not a priority. Just curious since she has been trying apparently, and I had no idea about it.
Nah, that's reaching. Medal threat at her best, but if Nationals was her peak, then it's downhill from there.
The Russians are a given, but Gold is the other factor here and this is where this rivalry could get interesting. Both have a decent shot at 3rd place and I'd say Gold at her very best could even get 2nd. But she will need to deliver 2 clean programs, and so far she has been mostly unable to do so. A bit of "Cohen syndrome" so to speak...if only Wagner fixed her jump issues (particularly in the SP), and combined that with her consistency, she'd really be that "force to be reckoned with" at least in the US.
As for now, Gold has the edge on tech so *if* she hits, she should be the top American and likely standing on the podium, somewhere. Wagner is more of a wildcard, depends on how her jumps are called.
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- Mar 3, 2012
At least they have been keeping the third spot for us ... It wasn't that way for a while.
Well...4CC update:
Edmunds probably had the competition of her life to win her 1st ISU championship - Gold, the favorite, bombed the FS and failed to even medal(!!!)...and Cesario, despite solid skating, still stuck in the middle of the pack (8th), not making much headway.
Now, after 4CCs, the question of Wagner vs. Gold at Worlds can be revisited. Also, where newly crowned 4CC champ Edmunds fits into the picture...
More to come...
Edmunds probably had the competition of her life to win her 1st ISU championship - Gold, the favorite, bombed the FS and failed to even medal(!!!)...and Cesario, despite solid skating, still stuck in the middle of the pack (8th), not making much headway.
Now, after 4CCs, the question of Wagner vs. Gold at Worlds can be revisited. Also, where newly crowned 4CC champ Edmunds fits into the picture...
More to come...
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- Nov 30, 2014
I don't know that I would say that. Gracie bombed big time, and Satoko had uncharacteristic mistakes. Even Polina put it best in her interview afterwards: "I'm very happy that I ended up being a champion today."
She will not medal at Worlds this year. But great job for Polina for pulling out a win tonight.
Are you referring to Edmunds?
Her score - 184 - would have her 8th at 2014 worlds - right where she actually finished with a score 3 points higher - and 7th in 2013.
Nope, not quite there yet. But at the end of the day, it's still ice.
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- Jun 6, 2014
I agree with you sabinfire, its clear that Polina knew she won because the others did not have two clean skates
Not to dredge up the past too much here, but on FSU I posted a bit of a comparison between the careers of Sasha Cohen (arguably the last out of the "golden era" of US ladies skating) and Ashley Wagner (the most decorated US skater of the post-2006 "doldrums"), since the discussion was at the time comparing those two. I know it may not necessarily be a fair comparison, given the differing eras, but I still think it's very telling. Take a look, and either be fascinated - or depressed!
To me, it shows how far US ladies skating has fallen when the most successful US skater post-2006 doesn't even have a single world or Olympic medal while a skater who was often criticized/given a hard time for her skating in the shadow of Kwan still has 3 world medals, an Olympic silver and a very impressive GP record (including a GPF title). Today's US girls would only have half of that in their overly ambitious dreams...
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To me, it shows how far US ladies skating has fallen when the most successful US skater post-2006 doesn't even have a single world or Olympic medal while a skater who was often criticized/given a hard time for her skating in the shadow of Kwan still has 3 world medals, an Olympic silver and a very impressive GP record (including a GPF title). Today's US girls would only have half of that in their overly ambitious dreams...
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Yes, U.S. ladies have gone down since Sasha's days, but I think Sasha had far less competition to deal with than Ashley. There was not a powerhouse of skaters stuck the top, i.e. Yuna/Mao/Carolina. Plus there very solid Japanese skaters in Miki Ando and Akiko Suzuki. And now you have a slew of consistent Russian skaters who could be medal contenders any day of hte week.
While Sasha had tough domestic competition in Michelle Kwan, the international field was not as deep, IMO. Slutskaya was probably the most consistent tough competition, but everyone else was hit and miss including the Japanese skaters -Fumie had a few medals but also was prone to be OTP. Outside of winning WGM in 2004 and OGM in 2006, Shizuka's were pretty dismal. And she didn't even make the Japanese team for some years. Joannie Rochette was a relatively late bloomer and other Canadian ladies never got beyond the top 8. Also there weren't other skaters from non-powerhouse countries that were factors (i.e. Laura Lepisto, Yuna Kim, Carolina). During Sasha's career it was USA v. Russia with some Japanese skaters mixed in (Carolina was the main spoiler to the USA/RUS/JPN party, having finished 3rd in 2005).
That said, Sasha had a very good skating career and I don't want to make it sound like Ashley would have fared better than Sasha had she competed in that field, but the context is worth considering somewhat. And also, the field is getting easier for Ashley now that Mao/Yuna/Carolina is gone. Yes, she has the Russian contingent, but basically she can and has held her own with the Japanese skaters and everyone else from Europe is not that competitive compared to a few years ago.
While Sasha had tough domestic competition in Michelle Kwan, the international field was not as deep, IMO. Slutskaya was probably the most consistent tough competition, but everyone else was hit and miss including the Japanese skaters -Fumie had a few medals but also was prone to be OTP. Outside of winning WGM in 2004 and OGM in 2006, Shizuka's were pretty dismal. And she didn't even make the Japanese team for some years. Joannie Rochette was a relatively late bloomer and other Canadian ladies never got beyond the top 8. Also there weren't other skaters from non-powerhouse countries that were factors (i.e. Laura Lepisto, Yuna Kim, Carolina). During Sasha's career it was USA v. Russia with some Japanese skaters mixed in (Carolina was the main spoiler to the USA/RUS/JPN party, having finished 3rd in 2005).
That said, Sasha had a very good skating career and I don't want to make it sound like Ashley would have fared better than Sasha had she competed in that field, but the context is worth considering somewhat. And also, the field is getting easier for Ashley now that Mao/Yuna/Carolina is gone. Yes, she has the Russian contingent, but basically she can and has held her own with the Japanese skaters and everyone else from Europe is not that competitive compared to a few years ago.
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Very true. Puts a different spin (pun intended) on Sasha's career, where she was often seen as a headcase or not fulfilling her potential when compared to Kwan.
I still think Ashley has a lot to be proud of in her career, and clearly she is not done as she wants to medal at Worlds this year.
It's also a different world out there with COP vs. 6.0. It's no coincidence that US Ladies started to decline once COP was established.
Yes, COP is definitely a factor. IIRC, USFSA was super late adopting it domestically. Sasha actually fared quite well in COP, though. She had some of the highest scores until quite recently.
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