Stiffer Boots/Better Blades for Recreational Skating? | Golden Skate

Stiffer Boots/Better Blades for Recreational Skating?

illogicalskittle

Rinkside
Joined
Apr 9, 2018
So the skate sharpeners at the rink completely botched my blades (pls don't give me grief for this, the skating resources here are absolutely abysmal and I mean it when I say I don't have much of a choice when it comes to sharpeners - even the best one is incredibly hit or miss) and now I'll probably need to start saving up for a new pair.

I skate once a week for 3 hours for recreational purposes and I'm currently on the Jackson Artistes with the Mark IV blade. Again, I don't think there are resources here that would be willing to change out the blade for me since I heard that you can't/its difficult to change the blade due to the sole, hence new skates are in order. The Artistes have last me for close to a year now and have started to breakdown a bit but instead of buying them again, I'm looking into getting a stiffer boot since I have a previous ankle injury and could use the extra support.

I'm thinking of moving up one upgrade to the Jackson Classiques/Elle (I think the Classiques are being discontinued) but the Edea Chorus is also pretty appealing to me because of the stiffness. Though, I don't know if the Chorus is too advanced for me considering I'm just doing forward stroking, edges, crossovers, 3-turns and other basic things and tricks you learn from fooling around on the rink. I would like to take lessons but that can only happen during the later part of the year.

In terms of blades, the sharpeners are less likely to screw up Coronation Aces and almost all the skaters at the rink wear them without much problems with sharpening because this is the blade the sharpeners have the most experience in. Keyword "much" because there is still the odd botched sharpening or three. A part of me is convinced that this blade is a good investment to make since it'll *likely* survive a few sharpenings and make for a better skating experience but I don't know if this is overkill for my skill level.

Any help is welcome! Just keep in mind that I don't have a lot of the things most skating countries have access to, including a good fitter (the only "pro-shop" here has a loooong history of hard selling, over pricing, and wrongly sizing/fitting boots - which I'm a victim of) so any opinion is welcome!
 

Bill S

Rinkside
Joined
Jan 31, 2019
Country
United-States
If you get new boots, Coronation Aces are not overkill for you. They have served legions of beginners and intermediate skaters.
 

MiraiFan

On the Ice
Joined
Oct 6, 2016
I love my Edea Chorus boots and if you want to progress and do more down the line, they are a good choice.
 

Sibelius

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 28, 2017
Skip the Classiques, the Elle is a much better boot, but the blade isn't that great. If they're offered at your shop the Freestyle might be the better "kit" option since the boot is stiffer and the blade is a bit better. If you're looking for a stiffer boot only option in the Jackson line it's the Debut, it's very stiff according to our boot maker (actually there's a standard version and a "firm") version as well). My skater is working on her lower doubles in the standard version, but she's 10 and little. It doesn't come with a blade, so you can put a CA on them if you want (that's what mine has on hers).

As difficult as it might be try to get a proper fit, at least with an Elle and above it can be heat molded (not an option with the Classiques) and that really helps with the fit. Also, you might run into the same problem with the Classiques and blade changes. I know you can change blades on the Elle since we did it.
 

tstop4me

Final Flight
Joined
Oct 2, 2015
(a) The Artistes have PVC soles, and the blades are mounted with screws. So it's possible to remove the current blades, plug the old holes (if needed), drill new holes (if needed), and mount new blades. But if you feel that your current boots don't provide enough support and are starting to break down, it may not be worthwhile. Your next pair of boots may take a different size blade [if you knew for sure that you could transfer your new blades to your next pair of boots, then swapping blades would be worth considering].

(b) There is a problem with "overbooting" in the sense that if you buy boots that are way too stiff, they will have a negative impact on your skating. But if you stick with freestyle blades (i.e., exclude specialty blades such as dance or synchro), I don't think "overblading" is an issue, other than wasted money. That is, a high-end blade won't have negative impact on your skating, but will have special features that you won't use or appreciate. The Coronation Ace (regular version; not the parabolic or Revolution), however, is a solid intermediate blade; you really can't go wrong with it at your level.
 

Sam L

Medalist
Joined
Mar 23, 2014
Isn't Edea Chorus for double jumps? Like others have said above, don't overboot, you don't have something too stiff.

Nothing wrong with overblading but it could be just wasted money. Coronation Aces are very good blade but if I could turn back time I would've gotten the MK professional which has a different spin rocker. I hated the CA spin rocker. These are things you don't know about when you're starting out but then you realise later.
 

Nimyue

On the Ice
Joined
May 15, 2018
Isn't Edea Chorus for double jumps? Like others have said above, don't overboot, you don't have something too stiff.

Nothing wrong with overblading but it could be just wasted money. Coronation Aces are very good blade but if I could turn back time I would've gotten the MK professional which has a different spin rocker. I hated the CA spin rocker. These are things you don't know about when you're starting out but then you realise later.

I actually just traded my MK Pro in or the Coronation Ace lol. I think if I had stayed in a high heeled boot like the Jackson Fusion line or an Edea, the MK Pro would be better because the heel pitch pushed you toward the toe more. But I went to a standard heel and the spin position on the MK Pro was just too far forward for my spins. Fantastic blades for my jumps though. Ultimately, I'm a better jumper than spinner, so I need the spin assistance of the CA more :)

If you have weak ankles an Edea is a terrible boot for you. Edeas let your ankle move back and forward freely. The support is in the sides. If you have ankles prone to injury, a traditional boot that supports you in all directions will probably feel much better for you.

If the Jackson fits your foot comfortably I'd stick with them. If you can afford it, get the Debut and a CA. But you can probably get by in the Elle or Freestyle that comes with a blade. If the sharpener messes up the blade that comes with those, then you can buy a CA.
 

Ic3Rabbit

Patineuse élite et professionnelle
Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 9, 2017
Country
Canada
I actually just traded my MK Pro in or the Coronation Ace lol. I think if I had stayed in a high heeled boot like the Jackson Fusion line or an Edea, the MK Pro would be better because the heel pitch pushed you toward the toe more. But I went to a standard heel and the spin position on the MK Pro was just too far forward for my spins. Fantastic blades for my jumps though. Ultimately, I'm a better jumper than spinner, so I need the spin assistance of the CA more :)

That's the slight difference you will feel between a 7ft to 8ft rocker and everything that goes with it. ;)
 

Sam L

Medalist
Joined
Mar 23, 2014
I actually just traded my MK Pro in or the Coronation Ace lol. I think if I had stayed in a high heeled boot like the Jackson Fusion line or an Edea, the MK Pro would be better because the heel pitch pushed you toward the toe more. But I went to a standard heel and the spin position on the MK Pro was just too far forward for my spins. Fantastic blades for my jumps though. Ultimately, I'm a better jumper than spinner, so I need the spin assistance of the CA more :)

If you have weak ankles an Edea is a terrible boot for you. Edeas let your ankle move back and forward freely. The support is in the sides. If you have ankles prone to injury, a traditional boot that supports you in all directions will probably feel much better for you.

If the Jackson fits your foot comfortably I'd stick with them. If you can afford it, get the Debut and a CA. But you can probably get by in the Elle or Freestyle that comes with a blade. If the sharpener messes up the blade that comes with those, then you can buy a CA.

What makes you think the Coronation ace is good for spinning? It has this weird spin rocker profile where there’s a small 12 inch rocker all the way at the front and then a large 27 inch rocker behind it. I hated spinning on the 27 inch and the 12 inch was too hard to find and you’re stuck somewhere in the middle.
 

Nimyue

On the Ice
Joined
May 15, 2018
What makes you think the Coronation ace is good for spinning? It has this weird spin rocker profile where there’s a small 12 inch rocker all the way at the front and then a large 27 inch rocker behind it. I hated spinning on the 27 inch and the 12 inch was too hard to find and you’re stuck somewhere in the middle.

I said it was better for my spins, not better for all spins. What makes me think that is I tried both. I skated on a CA for 6 months, switched to the MK Pro and had horrible spins and no spin progress, switched back to the CA and not only were my spins back and centered I learned 3 new positions in one day.

Everyone is different. I know skaters who find MK Pros easier to spin on, but for me I just could not adjust to it at all.
 

Elija

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 25, 2019
I said it was better for my spins, not better for all spins. What makes me think that is I tried both. I skated on a CA for 6 months, switched to the MK Pro and had horrible spins and no spin progress, switched back to the CA and not only were my spins back and centered I learned 3 new positions in one day.

Everyone is different. I know skaters who find MK Pros easier to spin on, but for me I just could not adjust to it at all.

Interesting! I have coronation ace blades and have had so much difficulty with my spins since I got them... I always go on my toepick so my spins are super scratchy and I get off balance really easily. I heard that MK professionals are almost exactly the same as coronation ace, but I guess not?? I want to try them now!
 

Ic3Rabbit

Patineuse élite et professionnelle
Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 9, 2017
Country
Canada
Interesting! I have coronation ace blades and have had so much difficulty with my spins since I got them... I always go on my toepick so my spins are super scratchy and I get off balance really easily. I heard that MK professionals are almost exactly the same as coronation ace, but I guess not?? I want to try them now!

MK Pros are a 7 ft rocker, JW Coro Aces are an 8Ft rocker.
 

Ic3Rabbit

Patineuse élite et professionnelle
Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 9, 2017
Country
Canada
JW website lists them as 7ft??

I deal more with Gold Seal and P99 vs Gold Star. Those have different rockers.

There was another JW coronation blade that no longer exists that was 8.5 ft rocker.

IDK what I was thinking earlier, I give many legit blade recommendations here and have many that can vouch for that.
 

Elija

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 25, 2019
I deal more with Gold Seal and P99 vs Gold Star. Those have different rockers.

There was another JW coronation blade that no longer exists that was 8.5 ft rocker.

IDK what I was thinking earlier, I give many legit blade recommendations here and have many that can vouch for that.

Haha all good. Super curious if anyone else has changed from coronation ace to MK professional and how they found it?
 

Nimyue

On the Ice
Joined
May 15, 2018
Haha all good. Super curious if anyone else has changed from coronation ace to MK professional and how they found it?

I did this, then switched back.

Okay, the CA has a spin rocker with 2 radiuses, but for simplicity, lets call is 27". So this is further back under the ball of your foot. This also means it has a gentler slope down from the toe pick.

The MK Pro has a 12" spin rocker. This means the spin position is more toward the front of the ball of the foot. It also means it has a very round slope down from the toe pick. It also has a higher stantion under the heel.

So the MK Pro was really great for my jumps because the large round rocker right behind the toe pick really helped me get to the toe pick to jump off of it and I came down gentler from jumps also. For spinning, because the spin point is more forward and smaller, the spin position is very unforgiving, but produced very fast spins. When spinning on the MK Pro there is very little blade on the ice creating less friction. However, it means that if you change spin positions and rock, getting back to the spin point is more difficult. Plus, because it's forward, you have to be very good at keeping your free hip up. The stnation under the heel is higher so that's a bit easier to get to that spin point.

The CA gentler sloped spin rocker allows for some movement on the rocker without ending the spin. It was easier to change spin positions and easier to save a bad spin entry. However, it's more difficult to jump off the toe and my landings aren't as smooth. The first time I was on this blade again after the MK Pro I noticed the lower heel height of the skate due to the lower stantion. The lower stantion also contributes to making it more difficult to jump off the toe.

If you're in a high heeled boot like the Edea or Jackson Fusion line and have issues with the high heel like leaning forward or spinning too far forward, considering the stantion height might be advised.

So, If you're a strong spinner with solid spin positions, you might really like the MK Pro.

Ultimately, I returned to the CA, because I am not a strong spinner, and I was super frustrated not being able to correct my spins. I also had a much harder time in a sit spin on the MK Pro. The first day back on the CA my sit was all the way down and I learner 3 new positions. I do really miss jumping off the MK Pro though. I have to remind myself to really jump off my toe, and my landings kind of stink as I have a harder time landing on my toe also. But that ultimately bothers me much less than being frustrated with spinning, which I don't overly enjoy anyway.
 

Elija

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 25, 2019
I did this, then switched back.

Okay, the CA has a spin rocker with 2 radiuses, but for simplicity, lets call is 27". So this is further back under the ball of your foot. This also means it has a gentler slope down from the toe pick.

The MK Pro has a 12" spin rocker. This means the spin position is more toward the front of the ball of the foot. It also means it has a very round slope down from the toe pick. It also has a higher stantion under the heel.

So the MK Pro was really great for my jumps because the large round rocker right behind the toe pick really helped me get to the toe pick to jump off of it and I came down gentler from jumps also. For spinning, because the spin point is more forward and smaller, the spin position is very unforgiving, but produced very fast spins. When spinning on the MK Pro there is very little blade on the ice creating less friction. However, it means that if you change spin positions and rock, getting back to the spin point is more difficult. Plus, because it's forward, you have to be very good at keeping your free hip up. The stnation under the heel is higher so that's a bit easier to get to that spin point.

The CA gentler sloped spin rocker allows for some movement on the rocker without ending the spin. It was easier to change spin positions and easier to save a bad spin entry. However, it's more difficult to jump off the toe and my landings aren't as smooth. The first time I was on this blade again after the MK Pro I noticed the lower heel height of the skate due to the lower stantion. The lower stantion also contributes to making it more difficult to jump off the toe.

If you're in a high heeled boot like the Edea or Jackson Fusion line and have issues with the high heel like leaning forward or spinning too far forward, considering the stantion height might be advised.

So, If you're a strong spinner with solid spin positions, you might really like the MK Pro.

Ultimately, I returned to the CA, because I am not a strong spinner, and I was super frustrated not being able to correct my spins. I also had a much harder time in a sit spin on the MK Pro. The first day back on the CA my sit was all the way down and I learner 3 new positions. I do really miss jumping off the MK Pro though. I have to remind myself to really jump off my toe, and my landings kind of stink as I have a harder time landing on my toe also. But that ultimately bothers me much less than being frustrated with spinning, which I don't overly enjoy anyway.

I’m not a strong spinner at all, it’s definitely the worst aspect of my skating. On my CA blades I constantly end up too far forward and end up on my toepick. My spins make a horrible sound haha. That’s why I was hoping maybe the MK pro would be a little better. If you have to spin further forward that’s probably good for me since I apparently do that anyway.
 

Sam L

Medalist
Joined
Mar 23, 2014
I’m not a strong spinner at all, it’s definitely the worst aspect of my skating. On my CA blades I constantly end up too far forward and end up on my toepick. My spins make a horrible sound haha. That’s why I was hoping maybe the MK pro would be a little better. If you have to spin further forward that’s probably good for me since I apparently do that anyway.

It might be a technique issue. If it is, don't change blades to fix a technique issue because it won't. Are your boots properly fitted? Right size etc...? I switched to Phantom which has a rounder and far better spin rocker than the CA which I hated. I have not used MK pros or 12 inch spin rockers.
 
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