Stripped screw heads and a crooked screw

[spinningdancer]

Accidentally posted this in another forum, and I don't know how to delete, so please forgive the double posting. This seems like it's the actual correct place to ask my question though.

I have boots and blades that are still quite new. I took the boots to be stretched, and since I was there, also asked the skate tech (someone I've worked with for several years, and who is very reputable, and extremely experienced with figure skates), if they could also try getting the blade flush with the sole of the boot, since when they previously mounted it, part of the sole plate wasn't quite flush. They said sure, and said while they might not be able to get it completely flush, they should be able to get it closer to being flush by adding an additional screw.

Got my skates back, didn't look too closely at what they did, and went skating. Felt fine skating, until I went to grab my blade. Luckily, I was wearing gloves, but I felt my hand brush against something very rough and sharp that wasn't there before. When I got off the ice, I noticed that several of the screw heads looked as though they were stripped. They were not like this before. Also, one of the screws is now entering the sole of the boot at an angle. The blade is not loose, but I am a bit concerned about what happened. My skate tech is a few hours away, so I can't just go back to them, but before I bring this up with the tech, is this something I should be concerned about, or should I let it slide?

 

[tstop4me]

To pull the sole plate of the blade closer to the sole of the boot, the tech probably further tightened the existing screws, as well as installing an additional screw. Sounds like he overtightened the screws and stripped the heads, leaving sharp burrs on the heads. This can happen if the tech uses a regular manual screwdriver, but more commonly if the tech uses a screwdriver bit attachment on a power drill. At the very least, the burrs should be removed with a fine file; otherwise, you can get nasty cuts when grabbing your blade or wiping off your blades (they will also snag your wiper towel). If the heads are severely stripped (can't tell without inspecting them), you may have problems tightening the screws later should they become loose, or removing the screws later should you need to adjust the blade or replace the blade [but a good tech will know how to deal with these problems; so there's no permanent harm].

From your description, it's the new additional screw that's crooked? Is that correct? Whether that's a problem or not depends on many factors. But it does place excess shear stress on the screw, making it more at risk to snap. You didn't say what level you're at. But if you're practicing a lot of jumps, you should have that screw replaced. If that one screw snaps, your blade will likely be OK, but part of the screw will land on the ice, posing a tripping hazard for you and other skaters.

 

[spinningdancer]

To pull the sole plate of the blade closer to the sole of the boot, the tech probably further tightened the existing screws, as well as installing an additional screw. Sounds like he overtightened the screws and stripped the heads, leaving sharp burrs on the heads. This can happen if the tech uses a regular manual screwdriver, but more commonly if the tech uses a screwdriver bit attachment on a power drill. At the very least, the burrs should be removed with a fine file; otherwise, you can get nasty cuts when grabbing your blade or wiping off your blades (they will also snag your wiper towel). If the heads are severely stripped (can't tell without inspecting them), you may have problems tightening the screws later should they become loose, or removing the screws later should you need to adjust the blade or replace the blade [but a good tech will know how to deal with these problems; so there's no permanent harm].

From your description, it's the new additional screw that's crooked? Is that correct? Whether that's a problem or not depends on many factors. But it does place excess shear stress on the screw, making it more at risk to snap. You didn't say what level you're at. But if you're practicing a lot of jumps, you should have that screw replaced. If that one screw snaps, your blade will likely be OK, but part of the screw will land on the ice, posing a tripping hazard for you and other skaters.

The screw that's crooked is actually one of the screws that was already there, not the new screw. It's one of the screws in the temporary mount hole, and it appears my tech pulled that screw to the opposite side of where it used to be (I did not ask them to do this, and the permanent screws were already inserted). It's one of the heel plate screws. As far as what level I'm at, I only do singles these days, but I still skate with quite a bit of power, and passed my Senior tests in my "heyday," so even when I land singles, I land with quite a bit of force. At this point, I've just had problem after problem with this pair of boots, and I'm getting tempted to just take the blade off and buy a new, different brand of boots.

 

[Minz]

As someone who frequently works with screws (not in skates), if you need to remove a stripped screw, try a a slightly larger screw bit and/or a rubber band.

(Disclaimer: you probably know more than I do, so I’m not saying to try/not to try anything. But if you decide to remove the screws yourself, try a rubber band.)

 

[spinningdancer]

As someone who frequently works with screws (not in skates), if you need to remove a stripped screw, try a a slightly larger screw bit and/or a rubber band.

(Disclaimer: you probably know more than I do, so I’m not saying to try/not to try anything. But if you decide to remove the screws yourself, try a rubber band.)

What is the rubber band method? I have a stripped screw on an old lighting fixture on my front porch, and we haven't been able to remove the screw to change the light bulb. Would love to get that thing out.

 

[Minz]

What is the rubber band method? I have a stripped screw on an old lighting fixture on my front porch, and we haven't been able to remove the screw to change the light bulb. Would love to get that thing out.

Take one of these things:

Put the flat part over the screw, then just use the screwdriver like normal. The rubber band provides an extra grip for the screw.
It should look like this:

It really does help!

(Not my images BTW)

 

[Query]

Wow, I never heard of the rubber band method before. Cool idea. Cheap too.

If you aren't confident, let your skate tech do it. While you can run into many problems from not tightening a screw enough, you can also easily over-tighten a screw in leather, and other soft materials, and strip the hole. Also, if you don't create new holes that are at right angles to the surface, you won't get a good clean interface, and stuff will shift, and the blades will eventually warp. In fact, you are likely starting to warp your blade now.

I've used more sophisticated methods, advocated to me by people in the trades, like a tap and die kit. Essentially you can pound in a new screw head. If it's too far gone, you can create a new inner screw thread, that you can screw another screw into. There are also much faster methods in which you use a power drill to power out the screw using specialized "screw extractor" tools that bite into the screw. All of these cost money if you don't already have the tools.

Here is someone else's web link: https://www.thespruce.com/ways-to-remove-a-stripped-screw-5078928 - and it does mention the rubber bands. Maybe one of the other methods listed there will help too - e.g., if you already have a pliers.

If the screws are tilting, that means there is sideways twisting force on them. As mentioned, it may eventually warp your blade. Also, there is a possibility of injury, if the blade works its way loose. So it should be fixed.

There are several ways to repair the hole, that is also stripping. If you are, you could fill it with Shoe Goo - that that takes close to a couple days to fully set at room temperature (hotter is faster, but I don't know the details or if there are potential problems). I've seen one expert skate tech sand down a wooden dowel to the point he could pound it in. That was very fast, and created an excellent base on which to drill a new slightly offset hole - but he had a lot of experience. (Some people do the same with strips of leather - I don't know exactly how.) Remember to drill a smaller diameter pilot hole before inserting the screw. Some people just use a larger diameter screw, which is also fast. E.g., Bill_S in another skating forum advocates switching from #6 screws to #8 screws.

BTW, screw heads often strip because you used the wrong size screwdriver, or you use a screwdriver that is made of soft metal. Or you don't press down hard enough when using a Phillips head screwdriver. (You should always press down hard, on screwdrivers, especially Phillips heads, so they don't slip, and so the hole you are screwing into doesn't strip either. I really really hate Phillips head screws and screwdrivers. Their only advantage is that it saves you a second or so inserting the screwdriver, and they cause no end of problems.) Stripping a head potentially damages both the screw head and the screwdriver.

Hope that helps.

 

[spinningdancer]

Wow, I never heard of the rubber band method before. Cool idea. Cheap too.

If you aren't confident, let your skate tech do it. While you can run into many problems from not tightening a screw enough, you can also easily over-tighten a screw in leather, and other soft materials, and strip the hole. Also, if you don't create new holes that are at right angles to the surface, you won't get a good clean interface, and stuff will shift, and the blades will eventually warp. In fact, you are likely starting to warp your blade now.

I've used more sophisticated methods, advocated to me by people in the trades, like a tap and die kit. Essentially you can pound in a new screw head. If it's too far gone, you can create a new inner screw thread, that you can screw another screw into. There are also much faster methods in which you use a power drill to power out the screw using specialized "screw extractor" tools that bite into the screw. All of these cost money if you don't already have the tools.

Here is someone else's web link: https://www.thespruce.com/ways-to-remove-a-stripped-screw-5078928 - and it does mention the rubber bands. Maybe one of the other methods listed there will help too - e.g., if you already have a pliers.

If the screws are tilting, that means there is sideways twisting force on them. As mentioned, it may eventually warp your blade. Also, there is a possibility of injury, if the blade works its way loose. So it should be fixed.

There are several ways to repair the hole, that is also stripping. If you are, you could fill it with Shoe Goo - that that takes close to a couple days to fully set at room temperature (hotter is faster, but I don't know the details or if there are potential problems). I've seen one expert skate tech sand down a wooden dowel to the point he could pound it in. That was very fast, and created an excellent base on which to drill a new slightly offset hole - but he had a lot of experience. (Some people do the same with strips of leather - I don't know exactly how.) Remember to drill a smaller diameter pilot hole before inserting the screw. Some people just use a larger diameter screw, which is also fast. E.g., Bill_S in another skating forum advocates switching from #6 screws to #8 screws.

BTW, screw heads often strip because you used the wrong size screwdriver, or you use a screwdriver that is made of soft metal. Or you don't press down hard enough when using a Phillips head screwdriver. (You should always press down hard, on screwdrivers, especially Phillips heads, so they don't slip, and so the hole you are screwing into doesn't strip either. I really really hate Phillips head screws and screwdrivers. Their only advantage is that it saves you a second or so inserting the screwdriver, and they cause no end of problems.) Stripping a head potentially damages both the screw head and the screwdriver.

Hope that helps.

Thanks, this is helpful, and yes, blade warping is very much my concern. I really wish I had just left the blades how they were, even though there was a larger gap between the back of the sole plate and the boot sole (there still is a gap, it's just a little smaller). Unfortunately, I have no experience mounting blades myself, and wouldn't want to make things worse by messing with the blade and removing screws, and there are no skate techs near me, so trying to fix this would mean taking an overnight weekend trip - and we just came back from the trip where this was done to the blade. I honestly lost a lot of confidence in my tech after this incident. I feel like if they really knew what they were doing, they'd have told me just to leave the blade as it was. I think that if it's left as is, it is highly likely it will warp. Hopefully it can wait a few months until I'm able to take another trip to the skate tech. If they remove a couple screws, and revert things to how they were before I had them try and get the blade closer to being flush with the sole, do you know if they can re-mount the blade in the same position? I know that would likely require reusing some holes, as currently my sole plate has all the screws in it, and my heel plate has 3 out of 4 screws in it. Ughhhh I just wish this hadn't happened. Ever since I got these boots, it's just been one thing after another.

 

[Query]

I'm not a real expert, and I haven't seen your boots, so I'm reluctant to give you a definite answer.

There is always a risk doing things yourself. And to some extent, in letting someone else do it, but you often have to hope that an experienced reputable tech will (usually) do it right. But you shouldn't completely lose confidence in the tech, based on one small mistake. There is always some guesswork involved. Give them a chance to try to fix it.

Also, I may have misread your post. When you say they weren't completely flush, do you mean horizontally or vertically?

If vertically, people typically deal with that by a shim - a thin piece of material - between the screw and the sole of the boot. That way there is no big force tending to pull the screws out. In another forum, I think it was tstop4me who suggested that a washer (rubber?) would work as a shim, though I have personally only used leather, and more recently, one or a few layers of cloth athletic tape.

It is possible a vertical warp of the blade baseplate isn't as big a deal as a horizontal warp. But I would fix this as soon as possible. Once holes start to strip, they can get worse fairly quickly. If your tech is good enough to fix stripped holes, it's mostly an issue of fall and/or injury prevention rather than permanent irreparable damage to the skates - but an injury to yourself may be harder to fix than to the boots.

 

[spinningdancer]

I'm not a real expert, and I haven't seen your boots, so I'm reluctant to give you a definite answer.

There is always a risk doing things yourself. And to some extent, in letting someone else do it, but you often have to hope that an experienced reputable tech will (usually) do it right. But you shouldn't completely lose confidence in the tech, based on one small mistake. There is always some guesswork involved. Give them a chance to try to fix it.

Also, I may have misread your post. When you say they weren't completely flush, do you mean horizontally or vertically?

If vertically, people typically deal with that by a shim - a thin piece of material - between the screw and the sole of the boot. That way there is no big force tending to pull the screws out. In another forum, I think it was tstop4me who suggested that a washer (rubber?) would work as a shim, though I have personally only used leather, and more recently, one or a few layers of cloth athletic tape.

It is possible a vertical warp of the blade baseplate isn't as big a deal as a horizontal warp. But I would fix this as soon as possible. Once holes start to strip, they can get worse fairly quickly. If your tech is good enough to fix stripped holes, it's mostly an issue of fall and/or injury prevention rather than permanent irreparable damage to the skates - but an injury to yourself may be harder to fix than to the boots.

I'm a little bit confused what the difference between horizontal and vertical is in this situation, but basically, I've realized that due to the shape of the boot sole, that particular blade I am using will never be completely flush, unless the sole of the boot is able to be changed. So I don't really see a point in having the blade's sole plate a millimeter or so closer to be flush when it's still not actually flush. As far as I can remember, the heel plates were both flush prior to having this work done to the skate. Now, one heel plate is no longer flush (there is a gap at the back of the heel plate), which is largely what concerns me that the blade may warp (or may have already). The screws also appear to be under more tension now than they previously were, especially the crooked screw. Thanks for your advice. I think I will try getting the screws that were added removed, since they aren't necessary, and hopefully that will release tension on the blade.

 

[Query]

I think I will try getting the screws that were added removed, since they aren't necessary, and hopefully that will release tension on the blade.

It is easy to remove a screw, if you have a screwdriver that fits the screw head. The only question is whether the other screws would now hold the blade on well enough. If they have started to pull out, maybe not.

BTW, you can change the outsole shape - e.g., by adding tape so the shapes match without tension. You could also sand the outsole to be more flat. But to do that, you have to take out the screws and put them back in, and in putting them back in, if you tighten too little or too much, you could create a stripped hole.

If you posted pictures (including detailed close ups of the screws) of the bottom of your skate, we might be able to guess. You could also send them to your skate tech, and ask for advice.

 

[spinningdancer]

It is easy to remove a screw, if you have a screwdriver that fits the screw head. The only question is whether the other screws would now hold the blade on well enough. If they have started to pull out, maybe not.

BTW, you can change the outsole shape - e.g., by adding tape so the shapes match without tension. You could also sand the outsole to be more flat. But to do that, you have to take out the screws and put them back in, and in putting them back in, if you tighten too little or too much, you could create a stripped hole.

If you posted pictures (including detailed close ups of the screws) of the bottom of your skate, we might be able to guess. You could also send them to your skate tech, and ask for advice.

I suspect all the screws will have to be adjusted if I remove the new screw, since they look like they were all adjusted after the new screw was added. It appears that adding the screw created tension where there wasn't any before, and potentially caused the heel plate of the blade to become misaligned. The new screw is also not the one that is crooked, so removing it won't fix the crooked screw issue, unfortunately. I think I just have to pay shipping fees and send my skates off to have my skate tech remove the new screw and hopefully revert the other screws back to their old positions (not crooked), and plug the hole(s), and hopefully put some new screws in there that aren't stripped at the head while they're at it.