Thoughts on Ashley Wagner | Golden Skate

Thoughts on Ashley Wagner

flying camel

Medalist
Joined
Nov 16, 2005
Well nobody is really talking about the 3rd best junior in the US and World juniors. I think she turns sixteen this year. That make her old enough to compete seniors.

Could the US put her into senior GP events if they want?

Can she break into the top 3 at nationals this year?

What are her strengths & weaknesses?

Does she remind anyone of a former skater we all know?
 
I liked Ashley's junior world LP. Good energy, good height on the jumps (need to check landings more though). But she should take the summer to improve on her spins, spirals, and footwork seq's; they were messy at times. I think she plans to skate senior this fall, and is guaranteed one GP event.

Getting into top 3 at national's is possible but not highly likely. How many thought Rachael Flatt would get into top 3 with her 3-3's this year? But she only came in 5th (maybe 4th if the 3-3 in the SP counted), and I would say that Rachael has overall higher technical difficulty and presentation skills than Ashley (JMO).

She doesn't remind me too much of any great skater, but her choice of music and skating style reminds me of a number of senior ladies at nationals (outside top 5); is Jazz "in"? I'm looking forward to seeing her (and the other juniors, Caro & Mirai) break out of their favorite kinds of music and try something new.

One thing I really like about Ashley is she seems such a nice gal. She said such nice, mature, modest things about Caro & Mirai at nationals. Not that this quality has much to do with competition results. ;)
 
Rachael Flatt did very well to finish 5th at US Nationals, considering that she was only 14 and had had almost no international experience. I think she may have a real shot at the podium this year, if she can increase her speed. The lack of speed kept her back in 2007, I think.
 
Ashley actually reminds me a lot of Emily Hughes...athletic, bendy skaters with a lot of energy but less refinement. Ashley has much more secure jumps though :P

She's actually my favorite out of the current crop of juniors. She seems to be largely over the puberty monster, and judging from the spring and flow in her jumps, she could get a triple-triple.
 
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I feel like she could probably land a 3F-3R if not next year, then the year after that. I really like her and I hope she gets far.
 
considering she represented Alaska until very recently I've been interested in her skating (granted in a very unfamiliar way lol) since 05... she has spunk... and unfortunately she is overshadowed, but I think she's got a great future ahead of her!
 
Rachael Flat now has the experience including a controversial underrotation that will put her on the podium this year.

Ashley continues to be a skater to watch.

Aside from Kimmie's most probable win, I don't see any probable silver and bronze medals locked into the Ladies. I'm assuming that Mirai and Caroline are going for another whirl at Juniors. Until they do, I think Sasha should give this Nats a whirl because when Mirai and Caroline come into Seniors, it will be a whole new ball game.

Joe
 
Rachael Flat now has the experience including a controversial underrotation that will put her on the podium this year.

Ashley continues to be a skater to watch.

Aside from Kimmie's most probable win, I don't see any probable silver and bronze medals locked into the Ladies. I'm assuming that Mirai and Caroline are going for another whirl at Juniors. Until they do, I think Sasha should give this Nats a whirl because when Mirai and Caroline come into Seniors, it will be a whole new ball game.

Joe

Not sure about Mirai, but Caroline said she plans to move up to seniors next year.
 
I'll cheer for Alissa Czisny, no doubt! She is the only one who impresses me artistically speaking!

About Wagner, she reminds me of Emily Hughes. Her energetic style is a plus, but she has to choose music that suits her.
 
Ashley Wagner debuted a new Senior short program at the Cherry Blossom club competition in Alexandria, VA this past Friday to a dramatic classical piece, Saint-Saens' "Henry VIII" (previously used by Susanna Poykio), and landed 3lz-2t(downgraded due to toe axel), 2a, 3f (fall). She scored 45.32 points. It was a mature performance and she was loudly supported by her home club members (Washington FSC) in the audience.

Wagner's new Senior FS is to "Por una Cabeza" (famous tango from "Scent of a Woman") and she scored 97.52 points on Saturday night. Jumps were: 3lz-2lp, 2a, 3s, 3lp, 3f(fall), 3t, 3lz(2-fted). She received level 4 on her spiral sequence and on 3 of her spins and also had a level 3 layback. This technically was Ashley's second senior level club competition - she finished 2nd at Mid-Atlantics in NYC last September - and she looks primed and ready for the start of a new season (it was impressive to see her competing so early in the year!).
 
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I can't comment on Ashley's technical skating skills, but she was very enjoyable to watch live at the Marshalls event. Too bad her program "Steam Heat" was chacked from the ABC broadcast (along with a number of other skaters in the showcase). :mad: :frown: :no:
 
Ashley definitely gets a lot of height on her jumps, but not the fastest rotations, and the landings aren't always checked, so sometimes they look a bit wonky. Both her power and slow rotation may have to do with having a taller, more mature body-type (compared to the other juniors). I think if she keeps her current body-type, and not let it get any fuller, then she has a good chance of getting a 3-3 -- and she should hurry too, all the skaters with secure 3-3's got theirs by 15 (Mao, Yu-Nah, Tara, Sarah, Rachael, Kimmie -- not sure how "secure" hers are).

I guess Mirai will not want to stay in Junior Nationals next year, having beaten both Caro & Ashley this year, and both of those are going to senior's? Ashley didn't beat either this year, can she beat both next year at national's? I guess it all depends on who gets the 3-3 first. Both Caro & Mirai have said in interviews that they're working on them, I think they have good chances -- Caro needs more height, Mirai faster rotations, and they're only 13! Sure, Mao had hers at 11 or some ungodly age, but she's not human. :p Yu-nah didn't debut hers until 15, I think, and IMO she has the most beautiful 3-3's, great height, distance, flow, rotations, entrances, landings... I can't wait for the US juniors to get their 3-3's and go up against the big guns!
 
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Wagner's new Senior FS is to "Por una Cabeza" (famous tango from "Scent of a Woman") and she scored 97.52 points on Saturday night. Jumps were: 3lz-2lp, 2a, 3s, 3lp, 3f(fall), 3t, 3lz(2-fted). She received level 4 on her spiral sequence and on 3 of her spins and also had a level 3 layback. This technically was Ashley's second senior level club competition - she finished 2nd at Mid-Atlantics in NYC last September - and she looks primed and ready for the start of a new season (it was impressive to see her competing so early in the year!).

I LOVE that music!

thanks for the update, Sylvia! :)
 
feraina - a little off topic. What is jump rotations too slow mean? The question about any jump rotations would be are they complete? Nothing so beautiful in the dance (skate) world are jumps with slow rotations. Kevin van der Perren does exactly that, and the effect is breathtaking to see him defy gravity. Hamil's delayed axel was another awesome jump. Slow air rotations are very difficult.

I think you may have meant that as corrective criticism, which could be helpful.

As to the term 'having beaten"' Does that mean forever?

I'm not trying to be nasty, but I am picky about skaters improving and have another go at a competition. IMO, no skater ALWAYS skates his/her best, and the results only show the best in that particular competition.

Joe
 
"too slow" -- I was actually thinking that it's interesting how some skaters have high jumps but relatively slow rotations (Sebestyen comes to mind); and yes, it's very impressive when they complete the rotations because you can see the jump in its full glory, but sometimes they don't manage. Then there are some skaters like Caroline & Tara who have unremarkable height, but amazingly fast rotations that make you go "Woh, what just happened?" Then you have out-of-this-world jumpers like Mao & Yu-nah, who have both height and angular momentum. :bow:

Ultimately, what counts is that they get all the way around clean, which means low but clean jumps get rewarded more than high ones w/ messy landings. Ashley double-footed (?) her 3lutz in the junior world LP, or if she didn't, she pulled her foot out just in time. Mirai also had lots of wobbly landings at junior worlds LP, although maybe that was due to nerves, as she had great jumps in the EX.

Slowly rotated jumps are of course more difficult to land cleanly than fast ones, so kudos to you if you can do it; but not a good strategy if it brings down your clean-landing %.

"having beaten" -- well, skating is full of surprises, but if you've lost to someone repeatedly without having made obvious mistakes yourself, then your chances are not looking good (not impossible, just less good than if you beat them every time!).
Of course lots can happen over the summer, no one knows how each of the top 3 juniors will improve. Caro & Mirai have age on their side (sadly, we do master things faster and more easily when we are younger), and Ashley has, some argue, the past-puberty factor on hers. But is the latter really true? Asians generally have smaller physique, and Caucasians are taller and have fuller bodies (on average). How many skaters hit their puberty monster after 15?
 
I've seen enough dancers (and skaters) to emerge in later years with something so remarkably finished and beautiful. I have never seen a teenager to capture that. They will, though, if they stick it out. Oksana's cute imitation impressed a lot of skating fans who never saw Swan Lake on stage. Not me!

Joe
 
Oksana Baiul met her puberty monster head-on in the two years after the Olympics. By the time she was 18, she had grown 4 inches and gained 25 lbs and was no longer a cute little orphan girl.
 
I've seen enough dancers (and skaters) to emerge in later years with something so remarkably finished and beautiful. I have never seen a teenager to capture that.

You don't think Michelle Kwan or Sasha Cohen attained that before turning 20? What about Yu-na Kim & Caroline Zhang? They're not there yet, but at 16 & 13 they're well on their way: the first has great emotional connection with the audience and just needs a little more grace, the latter has amazing grace but needs more emotional connection. I'm especially impressed by Yu-Na's short program, which is so full of attitude and spunk -- when interviewed in person, she always seems so soft and timid and shy, so it impresses me to see her skate like that.
 
some people just have issues with teens ;) they're just *too immature*

but I've met just as many 'older adults' that are the same way...


and I think teh same can be said for skaters... ;)

anyway back on topic - Ashley rocks my socks! :rock: can't wait to see her skating next season! :rock:
 
when interviewed in person, [Yu Na] always seems so soft and timid and shy, so it impresses me to see her skate like that.
A while back, I expected her to be shy and depressed because I had pegged her as someone who only competed because of her mom and federation. However, she came across in her pre-Worlds interview as possessing a quiet but remarkable inner strength. The only quote I remember is "skating in Korea is popular because of me" - modest, huh? - but in general I found her to be one heck of a strong, mature, focused young lady. No giggles here. Quiet, yes - timid, no!

Back on topic - as you can see from my signature I'm one of Ashley's admirers. I don't find her to be like Emily at all. While she has a similar attractive energy, she has better line and musicality, and I think she will do lyrical better than Em - and I hope to see that from her this year.
 
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