My best guess is probably given the covid situation at least the first alternate for each discipline should travel to Beijing to be on the safe side.
US Olympic Team Announced
- Thread starter Minz
- Start date
My best guess is probably given the covid situation at least the first alternate for each discipline should travel to Beijing to be on the safe side.
- Joined
- Oct 23, 2005
4CC and Bavarian are the same weekend. Unfortunately there is nowhere she could get the minimums for 4CC.
But I agree she should compete as much as possible. Minimums are always good to have.
- Joined
- Jun 21, 2003
I think that the USFSA still holds out hope that Alysa has a higher "ceiling" than any other U.S. lady. It might not work out the way we hope, but Alysa does have a (sometime-y) triple Axel and solid expectations for a couple of trip[le-triples. Anyway, by getting third in the short program before being forced to withdraw through no fault of her own, sher took the burden off the Selection Committee. And after all, it was Alysa's performance at the qualifying event that secured the third U,S, ladies' Olympic spot.
I assume that Lindsey Thorngren was not assigned to Four Continents in irder to protect the Olympic first alternate as nuch as possible in these uncertain times. Maybe Lindsey made the choice herself to skip 4CC.
I assume that Lindsey Thorngren was not assigned to Four Continents in irder to protect the Olympic first alternate as nuch as possible in these uncertain times. Maybe Lindsey made the choice herself to skip 4CC.
- Joined
- Aug 12, 2014
International experience and body of work perhaps? 5th at both challenger series this season. Saved three spots with Alysa Liu at Junior Worlds right before covid19 hit. Although placed 10th at Skate America it was a good showing and, competition was one of the hardest. Withdrew from France due to medical reasons which is not used against her. I really don't understand why people have such a problem with Starr? Because she chooses to skate to the beat of her own drum? Or is it because she doesn't have a Lutz in her programs? Most girls shelf life is between the ages of 14-17. Many don't make it pass puberty to continue in this sport. Don't be so quick to throw away a gem because they are not doing what the 15 year olds are. She was once 15 and had two triple triple combos as well. Have more respect for the veterans that battle the injuries and body changes that takes a different toll than an adolesence body. And my question to you is what is defined as improving?
- Joined
- Feb 17, 2010
There has to be some selection criteria, and what they developed seems pretty reasonable. Alysa, hands down, had the best season of the women so it's sensible that she'd get placed in a higher tier. While 219 may not be enough for a medal at the Olympics, it would have been at last year's Worlds in what was a similar field (i.e. two of the medalists are competing at the Olympics), and you never know what will happen at future events or who will even be able to participate given that everyone is getting omicron.
- Joined
- Feb 17, 2010
Interestingly, one article I read framed Alysa's selection as a substitution for Isabeau because she isn't old enough to go to Beijing.
- Joined
- Mar 7, 2015
but higher tier or not.. that means nothing... the USA have 3 spots for the o games and the 3 right girls are going.
- Joined
- Dec 28, 2006
- Joined
- Sep 25, 2021
Even you disagree the selection criteria, Alysa is still the "only" choice for the team anyway.
Under current criteria:
Group 2: Alysa
Group 3: Mariah, Karen, Isabeau
Group 4: Amber, Lindsay, Gabriella
Let's say there is a flaw in selection criteria and take out her Lombardia score, Alysa still in group 3.
Group 3: Mariah, Karen, Isabeau, Alysa.
Isabeau is not age eligible for Olympics. Alysa should still be picked because she is in group 3. When you say "USFS should re-think this criteria in the future.", do you have a better thought?
Besides, Alysa outperforms both Karen and Mariah when they compete head to head this season.
Alysa beats Mariah at Cranberry cup this season. Alysa 205.74 vs Mariah 179.42
Alysa beats Karen at Skate Canada GP this season: Alysa 206.53 vs Karen 183.41
Alysa's lowest score for this season is NHK GP 202.9. Alysa is well know for consistency and she has the highest average scores for this season. Her Olympics spot is completely justified.
Actually, USFSA thoughtful selection criteria is the main reason why US women has 3 Olympics spots. Karen was sent to World based on her BOW and it turns out.....that was a brilliant choice!
Last edited:
I disagree with the bolded part. I don't think Alysa would have gotten close to 219 at Worlds if you could have magically put her Lombardia programs on the ice in Stockholm. And she shouldn't. She doesn't have the technical elements or presentation quality of the Russian women. What you're saying is highlighting my problem with the selection criteria: scores aren't the same everywhere, and I don't think it makes sense to rank skaters based on scoring potential when you're only using one outlier event (Lombardia in Alysa's case) and comparing it to a completely different event where the scoring was much less generous.
I agree that Alysa has been the most consistent of the US women this season. She's competed the most, and she's gotten over 200 the most. And she probably has the highest ceiling given her potential to do 8 triples in a free skate. But Mariah's Rostelecom score beats all of Alysa's scores except the Lombardia one.
I think the higher tier meant nothing in this case because Mariah and Karen were already going to go based on their Nationals results, and general body of work. Alysa was the one who needed to petition onto the team. But you could imagine a scenario where the tiers might've mattered more. For example, what if Thorngren had won, Mariah had been second, and Karen had been third. Should Alysa have bumped Karen based on the tiers? I don't think so, but she might've, if things had come to that. Or, what if Tennell had been healthy enough to compete? Mariah's first, Karen is second, and Bradie is third. Should Alysa have taken Bradie's spot in Beijing? Again, I don't think so.
All I'm saying is that the tier system could have produced an unfair result even if it didn't in this case. The USFS sent the right three people based on who was age eligible and healthy to compete.
Yes, I agree with this. The USFS picked the right team under the circumstances.
If Lindsey won that would have meant Mariah and Karen bomb big time cause there was no way the judges would have given her the title unless they had to.
If Bradie finished third behind Mariah and Karen that meant that she lost to Mariah who didn't have a triple triple. Also Bradie would have been in a lower priority group than Alysa because she didn't compete this season.
In both cases above the selection committee would have been justified assigning Alysa for the third spot.
Last edited:
Well, the US Ladies are going to have to perform exceptionally well at the upcoming big events. I see them actually losing their three spots for next year in regards to Senior Ladies after watching Korean Nationals. Even Junior Worlds is going to be tough for Levito, Thorngren and Seo to retain three spots.
- Joined
- Mar 7, 2015
So why worrying about what didn't happen? Life is too short for that
- Joined
- Dec 5, 2015
To quote the great Mark Twain, “I've had a lot of worries in my life, most of which never happened.”So why worrying about what didn't happen? Life is too short for that
- Joined
- Feb 24, 2012
Well I am sure Alysa is sleeping better. But what we haven't thought about is how bad is her covid and how will it affect her training if at all (asymptomatic?).
- Joined
- Mar 21, 2018
I´m the only one finding it a bit weird that they are gambling on that it´s safe enough to send the 3rd alternate to 4CC? Under normal circumstances I would not have any doubts, but they already have Alysa and Amber with positive covid test who needs to be cleared in time (PCR test must be negative 2 weeks prior) and who will also miss important training time. I hate to say this, but Karen and Mariah are still at risk of getting covid, it´s not only in Nashville but US has an all time high surge now with cases so they need to be very careful. I also think Mariah and her Team are not taking the mask game seriously, they need to game up and use better mask, did Mariah really use a matching mask to her dress? I certainly hope she had something underneath it. Raf and Adam both not wearing a K95 mask in K&C, as a coaching team with several students they should be more careful because they are close contacts to a lot of skaters.
I think they need all 3 alternatives to be ready and covid-free. Since Amber is symptomatic she might not even be cleared or ready given the timeline, so basically one should think of Gabbie as the second alternate.
Can they name more alternates? When is the last chance of submitting the team and all alternates to Beijing? Can they wait until 4CC and Bavarian Open when they perhaps know more about the situation and who is cleared of covid?
Going to 4CC is risky business as well, so the team there might not be possible to replace for OG in case of emergency.
I see USA has one spot TBD at Bavarian Open - they should really use it to have one more skater with the minimum. I guess they will either send Kate or Gracie. I think it´s depends on how they are thinking - if they use the spot to have a back up for OG in worst case, is better to send Gracie who has international experience and better PCS marks, but most likely they will send Kate if the goal is sending her to GP next season and start thinking more about the next generation. All though, Kate could still go to other competitions later to get the minimum, but I dunno how USFS is thinking.
I think they need all 3 alternatives to be ready and covid-free. Since Amber is symptomatic she might not even be cleared or ready given the timeline, so basically one should think of Gabbie as the second alternate.
Can they name more alternates? When is the last chance of submitting the team and all alternates to Beijing? Can they wait until 4CC and Bavarian Open when they perhaps know more about the situation and who is cleared of covid?
Going to 4CC is risky business as well, so the team there might not be possible to replace for OG in case of emergency.
I see USA has one spot TBD at Bavarian Open - they should really use it to have one more skater with the minimum. I guess they will either send Kate or Gracie. I think it´s depends on how they are thinking - if they use the spot to have a back up for OG in worst case, is better to send Gracie who has international experience and better PCS marks, but most likely they will send Kate if the goal is sending her to GP next season and start thinking more about the next generation. All though, Kate could still go to other competitions later to get the minimum, but I dunno how USFS is thinking.
Last edited:
- Joined
- Mar 28, 2016
I agree. I’d have a list of alternates for our alternates at this point. This virus is insane and China isn’t budging on their requirements, so we can’t just cross our fingers that everyone will be lucky and test negative in time. Especially after the superspreader event that was USNats.
A B-team of alternates would likely be Audrey Shin, Hanna Harrell, and Starr Andrews, right? I don’t think Kate has the minimums as a senior.
A B-team of alternates would likely be Audrey Shin, Hanna Harrell, and Starr Andrews, right? I don’t think Kate has the minimums as a senior.
- Joined
- Mar 21, 2018
As far as I understand they can send a skater to Bavarian Open which will be the last chance to get minimums before Olympics. The entries list for Bavarian Open is out and USA is listed with TBD, so if they want they can send a skater, I think it was part of their plan to have it as back up for last minute minimums. It´s the same weekend as 4CC. So they could send either Kate or Gracie to get the minimums to have more alternates, if they like.
Problem with B-team is that they are on higher risk because they travel so close to the OG, that is why they don´t have the same team this year at 4CC. Except Hanna is only alternate though. I think it would be wiser if they didn´t send Gabbie to 4CC and let Hanna skate there instead. All alternates for OG should behave like they are going to Beijing and not take any risk.
Problem with B-team is that they are on higher risk because they travel so close to the OG, that is why they don´t have the same team this year at 4CC. Except Hanna is only alternate though. I think it would be wiser if they didn´t send Gabbie to 4CC and let Hanna skate there instead. All alternates for OG should behave like they are going to Beijing and not take any risk.
Last edited:
I get that her results were not very good this season but representation is important. And with Mae Berenice Meite struggling this season, Starr is the only other black women's figure skater on the international scene. Also, Starr scores very similarly/slightly better internationally than Hanna and Kate.Starr Andrews sent to 4CC;
I really wish someone else would get a chance. Maybe, it has to do with technical minimums.
- Joined
- Nov 24, 2006
Perhaps this is Starr's final year? Maybe the USFS just wanted to send her off on one final plum assignment because they remember that viral video of hers as a child? Who even knows what they are thinking. I still don't understand how she kept getting such great assignments when her skating regressed, and regressed, and regressed. So, Four Continents it is!!!! Lucky girl!!
Last edited:
